Classical Languages - Study Group

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einzelne
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Re: Classical Languages - Study Group

Postby einzelne » Tue Oct 26, 2021 2:10 pm

daegga wrote:were you looking for this?


I was looking for some reading materials which would stick to one tense so I would have more opportunities to get used to them.
For the first 18 chapters Ølberg uses present tense only (introducing 1st and 2nd Person only in Chapter 15). Then in Chapter 19 he introduces Imperfect, both Active and Passive, Chapter 20 — Future, again Active and Passive, Chapter 21 — both Perfect, again both Active and Passive. That's quite a jump. I would love to have more reading practice which train me all these forms without overburdening me with new grammar features.
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daegga
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Re: Classical Languages - Study Group

Postby daegga » Tue Oct 26, 2021 2:49 pm

The extended version of Fabellae Latinae (the one with texts for chapters I-XXXV, extended by Luigi Miraglia) has 2 texts for ch 19, 9 for ch 20, 1 for ch 21, 2 for ch 22 ...
But they also keep using the previously introduced tenses in addition to the new ones.
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einzelne
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Re: Classical Languages - Study Group

Postby einzelne » Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:14 pm

daegga wrote:The extended version of Fabellae Latinae (the one with texts for chapters I-XXXV, extended by Luigi Miraglia) has 2 texts for ch 19, 9 for ch 20, 1 for ch 21, 2 for ch 22 ...


The extended edition? Where can I find it? I only have the one for chapters (I-XXV).
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daegga
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Re: Classical Languages - Study Group

Postby daegga » Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:42 pm

einzelne wrote:
daegga wrote:The extended version of Fabellae Latinae (the one with texts for chapters I-XXXV, extended by Luigi Miraglia) has 2 texts for ch 19, 9 for ch 20, 1 for ch 21, 2 for ch 22 ...


The extended edition? Where can I find it? I only have the one for chapters (I-XXV).


ISBN 978-87-90696-15-3
seems like the original edition has the same ISBN, but google it and you shall find the extended one
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einzelne
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Re: Classical Languages - Study Group

Postby einzelne » Tue Oct 26, 2021 5:14 pm

daegga wrote:but google it and you shall find the extended one


Gratias tibi ago!
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Herodotean
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Re: Classical Languages - Study Group

Postby Herodotean » Tue Oct 26, 2021 7:14 pm

There's also a volume of Colloquia personarum for chapters 1-24 at 4-6 pages each (I can't view the Reddit post mentioned earlier; I assume it was listed there too). Very much worth reading, though it doesn't isolate the new tenses in quite the way you want. But you're right about the difficulty increase from 18-21; why Oerberg didn't introduce some tenses earlier is beyond me.
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einzelne
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Re: Classical Languages - Study Group

Postby einzelne » Wed Oct 27, 2021 2:07 am

Herodotean wrote:There's also a volume of Colloquia personarum <...> But you're right about the difficulty increase from 18-21; why Oerberg didn't introduce some tenses earlier is beyond me.


Yes, I'm reading this one now. I have almost all LLPSI books in my collection.

I can perfectly understand Ørberg's decision — you target declensions first and bracket conjugations for a time being. But then I expect to have the same amount of space for practicing conjugations (if not more given that verbs have a richer morphology). 2-3 chapters per tense, at least the most important ones, would be great.
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guyome
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Re: Classical Languages - Study Group

Postby guyome » Thu Oct 28, 2021 8:57 am

einzelne wrote:I was looking for some reading materials which would stick to one tense...
As you mentioned, most textbooks happily mix old and new forms in their texts/exercises so it can be hard to find something which sticks to just one conjugation.

Here are some ideas for short texts:
- the Principia textbook (by Peckett & Munday) I mentioned in a previous post
- Sonnenschein's Ora Maritima (1st conjugation) and its sequel Pro Patria

If you're into Q&A drills, I've always found Traut's Latin Ollendorff more interesting than Adler's one. Using the Key provides you with dozens of sentences focusing on one tense only. See, for instance, Ex. 74 on the Perfect tense (there's around 10 of these, often longer than this one, just for the Active Perfect):
Estne certum, quod de pace audivisti? — Est certum, nam audivi ex certis hominibus.
Quis Carthaginem delevit? — Scipio, qui maximus dux Romanorum fuit.
Profueruntne magni duces generi hominum? — Plerumque magis nocuerunt, quam profuerunt: plures urbes deleverunt, quam condiderunt.
Quomodo tibi obfui? — Mihi obfuisti, quia mihi defuisti. Qui nobis deest, non solum non prodest, sed etiam obest.
Cur nobis defuistis? — Quia vires nobis defuerunt.
Cur non diutius laboravisti? — Quam diu potui, laboravi.
Quam diu abfuisti? — Abfui septem menses.
Quam diu aravisti? — Aravi tam diu, quam dies fuit.
Nonne abfuit duodecim dies? — Si duplicas numerum duodecim, habes numerum dierum, quos abfuit.
Habuistisne in itinere carnem bonam et panem bonum? — Panem bonum ubique habuimus, sed caro bona saepe nobis defuit; at carne non eguimus, quia semper habuimus adipem optimum.
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einzelne
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Re: Classical Languages - Study Group

Postby einzelne » Thu Oct 28, 2021 11:04 pm

guyome wrote:As you mentioned, most textbooks happily mix old and new forms in their texts/exercises so it can be hard to find something which sticks to just one conjugation.


I really like the drills from Elementary Latin: the Basic Structures — the ones that ask you to reframe sentences from the present tense to the future/past/perfect. I find it quite helpful and I like the two column layout (I used the same approach while learning French verbs but I had to make such two column sheets myself.)
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guyome
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Re: Classical Languages - Study Group

Postby guyome » Fri Oct 29, 2021 6:07 am

I didn't mention Elementary Latin in my last post because I thought the lack of an answer key might reduce its usefulness for the kind of concentrated practice you wanted but I'm glad you like it anyway. Crawford's book grew out of Waldo Sweet's experiments with Latin teaching and keeps many things from Sweet's own Latin Workshop Experimental Materials - Book 1 published in 1953 so you may find it interesting too (it is available at Hathitrust).

I also find exercises that ask you to reformulate sentences (present to perfect, sing. to pl., etc.) quite useful. I don't know exactly why but I guess it may have to do with the fact that they show, or ask you you to produce, the various forms in close contact, cementing the differences in the reader's mind. Peckett & Munday's Principia does something very similar to Crawford's Elementary Latin and Sweet's Latin Workshop, introducing the past tense with pairs like:
Hodie ad Circum Maximum ambulo. - Heri ad Circum Maximum ambulavi.
Hodie in subselliis sedemus. - Heri in subselliis sedimus.
etc.

Same with the Future tense:
Heri fur pecuniam cepit.
Hodie fur pecuniam capit.
Cras fur pecuniam non capiet.
Cur pecuniam non capiet?
Quia in carcere erit.

Heri fures pecuniam ceperunt.
Hodie fures pecuniam capiunt.
Cras fures pecuniam non capient.
Cur pecuniam non capient?
Quia in carcere erunt.


Another type of exercise I found useful but almost never see in textbooks is the "snowball". The textbook I used to learn Latin made (a limited) use of it and I thought it was great to help the reader build the habit of reading longer, more complex sentences:
1. Dei cives audiunt.
2. Omnes dei fortes cives audiebant.
3. Omnes dei in templis fortes cives patriam amantes audient.
4. Omnes civitatis dei in ingentibus templis fortium civium patriam amantium verba audiverant.
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