Le groupe français 2016 - 2019 Les Voyageurs

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CompImp
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Re: Le groupe français 2016 - 2019 Les Voyageurs

Postby CompImp » Fri Jan 18, 2019 4:53 pm

zjones wrote:
CompImp wrote:I can't find the information on whether she does or not but i certainly wouldn't pay good money to someone who simply speaks the target language and isn't into pedagogy.


Yeah, but I don't believe that someone needs to have a teaching degree to be a good teacher. If you believe that, it's fine, we disagree. I've had lessons from people who had a Masters in French, English, teaching and linguistics, and they were poor teachers. I've also had lessons from people without any degree and they were amazing. That's why I was asking if anyone else had taken any of her courses. I was looking for advice from someone who has already taken one of Geraldine's courses, not opinions on whether I should or shouldn't pay for content or courses.

:lol: ok.

Yeah, but I don't believe that someone needs to have a teaching degree to be a good teacher.

Me neither. But teachers need more than 'native speaker' to become worth paying for. In my opinion, of course. I'm just wondering on what basis she is touting herself as a teacher. I mean i could teach English to someone and i'm not a native speaker. But where do we draw the line ? I mean, can anyone who can explain language just say they're a teacher ? Doesn't that just cheapen the teaching profession ?

I was looking for advice from someone who has already taken one of Geraldine's courses, not opinions on whether I should or shouldn't pay for content or courses.

Well as i said, if she has no background in linguistics, pedagogy, teacher training or second language acquisition, i'd assume it's the same as her videos - tell you something, explain it to you, you give her money. I'm assuming she isn't a teacher though, she could well be. Like i said i couldn't find the information. When someone's asking for 300+ per year for tutoring i expect they'd be at least qualified in something. I got guitar lessons off a jazz guitar master qualified and registered with the London College of Music for less than that.

Just sayin'.
Last edited by CompImp on Sat Jan 19, 2019 8:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
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MorkTheFiddle
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Re: Le groupe français 2016 - 2019 Les Voyageurs

Postby MorkTheFiddle » Sat Jan 19, 2019 1:17 am

Shouldn’t every language teacher and every language program that wants my money be able to (1) say where it will pick me up and where it will leave me off and (2) provide me with data that show they have and can do such a thing? By number (1) I mean tell me it will take me from A0 to C2, or only from B1 to B2, or just teach me all the ways to say good-bye. By number (2) I mean something like we have taught 100 students in the last 10 years, all of them starting from scratch, and 30 of them have passed the highest level proficiency exams that there are for that language, and here are the records and data to prove that.

Probably some universities, some language schools, the Foreign Service Institute and other schools could provide such data, though I don’t know whether in fact they can or do.

Another source of language learning can be seen by the methods and the progress of polyglots and hyperglots, who can show at least N=1 of successes. Not to pick any favorites from among the several remarkable (nay, astounding!) polyglots here, some of whom have written detailed accounts of their methods in their logs, for free, I can point to non-member Dr. Alexander Arguelles, who can certainly point to himself as a success and who has been extremely open and forthcoming about how he studies languages. For free.

I can’t speak directly to the case of Géraldine Lepère. Though I have seen some of her videos and found them fun, I have not taken any of her courses. Surely it is a good thing to ask here on the forum if anyone has taken a course from her and what their evaluation of it is. Not to prejudice any case against her, but her web page is pretty vague IMHO about what she can and will teach you. But this is nothing special, because it is pretty standard fare for all the people and companies who advertise their expertise in teaching languages on the Internet and elsewhere.

Anyway, I hope you can find someone here who can enlighten you and us about her value or the value of any other language enterprise. Meanwhile, to take a page from Iguanamon, I invite you and any other member who has not read widely in the journals of other members here to do some sampling and see what jewels we have here. (But for goodness sakes, don't look at mine: no jewels there :lol: First try some of the big long logs.)

[Edited one time to spell Iguanamon correctly :oops: ]
Last edited by MorkTheFiddle on Thu Jan 24, 2019 5:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Maiwenn
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Re: Le groupe français 2016 - 2019 Les Voyageurs

Postby Maiwenn » Sun Jan 20, 2019 8:25 pm

Dear French learners,

The forum's book club will be reading Metro 2033 (originally in Russian) by Dmitry Glukhovsky in February and Les Hirondelles de Kaboul (originally in French) by Yasmina Khadra in March.

I'd really encourage all of you wishing to fine-tune your French vocabulary to check out the March book, Les Hirondelles de Kaboul. Yasmina Khadra expresses himself (Yasmina Khadra is his pen name) exquisitely in French and with surgical precision. As an example of his use of vocabulary, here's an excerpt from another of his books (Dieu n'habite pas La Havane):

Il m'interrompt d'une main en extirpant de l'autre son téléphone portable. En reconnaissant son interlocuteur sur le cadran, il fait pivoter son fauteuil pour me tourner le dos. Apparemment, la personne au bout du fil est quelqu'un d'important car le jeune blond n'arrête pas de se gratter derrière l'oreille en alignant les "Bien, monsieur... entendu, monsieur... C'est comme si c'était fait, monsieur". Lorsqu'il raccroche, il passe deux minutes à s'éponger dans un mouchoir avant de pivoter sur son siège, la mine décomposée.

He interrupts me with one hand while pulling out his cellphone with the other. Recognizing the caller on the screen, he turns his chair away from me. Clearly, the person on the other end of the line is an important individual, since the young blond man won't stop scratching behind his ear along side every "Very well, sir... understood, sir.... Consider it done, sir." Once he hangs up, he takes two minutes to wipe his face with a handkerchief before pivoting back with an unsettled expression.


The book club can presently be found in the Multilingual category: https://forum.language-learners.org/vie ... &start=160 Come join us!
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Sarafina
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Re: Le groupe français 2016 - 2019 Les Voyageurs

Postby Sarafina » Sat Jan 26, 2019 1:16 am

I think I've already posted links for some of the shows listed before. But this is just a bunch of links to cartoons that are available for free on YouTube and are in French.

Arthur (12 episodes and French subtitles are available)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=byDzuHo ... JDB4G94aSj
Mes parrains sont magiques (13 episodes)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20E_1An ... vsG2sxLdmL
Magic La Famille (21 episodes),
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pciWnFg ... _sBC1n-7q7
Le Monde selon Kevin (24 episodes but half of it is blocked in my location),
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4R94vFu ... sk&index=5
TIMOTHÉE VA À L'ÉCOLE (25 episodes and French subtitles are available),
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vsJJEV- ... Yf4WrWoJ80
D'Artagnan et les Trois Mousquetaires (26 episodes),
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0p0t3g9 ... 968861B864
Bouba le petit oursan (26 episodes),
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YLRUDwH ... czBD6lP5ha
Ed Edd Eddy (29 episodes),
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fh0SsRz ... FseqSZZHrV
Tib et Tatoum (29 episodes and French subtitles are available),
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7o_Cojz ... AxTQ-QIXO9
Les jumelles de St-Clare (33)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h8diJ06 ... BSs9KiE5tS
Petite Bonne Femme (40),
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=apgYwtP ... qDMsUDSDks
Tico et Ses Amis
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVzC0_U ... 9dsKDcdk8a
Il était une fois (41),
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m0pUKsM ... 0879116BAB
Sindbad (42)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TPqyT2s ... GCTIZyvbOI
Le Petit Lord (43)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wCgZcc1 ... QM4-aBKd8K
Princesse Sarah (47 episodes),
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YBRUsyI ... hN3w5nxXf4
Raconte-moi une histoire (47)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0MxgD1v ... Ugx0GKs9QA
Vanessa et la magie des rêves
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=23tcFkz ... CgBNopQ4_K
Les 4 filles du Dr March (48)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gz_74c5 ... dArOMJuWI7
Karine l'aventure du Nouveau Monde (50)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BMCa7Ve ... 9WDy8GznbY
Pollyanna
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YKyyCkh ... Nzicb_y-h-
Heidi fille des Alpes (52 episodes),
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_eNEHUV ... 230c2M_dCY
Les Jumeaux du bout du monde (52)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xrmVx0C ... -JFm7z968o
Totally Spies (52 in total)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=inKCn1N ... fT6GGmWxG1 (Season 1)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1VKPvR3 ... TnZKkOFUFu (Season 2)
Mew Mew Powers (53)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5nMlcMU ... MegrF7-02l
Gigi (63 episodes)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E9b9BP- ... OwA6eQXZYZ
Maya l'abeille (104)
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... yoCGl_QN9Y

A playlist that has random clips of Caillou but they also have French subtitles availabe. I found them to have really helpful if you are at the A1/A2 stages
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rXv6RgJ ... qjSGv_ojmb
This channel has various clips of children TV shows (mainly Caillou and Le Petit Nicholas) with French subtitles
https://www.youtube.com/user/buenovelazquez/videos
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Carmody
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Re: Le groupe français 2016 - 2019 Les Voyageurs

Postby Carmody » Sat Jan 26, 2019 4:20 pm

Sarafina

Many thanks for all your hard work with the Cartoons; much appreciated.

Please note there are also these old standards:

Des Racines et des Ailes
https://www.youtube.com/user/DRDAfrancetv

L'ombre d'un doute
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vaqAlBLZK-g

They have the advantage of:
1-Lots of subject variety
2-Subtitled translations
3-Adult level
4-High production values and very professional.

Thanks again for the hard work.
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MorkTheFiddle
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Language Log: https://forum.language-learners.org/vie ... 11#p133911
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Re: Le groupe français 2016 - 2019 Les Voyageurs

Postby MorkTheFiddle » Sat Jan 26, 2019 6:15 pm

Sarafina wrote:I think I've already posted links for some of the shows listed before. But this is just a bunch of links to cartoons that are available for free on YouTube and are in French.

This was a lot of work. :!: Thank you.
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Cavesa
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Re: Le groupe français 2016 - 2019 Les Voyageurs

Postby Cavesa » Sat Jan 26, 2019 7:42 pm

MorkTheFiddle wrote:Shouldn’t every language teacher and every language program that wants my money be able to (1) say where it will pick me up and where it will leave me off and (2) provide me with data that show they have and can do such a thing? By number (1) I mean tell me it will take me from A0 to C2, or only from B1 to B2, or just teach me all the ways to say good-bye. By number (2) I mean something like we have taught 100 students in the last 10 years, all of them starting from scratch, and 30 of them have passed the highest level proficiency exams that there are for that language, and here are the records and data to prove that.


When it comes to the usual cefr labeled coursebooks (+grammar books, vocab builders, and so on), there is such data. The cefr level is defined in much more detail, than what people usually look at, including the grammar and vocab, and so on. So, the label means what part of the defined knowledge on the list it should cover. (For example the Spanish cefr definitions are publicly available on the Cervantes website. You can check what pieces of grammar, what types of interactions, what words you should know at each level. And the coursebooks with the cefr label follow that. A French publication like this most probably exists, but I haven't seen it publicly available for free)

Nobody can guarantee you will reach the level, but the book covers the required knowledge you need in order to get there. Most people don't, but it is because of lack of more practice and because of individual differences. Also, an A1 coursebook can be trusted to cover everything for that level, a C1 coursebook is always just a sample (but can still be very useful).

The teachers are more complicated. The biggest problem is, that they tend to take such questions as an offense. Or they avoid the answers either because they want to hide the facts away or sometimes out of ignorance. For example, I asked about the end level at my sister's school, when she was choosing her second foreign language. I asked what level do the students usually reach by the time they finish high school and also how many do pass the cefr exams and at what levels (at my highschool, a not that small % of students was taking those exams, it was normal). The teacher didn't even understand my questions and started like "but we do not force them to take such exams!" What the hell?

With the individual tutoring (but also some classes), it becomes even more tricky, as the tutors do not usually follow a coursebook. So, they are often guessing the levels even more wildly than the learners themselves. It seems to be a common experience on this forum that the tutor makes the learner do activities for a much lower level. They have no clue.


Probably some universities, some language schools, the Foreign Service Institute and other schools could provide such data, though I don’t know whether in fact they can or do.


They don't bother. It would be natural and not complicated at all, if for example the local AF put the info on their website, as something to be proud of. Like: "the B1.4 classes were attended by 28 students in the year 2017/18, 7 of them took DELF B1, 6 passed, and the average note was 65. 23 students decided to continue in the B2.1 class". But they simply don't bother, because the mainstream language learners do not demand enough information.

The universities often give such information, but I am not sure how trustworthy it is. For example the French degree students in Prague are supposed to reach C1 at the end of BA (is that the lower level degree in the anglophone countries?) and C2 at the end of the Master degree. It's not just about the language, there is a lot of literature, some history, etc. Yet, a student of the Master degree I met years ago told me: "I don't read the obligatory books in French, it would take me too much time". Doesn't sound like C2 (or even C1).
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javier_getafe
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Re: Le groupe français 2016 - 2019 Les Voyageurs

Postby javier_getafe » Sat Jan 26, 2019 11:50 pm

Cavesa wrote: Yet, a student of the Master degree I met years ago told me: "I don't read the obligatory books in French, it would take me too much time". Doesn't sound like C2 (or even C1).


I cann't simply believe it.
WTF.
:shock: :shock: :shock:
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Super Challenge '19
: 25 / 100 100 books : 34 / 100 100 films
Output Challenge '19
: 6140 / 50000 50,000 words : 25 / 50 50 hours of recorded speech

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zjones
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Re: Le groupe français 2016 - 2019 Les Voyageurs

Postby zjones » Sun Jan 27, 2019 4:53 pm

RFI Savoirs has a lot more than just Journal en Français Facile.

I have been doing these kinds of exercises (Exercise 1, Exercise 2) on their website and I think they are great for listening comprehension! These exercises are aimed at students at level B2, but they would be appropriate for students at level B1 as well.

RFI Savoirs is my favorite website for improving my news and media vocabulary in preparation for the DELF.
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javier_getafe
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Re: Le groupe français 2016 - 2019 Les Voyageurs

Postby javier_getafe » Sun Jan 27, 2019 7:33 pm

zjones wrote:RFI Savoirs has a lot more than just Journal en Français Facile.

I have been doing these kinds of exercises (Exercise 1, Exercise 2) on their website and I think they are great for listening comprehension! These exercises are aimed at students at level B2, but they would be appropriate for students at level B1 as well.

RFI Savoirs is my favorite website for improving my news and media vocabulary in preparation for the DELF.


Nice sites to practise.
For me it sounds like russian :lol: :lol:

I have only been dabbling in français for the last two weeks and I am even searching for the new consonants which doesn't exist in the keyboard of my laptop. :evil: :lol:

Doing the first steps is being so difficult, new consonants, new vowels, new sounds. (so beautiful!!). But what is doing most difficult is even remember the most simple words, you know, le chat, le chian, la pomme, l'oiseau... haha. Incredible, I can repeat it fifty times out loud and tomorrow the words have gone, fuc...

But, at this moment, I am pretty enthusiastic to reach a goal. I think it is a believable and approachable target. To reach A1 level in one year, isn't it?
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Super Challenge '19
: 25 / 100 100 books : 34 / 100 100 films
Output Challenge '19
: 6140 / 50000 50,000 words : 25 / 50 50 hours of recorded speech


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