Dutch Study Group

An area with study groups for various languages. Group members help each other, share resources and experience. Study groups are permanent but the members rotate and change.
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Elsa Maria
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Languages: English (N), Danish (intermediate). Various stages of beginner: Dutch, Latin, Spanish, and Polish
Language Log: https://forum.language-learners.org/vie ... =15&t=6009
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Re: Dutch Study Group

Postby Elsa Maria » Fri Feb 15, 2019 7:45 pm

Thank you tomuus and PeterM for the interesting comments about the proliferation of English. Lots to ponder there.

Kat wrote:
Elsa Maria wrote:Are proper names capitalized in a manner similar to English?


German and Dutch are similar in many ways. Both have a formal and an informal way of adressing someone, so it came as a big surprise to me that the usage of those forms differs quite a bit.

Yes, I find these comparisons fascinating. I am not a native speaker of Danish, but I did live there. I never heard the formal pronouns used, and hearing them in older TV shows like Matador catches me off guard. Out of curiosity, I just looked at three Danish letters that I have on file. They were from an insurance company, a bank, and a government agency. Even those formal letters to me addressed me with the informal pronoun.
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PeterMollenburg
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Languages: English (N), French (B2-certified), Dutch (High A2?), Spanish (~A1), German (long-forgotten 99%)
Language Log: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=784
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Re: Dutch Study Group

Postby PeterMollenburg » Sat Feb 16, 2019 6:17 am

Yesterday I did more Dutch than I'd usually do lately, which has often been either nothing at all or about 30 minutes. Yesterday I did an hour, finishing of a review of Pimsleur, which I find too easy, which is why I chose a speedy review. I listened to (and shadowed) the conversations at the start of each unit a couple of times then would move straight on to the reading lesson and follow along. Even lesson 30 was really very easy. (I completed all this stuff 9 or 10 years ago). Michel Thomas is more challenging, but I've recently completed that too (including the advanced level). So, it's on to Glossika, as the main Dutch activities I'm managing to do lately are audio programs while driving.

Anyway, after doing an hour, it must've seeped in quite a bit, as last night I was dreaming in Dutch. I can't recall the details, but I know I was having conversations in Dutch again.

I'm falling in love again with Dutch. It's such a beautiful and fascinating language, and I find that I am just completely enamoured with the Netherlands again. I love Dutch equally as I love French, but they feel is sooo different, which is to be expected, I guess. Back to google maps as I zoom in on the Dutch towns and countryside... :) Does anyone else do this? I love getting on there and zooming in on places, exploring Europe from here.
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tommus
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Re: Dutch Study Group

Postby tommus » Sat Feb 16, 2019 6:55 pm

Dutch reading training website

This website is targeted at school children but it has lots of very good basic word lists including articles (de, het). And it has a very good section with thematic wordlists with easy explanations (check out the 5 sections under "Staal". Other parts of the website have lots of exercises if you like that sort of thing.

Dutch reading training website

Look at the various sections in this part of the website

woordpakketten van veel gebruikte methodes - word packages of often used methods
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Dutch
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Kat
Orange Belt
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Languages: German (N), English (advanced), Dutch (intermediate)
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Re: Dutch Study Group

Postby Kat » Mon Feb 18, 2019 7:20 pm

tommus wrote:The Green Booklet (Groene Boekje) is produced and published by the Dutch Language Union (Nederlandse Taalunie). It is "a list of words in the correct official spelling of the Dutch language" (updated every 10 years)...


Some humorous background info on the development of standardized Dutch spelling and "het groene boekje".



The video is part of a series called Clipphanger which contains hundreds of such videos on different topics. I generally recommend them.

PS: A transcript is available here. Klick "toon letterlijke text" to see it.
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Transcription challenge: 1. episode of De Ijzeren Eeuw (The Iron Century)
Minutes: 6 / 43

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tommus
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Re: Dutch Study Group

Postby tommus » Sun Feb 24, 2019 7:46 pm

Two good Dutch audio books with matching Dutch Kobo e-books. The Day of the Jackal and Sapiens.

If you like reading along with the audio books, here are two that match exactly. There are versions in other languages but I have not tried them. Here is where I bought these two audio books and the two e-books.

MP3 Audio books

https://www.luisterrijk.nl/luisterboek/5773/de-dag-van-de-jakhals

https://www.luisterrijk.nl/luisterboek/5731/sapiens?ac=20190223

Kobo e-books

https://www.kobo.com/ca/nl/ebook/de-dag-van-de-jakhals

https://www.kobo.com/ca/nl/ebook/sapiens-1

All four have previews.
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Dutch
40 Boeken
● 35 Ned. Videos
● 370 Univ-Nederland
: 25 / 40
: 35 / 35
: 180 / 370
● 730 Video Nieuws
● 104 Skype NL Chats
● 730 Tekst Nieuws
: 730 / 730
: 82 / 104
: 730 / 730

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Kat
Orange Belt
Posts: 138
Joined: Sat May 19, 2018 9:33 am
Languages: German (N), English (advanced), Dutch (intermediate)
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Re: Dutch Study Group

Postby Kat » Tue Feb 26, 2019 2:33 pm

Ee’m zitten. Doen wij graag in Groningen. We hebben ze nooit geteld, maar we durven met gemak te zeggen dat er in de binnenstad een paar honderd terrasjes zijn.


Can anyone make sense of the shortened form at the beginning of the sentence? Help would be appreciated.
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Transcription challenge: 1. episode of De Ijzeren Eeuw (The Iron Century)
Minutes: 6 / 43

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tommus
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Re: Dutch Study Group

Postby tommus » Tue Feb 26, 2019 3:25 pm

That is quite a puzzle (Ee’m zitten.)

This is just a guess from a non-Native Dutch and non-native Frisian.

I think the Ee'm might be the Frisian equivalent of "even" in Dutch, which would make the expression mean "Just sit."
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Dutch
40 Boeken
● 35 Ned. Videos
● 370 Univ-Nederland
: 25 / 40
: 35 / 35
: 180 / 370
● 730 Video Nieuws
● 104 Skype NL Chats
● 730 Tekst Nieuws
: 730 / 730
: 82 / 104
: 730 / 730

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tommus
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Location: Kingston, ON, Canada
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Re: Dutch Study Group

Postby tommus » Sun Mar 03, 2019 12:13 pm

Understanding Dutch-language cartoons can be challenging if you are not native Dutch. But Sigmund cartoons seem to be relatively easy to understand.

http://www.sigmund.nl/

You can find a lot more by Googling sigmund cartoons archief.

The current edition (Saturday, 2 March) is about a Dutch language student. The message seems to be quite accurate about the state of studying the Dutch language, not just in the Netherlands, but here on the Forum, or even here in this thread.
2 x
Dutch
40 Boeken
● 35 Ned. Videos
● 370 Univ-Nederland
: 25 / 40
: 35 / 35
: 180 / 370
● 730 Video Nieuws
● 104 Skype NL Chats
● 730 Tekst Nieuws
: 730 / 730
: 82 / 104
: 730 / 730

User avatar
tommus
Blue Belt
Posts: 761
Joined: Sat Jul 04, 2015 3:59 pm
Location: Kingston, ON, Canada
Languages: English (N), French (B2), Dutch (B2), German (A1), Spanish (A1), Esperanto (A1), Mandarin (beginner)
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Re: Dutch Study Group

Postby tommus » Sun Mar 03, 2019 3:13 pm

Thanks to a link provided in another thread by Speakeasy, I found a very useful guide as to which Dutch words are generally "de" words and which are generally "het" words. Look for "De Het Overzicht (Word)" in the free downloads under eResources.

Routledge Intensive Dutch Course

Also by Routledge. I have the books Colloquial Dutch and Colloquial Dutch 2 by Bruce Donaldson. The free downloads of the extensive audio for those two books are available at:

https://www.routledgetextbooks.com/textbooks/colloquial/language/dutch.php
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Dutch
40 Boeken
● 35 Ned. Videos
● 370 Univ-Nederland
: 25 / 40
: 35 / 35
: 180 / 370
● 730 Video Nieuws
● 104 Skype NL Chats
● 730 Tekst Nieuws
: 730 / 730
: 82 / 104
: 730 / 730

User avatar
tommus
Blue Belt
Posts: 761
Joined: Sat Jul 04, 2015 3:59 pm
Location: Kingston, ON, Canada
Languages: English (N), French (B2), Dutch (B2), German (A1), Spanish (A1), Esperanto (A1), Mandarin (beginner)
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Re: Dutch Study Group

Postby tommus » Mon Mar 04, 2019 1:08 pm

Amsterdam Schiphol Airport as a caricature of The Netherlands language situation.

An article appeared today in Neerlandistiek about the language situation at the airport to point out some of the challenges the Dutch language faces there, and in the world in general. The article in Dutch is quite easy to read.

Nieuwe opleiding: BA Schiphol Studies

The title of the article references the recent issue of the discontinuation of the Dutch language degree at the Vrije Universiteit Amsterdam. The article basically says that Schiphol is a microcosm of world languages and could be the subject of language research and a degree called International Schiphol Studies.

From my point-of-view, having lived in the Netherlands for six years and been to Schiphol many times, Schiphol and the Netherlands in general share these characteristics:

1. Many languages are being spoken.
2. Native Dutch speakers are too busy and too impatient to endure your L2 Dutch.
3. Dutch-language books are very expensive.
4. There is every incentive for Dutch speakers to speak English and very little incentive for L2 Dutch speakers to speak Dutch.
5. Dutch natives are bewildered as to why foreigners would want to learn or speak Dutch.
6. The Dutch have to learn to speak English to prosper at the airport and in the world.
7. Foreigners learn a few Dutch travel phrases but soon forget them outside the airport or the country.
8. Most of the signs and announcements are in English.
9. People assume you can speak English.

These comments are not meant as criticisms. But the Dutch, well known for their frankness, will understand these comments as simply the way it is.
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Dutch
40 Boeken
● 35 Ned. Videos
● 370 Univ-Nederland
: 25 / 40
: 35 / 35
: 180 / 370
● 730 Video Nieuws
● 104 Skype NL Chats
● 730 Tekst Nieuws
: 730 / 730
: 82 / 104
: 730 / 730


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