Bahasa Indonesia untuk Dunia

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Adrianslont
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Re: Bahasa Indonesia untuk Dunia

Postby Adrianslont » Sun Apr 15, 2018 3:59 am

Well that’s a nice bunch of Bahasa Gaul! I’ve been meaning to come to grips with BG in a methodical way myself - I’ve just picked up a few bits and pieces.

I’ve quickly scanned your sentences and had thoughts like “yeah that’s a good thing to know how to say.” Also spotted a few minor errors in the translations - bus for bus stop, AS for North America, motor for bicycle. I’ll go through the sentences in a more methodical way in the next few days or so. Inconsistencies? Not sure what you are thinking of - I see a very wide range of negation - nggak, ga, kagak and so on - but that’s not a problem, is it?

So, I’ve been following Neumanc’s thread - sort of - it gets a bit technically challenging for me in places - though I imagine I could figure things out. Ideally, I’d like to use something like this on my phone - so probably in anki - looks like I’m going to have to become familiar with how to use Indonesian TTS with anki. Or were you planning to get the sentences recorded?

This may be the impetus to get me back seriously studying Indonesian again - I’ve only been doing anki reviews for about seven months now. Cheers.
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Axon
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Re: Bahasa Indonesia untuk Dunia

Postby Axon » Sun Apr 15, 2018 7:00 am

Yeah, I was thinking of getting the sentences recorded at some point. A Javanese translation is "otw." Of course any bahasa daerah translation comes with its own serious challenges and should really be used as a supplement only.

The errors and inconsistencies (here more referring to inexact translations) should be no trouble for an intermediate learner of Indonesian, but I'd like to get them fixed of course before I make any recordings.

Interestingly this is full of gua/lu which to my knowledge is not used much in speech here in Yogya. I thought it was more of a Jakarta thing.
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2018:
1000 Subtitled Indonesian Video Minutes: 200 / 1000
1000 Pages of Indonesian Reading: 300 / 1000
100 Duolingo Practice Sessions: 37 / 100

Monox D. I-Fly
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Re: Bahasa Indonesia untuk Dunia

Postby Monox D. I-Fly » Sun Apr 15, 2018 5:23 pm

Axon wrote:Interestingly this is full of gua/lu which to my knowledge is not used much in speech here in Yogya. I thought it was more of a Jakarta thing.


Exactly. Indonesians in general prefer to say aku/kamu, the middleground between gua/lu and saya/Anda.
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Iversen
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Re: Bahasa Indonesia untuk Dunia

Postby Iversen » Wed Apr 18, 2018 11:31 pm

Excellent material. I have printed the whole lot out on 7 pages and will study them later. I can however see that even at my fairly limited current level I can generally understand the Indonesian sentences when I see them. The problem is always the other way: to choose the idiomatic expression for a given purpose.

Right now I can't be really fuzzy about where in Indonesia which words or expressions are used - or not used. I just try to gobble up everything I see as long as it looks like Bahasa Indonesian and not one of the local languages. Btw I have visitred Sulawesi, Bali and Yogyakarta and Surabaya on Java - but back then I didn't know any Bahasa Indonesia - only Bahasa Ingrris.
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Adrianslont
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Re: Bahasa Indonesia untuk Dunia

Postby Adrianslont » Thu Apr 19, 2018 8:46 am

Axon. I have PMed you some annotations on the first two hundred of your sentences. I hope you find them useful.

I liked the sentences!
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Re: Bahasa Indonesia untuk Dunia

Postby Expugnator » Mon Apr 23, 2018 2:02 pm

Hi fellow learners, has any of us used the old (not too old, though) Glossika Indonesian? I don't want to enter the subscription model, and I'd like to know how good the previous edition is and whether it's worth searching for a copy.

Actually, any sentence-level based method would do. I'm waiting for Duolingo to be published and I'm wondering whether I should start over my Clozemaster by using TTS this time.
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Axon
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Re: Bahasa Indonesia untuk Dunia

Postby Axon » Mon Apr 23, 2018 3:33 pm

Expugnator wrote:Hi fellow learners, has any of us used the old (not too old, though) Glossika Indonesian? I don't want to enter the subscription model, and I'd like to know how good the previous edition is and whether it's worth searching for a copy.

Actually, any sentence-level based method would do. I'm waiting for Duolingo to be published and I'm wondering whether I should start over my Clozemaster by using TTS this time.


Lucky for you, I think I might be the most outspoken Glossika fan on this forum.

I bought Glossika Indonesian sometime around March 2017 and used it almost every day until September, when I arrived in Indonesia. That was about the time that they switched to the subscription model, and I've racked up about 12,000 reps in the last eight months. That's not a ton, but 1) I do feel that the new platform is an improvement and 2) I'm, y'know, in Indonesia.

But what's the course like?

Overall, it's not bad. The man who did the recording has a very nice and clear voice, and he speaks slightly slower than a fast native but at about the same speed as older men on TV. There are no audio artifacts or technical issues. There are very few mistranslations or careless mistakes - two or three in the first 500 sentences and then maybe five more in the next 2500. Certainly the most audio available for an Indonesian course that I've seen. I absolutely credit this course with giving me an excellent command of Indonesian syntax and prosody.

There are a few minor issues with it that I will complain about extensively here. The IPA transcription is what some might call a hack job - whole words are missing outright and no names are transcribed. It was clearly done via script instead of anybody actually listening to how the speaker pronounced it. The most egregious thing (I have emailed them at least twice about this) is that the c and j letters are transcribed as alveolar affricates (church and judge in English) while anyone with linguistics training can hear that they're actually lightly fricativized alveolo-palatal stops. [Note: this makes virtually no difference for actually understanding and being understood, but it's the principle of the thing.]

Next, "I" is always "Saya" and "you" is always "kamu." I've personally never heard anybody use this particular combination here in Yogyakarta - it's always Saya/Anda and aku/kamu. But it's slipped out of my mouth a few times and nobody ever corrected me.

The speaker drops the ber- and meN- prefixes regularly. This is absolutely a feature of natural colloquial speech, but you should be aware that in a formal context Indonesians will always leave these on. Now that I've been exposed to more authentic speech, I do find it a little weird to hear "Saya akan nginap" instead of "Saya akan menginap" or "Aku akan nginap."

The biggest thing about learning Indonesian is the vocabulary. You can study Clozemaster and Glossika and be understood without any trouble, but don't be surprised if you can't understand native text or audio. Indonesian is extremely rich in synonyms. I took a listening quiz last month, and of the 20 words I missed, 13 of them were synonyms of words I already knew. If you study only formal, bookish Indonesian, you'll be caught off guard by conversation. If you study natural, YouTuber Indonesian, you'll be lost when you read a newspaper.

Glossika, like most courses, sticks to its own set of vocabulary. You'll hear "ngerti" often but rarely "paham/faham." You'll get virtually no exposure to "sih," "kan," "nih," or "dong." You won't get the full range of "cowok/cewek" "laki-laki/perempuan," "pria/wanita," "putri/putra."

Fortunately, the bahasa Gaul I posted in this thread is a good complement to the formal register, though Adrianslont's keen eye has found a number of minor errors. Once you get a good handle on the formal language, you'll be able to understand the slang very quickly, and then listening to native materials will be no trouble for you.
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2018:
1000 Subtitled Indonesian Video Minutes: 200 / 1000
1000 Pages of Indonesian Reading: 300 / 1000
100 Duolingo Practice Sessions: 37 / 100

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Expugnator
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Re: Bahasa Indonesia untuk Dunia

Postby Expugnator » Mon Jul 16, 2018 11:29 am

Someone shared this link:

http://repositori.perpustakaan.kemdikbud.go.id

When you click 'Browse', you can go to Bahasa Indonesia. There seems to be a good deal of articles and dissertations. My limited knowledge of the language prevents me from doing any further content evaluation.
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