Le groupe français 2016 - 2023 Les Voyageurs

[Klara]

Are you sure about the writing of "carotte"?

Shouldn't it be "a carotté", the passé composé of the verb "carotter"? Then the sentence would make sense.

[Le Baron]

I was going to say the same as Klara, but I went to listen to the audio and she doesn't say a carotté, it really is 'a carotte'. I know that carroter means swindle and also to rob, so I thought perhaps it means here 'to short change' in the figurative sense. But still the grammar is strange.

I have my limits.

[MorkTheFiddle]

Maybe "taken an accurate sample of" = properly evaluated?

[guyome]

I would use the past participle "carotté" here but I can find some rap songs featuring "on a carrote". It seems to be rather common in certain circles.

[Le Baron]

Maybe "taken an accurate sample of" = properly evaluated?

Could indeed be that, though the grammar still seems off. Or I just don't understand it. I listened to the audio a couple of times, which doesn't really match the written portion anyway. I've given up on it.

[DaveAgain]

Looking up poule I was a bit surprised that it can mean both "wife" and "prostitute"!

poule

nom féminin

(latin pulla, féminin de pullus, petit d'un animal)

1. Femelle de l'espèce domestique de gallinacés (Gallus gallus), répandue dans le monde entier, élevée pour sa chair et pour ses œufs. (Le mâle est le coq.)
2. Populaire. Épouse, maîtresse.
3. Populaire. Femme facile, prostituée.

[DaveAgain]

I'm watching a video where a French teacher laments the current state of the public education sector in France. She mentions using some grammar excercise books by Grevisse:

... Et donc moi je m'accroche, je reviens en arrière. Et ce qu'il faut aussi, c'est a systématisation des exercices. Donc je leur ai fait acheter un petit cahier d'exercices Grévisse et on systématise à chaque fois les exercices, on refait les exercices.

[Le Baron]

I'm watching a video where a French teacher laments the current state of the public education sector in France. She mentions using some grammar excercise books by Grevisse:

... Et donc moi je m'accroche, je reviens en arrière. Et ce qu'il faut aussi, c'est a systématisation des exercices. Donc je leur ai fait acheter un petit cahier d'exercices Grévisse et on systématise à chaque fois les exercices, on refait les exercices.

What are you specifically addressing, the Grevisse or the woman's allegations about collapsing educational standards?

In any case I think when people like this woman make this particular complaint and then you have students saying that they find it hard to reconcile the things being studied with life around them, that it isn't the students' fault. Sending them to a classic grammar/conjugation text - something the French think solves all language deterioration issues - isn't actually any sort of solution. If they feel no connection with Molière why would they feel it with the typical grammars? Which are often just more confusion sold as 'clarity'.

What she calls a 'lack of vocabulary' might be real, but in some senses just represents the gulf between the actual and ideal. Classic French, and that seen as being 'educated', suffers from being highly periphrastic (in fact the entre language is like that) and not really compatible with the gradual simplification of ordinary communication.

[DaveAgain]

What are you specifically addressing, the Grevisse or the woman's allegations about collapsing educational standards?

The grammar exercise books from Grevisse.fr, on reflection I should probably have posted this in the French resources thread.

[jeffers]

I posted a reply to the following question in the Super Challenge Discussion thread, but really this discussion would be better to take place here. Please reply with any easy readers you found interesting when you were a beginner.

Guys, is there a list of French beginner-friendly books on the forum? I have not read anything in French (except for Le Petit Nicolas) and would like to start with contemporary novels.
There are tons of French novels that I would love to read, but I want to begin with the easiest material. I can't stand not knowing too many words in a book.

Le petit Nicolas is a great book series, and the audiobooks are mostly really good as well. However, they are fairly advanced for a new learner. The problem is, most children's books are still written for native speakers, so I found as a beginner I would be looking up a few words per page even on books aimed at 4-5 year olds. It is better to read books aimed at foreigners learning French, normally labelled as "FLE". It's best if you can get the type of book that comes with audio, and you can use the audiobooks for the film portion of the challenge. These can be a really mixed bag because they are still often pretty stupid stories, or watered down versions of classics, so boring either way. Here are a few examples that I found to be decent reads:

• Enquête capitale, by Marine Courtis, an A1 levelled book about someone following a trail of clues around Paris. I actually found the story quite engaging, and I would like to follow the trail of places on my next visit to Paris.
• Mystère sur le Vieux-Port, by Pascale Paoli, another A1 book about a crime set in Marseille. Not as engaging as Enquête capitale, but better than the average A1 reader.
• Pas d'oscar pour l'assassin, by Vincent Remède, a straightforward detective story written for A2 level students. The same author has two more stories in the series by the same publisher.

The last book mentioned is from Mondes en VF https://www.mondesenvf.fr/. Mondes en VF is a seriew with original stories by established authors. They are aiming at books that are readable by learners but still have literary value. You can get them in print or on Kindle, which has the added advantage of the possibility of using the popup dictionary. And best of all, when you buy a book you can download the audiobook for free (you just have to answer a question something like, "What is the last word in chapter 7?") I have only read a few books by this publisher (all 3 books by Vincent Remède), but I enjoyed all of those that I read.

A quick comment about method. When I worked through these books I always started with the audio, and listened through the audio several times, understanding a bit more with each pass. This allowed me to get good grasp of the main outline of the story before reading it, with the result that I didn't need to look up as much when I finally actually read the text. More importantly, it meant that while reading I was pronouncing things in my head correctly.

I will cross post this to the French Study group, and hopefully people can add other reading suggestions for beginners there.