Vacation in Egypt

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Dodger
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Vacation in Egypt

Postby Dodger » Mon Feb 14, 2022 6:18 pm

Hello,
that's my first post, so I introduce myself. I'm from Germany and I'm quite good in English and I dabbled in Russian and Mandarin.

I want to go to Egypt with my Girlfriend in 6 months. We don't have really time to do serious study but I want to be able to speak a few basic sentences and read the most basic things in arabian writing (townhall, restaurant, police, toilet...). I know Anki as a learning tool (thanks Rick!) and I pitched the idea to train it a little bit for fun to my girlfriend. Do you guys have any suggesting for how to learn as a couple? 8-)

We haven't booked yet, but likely we go to the red sea cost. To those who been there (or even live there!) :
- What should I visit or experience aside from the stereotypical pyramids of Giza and the Sphynx?
- Where should I go?
- What should I eat (as a vegetarian) ?
- What danger should I be aware of?

I want to go to a Basar, but aside from that I'm so clueless. To be honest I'm more a cold climate lover, so that will be new for me (I have to try everything to not get burned as I'm pale as REDACTED lol)

I'm grateful for every suggestions :)
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Re: Vacation in Egypt

Postby QueenBee » Tue Feb 15, 2022 10:09 am

I hate to be a party-pooper, but...

There was a huge Reddit thread about 7 months ago, asking people where they would never visit again. "Egypt" was by far the most common answer, with many women sharing stories of how they almost got raped. I'm sharing the thread here:

https://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comm ... ver_visit/

I normally never base my opinions (about anything) off the internet, because usually, there's a kind of omission that goes on - people who have something to complain about will go online and write negative reviews or comments, while people who had an OK time won't say anything. So someone reading online reviews could get an unrepresentative idea of how bad something really is.

But I also know people offline who have visited Egypt as tourists - and I've yet to hear a single person say that they had a good time. Levels of poverty and dirt/filth that will make you cry. Locals offering you a camel ride, then demanding you pay extra money for them to let you off the camel. Men coming up to male tourists and joking about how they'll buy his wife/gf/daughter in exchange for 20 camels. Shopkeepers locking the store, and not letting you out, until you buy something.

I don't know what you and your gf look for in your travels, but I have a hard time imagining anybody who could have a good time in this country. I would stay away.
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Re: Vacation in Egypt

Postby lavengro » Tue Feb 15, 2022 5:42 pm

Hi Dodger, I have not been to Egypt, but I am not sure I would be overly-swayed by negative comments on Reddit or similar sites. Otherwise, I would never travel anywhere - I have even heard people bashing Canada on sites like this as a travel destination (the people are too friendly, the maple syrup is too heavenly, the Rockies are too pointy, etc). There is a lot of nonsense on Reddit from time to time, and sometimes it becomes a pile-on of unwarranted bashing.

But I would look seriously at current governmental travel advisories. There are some places to stay away from in 2022 for situational rather than systemic reasons, including I think the north end of the red sea coast (and certainly the Sinai peninsula).

Otherwise, my understanding from friends, work colleagues and my sister (a female, concerning whom no camel exchange offer was made, honest) who have vacationed there, Egypt was a fascinating place to visit. Particularly good diving/snorkelling, according to my sister. But like I say, I have not been and do not have personal experience.
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Re: Vacation in Egypt

Postby lavengro » Tue Feb 15, 2022 5:45 pm

I note you mention an interest in visiting a Basar. That word is generally spelled `bazaar` in English. Mentioning only in case you are googling English language sites for information.
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Re: Vacation in Egypt

Postby Dodger » Wed Feb 16, 2022 7:16 pm

Hey QueenBee, thanks for your concerns. I definitely don't want stress or stay alert while being on the vacation. I thought I was sure, but now I know I need to research this in depth.

Hello lavengro, thanks for the counterargument. Yeah, IDK. I looked up a safety Index (by numeo) by country and Egypt is safer than France. On another site Kairo is 99th place, for reference San Francisco is 117th..
https://globalresidenceindex.com/hnwi-i ... ety-index/

I was kind of in blissful ignorance :D
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Re: Vacation in Egypt

Postby Cavesa » Thu Feb 17, 2022 8:35 pm

As to the language part: There are various resources, Language Transfer has a very popular Arabic course. And as it is audio based, it could be an advantage to not deal with the new script at first. Assimil has made some lightened book for Arabic learners, that is not the classical one, but more oriented on the beginner situations. The blog Mezzofanti's guild is probably the number 1 place to go for info on Egyptian Arabic resources (and Arabic resources in general).

As to the country: I enjoyed my touristy visit 20 years ago (20! omg!). I was just a kid, excited about the ancient egyptian culture, and the sea was great, etc. But it was weird to be complimented on my looks at 11 years of age in the way adult women get complimented. It felt really weird (and it happened several times), even though I see the full cringe only now as an adult. The safety had already been an issue back then, months before 11/9, with regular checks on roads and so on, but not as much as after that. It seems to have partially calmed down again, but all my acquitances from arabic countries (colleagues, patients,...) don't recommend me visit to any place in that region right now, including Egypt. But one day, I'd love to travel there, and not just to Egypt.

While I would take some internet sources with a huge grain of salt, the people I know to have happily visited were not doing the same kind of free tourism we can do in Europe. Either they were the closed tourists somewhere in a hotel, with just protected group visits to some popular spots, and that was exactly what they had wanted. Or they were totally different. Such as a girl going there for a month long medicine internship, who was excited by the rich experience, but of course had to deal with some unpleasant situations (didn't describe much of sexual harassment, but did indeed describe a lot of uncomfortable sexism, that even made her feel not safe at all in some situations).

If you go there with some types of expectations, you can surely enjoy your visit a lot. But if you expect it to be the same experience as in Europe, just with more exotic landscapes and more sand, think again. You are a man, so you have a huge advantage over someone like me, but it will still be different.

As you want to learn the language and from your questions, I assume you want to be the more free individual visitor. And that might be harder. Not impossible, but certainly harder. The language skills will indeed be helpful, not just for the practical reasons, but they may also get you a bit more respect. The usual safety precautions (such as not all money on you etc), a not overly kind heart (because beggars or people asking for extra money for normal things are absolutely normal and have no shame) or at least not looking like it, not provoking clothes (applies to you as well, even though this will be worse for your girlfriend. She certainly doesn't have to cover herself horribly, but yes, many people from the arabic countries take very standard european clothes as a provocation or invitation (my source: living and working in arabic immigrant heavy neighbourhoods and speaking with women with various approaches to this problem). Based on something I heard from several couples travelling in the region: consider getting married before going, or at least lying about being married.

And of course, follow the recommendations of your ministry of foreign affairs, follow the international news (a lot can happen in the 6 months to come. There can be a new wave or a different epidemia, a new wave of terrorist attacks on hotels, a new revolution, or just beautiful calm and nothing at all, and we cannot predict that). Get informed on the up to date local laws to follow (such as how the egyptians don't allow export of various innocent things, including sea shells you find and similar stuff. Smuggling is taken very seriously there and ignorance of less usual rules might put you at risk. Or the laws concerning alcohol consummation etc.)

As to food: I don't think vegetarianism will be that much of a problem. Hygiene will be.

So, definitely consult your doctor before going, prepare your usual medicines, something against diarrhea, fever, get your vaccinations in check (I definitely recommend Hepatitis B and A. Now is a good time to start asking about that and planning the shots), malaria profylaxis, and some people take wide spectrum antibiotics with them just in case (There are divided views on this. Not sure whether I'd prescribe them just in case, as they are not bonbons, but some doctors definitely do).
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Re: Vacation in Egypt

Postby Iversen » Sat Feb 19, 2022 4:01 pm

I have only visited Egypt once (two weeks in 1992), but generally liked being there. I was in principle part of a group tour, but just used the transport and hotels and participated in one pyramid excursion, otherwise I did my own thing.

The biggest problem by far was the irritating street vendors, but I didn't exactly hide my intention not to buy anything from them, which it made it harder for them to lure me into haggling sessions. I did one exception: I did buy a couple of small glass flacons as a souvenir for my mother, and during the session I showed the vendor a shiny new Danish 20 crown which he liked very much. OK, then we both had something the other wanted and the haggling ended at a reasonable level in which the shiny coin was part of the payment. Apart from that - no haggling and no souvenir buying apart from items with a fixed price like entry fees or supermarket items or bus or train tickets.

In Luxor I stayed close to Karnak, i.e. some distance from the town center, and therefore I saw the same vendors and felucca fellahs every day, and we got on reasonably friendly terms - I told them that I wouldn't dream of buying anything like a felucca trip during my present lifetime, and then they asked whether I might do so in my next life. I'm not sure that Islam operates with reincarnation, but then I followed up in the same vein: maybe I would own a yacht in my next life, or the government might have made fellucca trips free or illegal or the Nile could have dried up.... a new variation every day.

In short: Egypt has lots of things to see, but you have to be very prudent in your dealings with the commercial sector.
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Re: Vacation in Egypt

Postby Dodger » Sat Feb 26, 2022 2:33 pm

That's neat Information, Cavesa. I checked the blog and the other material you mentioned.
We booked a Hotel and decided to have a really chill all-inclusive vacation, which minimizes the dangers. Realistically I'll learn a few bits in the last months or so, but that's fine. I'm a bit concerned about what I read here, because my Girlfriend and her whole family is super relaxed about any possible dangers. She was already there, her mother and Sister as well - maybe because this was mostly in Hotels with occasional trips outside? I'm certainly not a all-inclusive kind of guy, never did it in thirty year of my live. But you gotta try, right? I'm certainly interested in visiting ancient temples in Luxor.
Thanks also for reminding me on the vaccination;)

Hey Iverson, that's sounds irritating. I guess I can deal with haggling (a word that I didn't knew in English before) if it's only one day or so. I want to visit something in Luxor as well. What I took from you was: Never buy something w/o a fixed price if you don't have the stamina to haggle.
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