Camino del éxito versus FSI Spanish Basic

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Speakeasy
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Camino del éxito versus FSI Spanish Basic

Postby Speakeasy » Sun Oct 14, 2018 8:40 pm

Preamble
Recently, I purchased a set of 15 CDs under the name “Camino del éxito.com”. Before doing so, I read the few available Amazon Customer Reviews and the two HTLAL discussion threads which briefly discussed this product, visited the company’s website, which is also identified as “StudySpanish.com”, and read through a surprisingly-lengthy list of (purportedly) independent reviews of this product. The CD package that I purchased did not contain any printed materials: however, the CDs themselves displayed an invitation to visit the company’s website for a complete transcript (see below), which I did.
Camino del Exito 0.JPG

I requested a copy of the transcript to the CDs via the Contact Us portal of the company’s website and, shortly thereafter, received an Email advising me that I must first purchase a Premium Membership to their Spanish course after which I would be directed to a section where I could pay for and then download the transcript. Now then, the idea of paying a minimum of 99 $US for the privilege of purchasing a transcript to the audio CDs did not sit well with me (yes, I recognize that the purchase of the membership would have procured me a 6-month access to the Spanish course; however, I already had the audio files in hand). As I had made contact with the company, I decided to direct the conversation towards the oft-reported link between their course and the FSI Spanish Basic course. Because the matter is not (yet) clear on the company’s website, I decided to file this report.

Camino del éxito / StudySpanish
The links to website are near the bottom of this report. The website is both appealing and easy to navigate. The About Us section informs the reader that the company was launched in 1998 and that, over the years, it has provided web-based services to millions of Spanish students and teachers. In 2009, the company changed hands and the new owner, who has many years of experience in IT, effected a major update to the website and how it functions. Three native Spanish-speaking collaborators are also identified. The company is registered as Study Languages, LLC, Haymarket, Virginia, U.S.A.
Camino del Exito 1.JPG

Memberships and Pricing
Free and Premium membership options are available for both Students and Teachers. As far as I can tell from the information available on the website, while the audio files can be downloaded, the transcriptions, notes on grammar, et cetera cannot. Online and Download access periods and prices are shown below.
Camino del Exito 2.JPG

Camino del éxito versus FSI Spanish Basic
The Product Review and other sections of the website contain lengthy statements concerning the unparalleled effectiveness of the method, favourable comparisons to classroom Spanish courses, et cetera. Although a general description of the course levels is offered, there are very few details concerning the materials themselves or the approach to teaching. Nevertheless, the Free Sample section contains information which caught my attention suggesting that the lessons include dialogs, listen & repeat exercises, substitution drills, replacement drills, translation drills, and variation drills, all of which are reminiscent of the audio-lingual method. Given the enormous investment required to develop a complete audio-lingual course, I found myself wondering whether or not this course was just another recycled version of the FSI Spanish Basic course, a matter which I attempted to clarify in an Email exchange with the company, as follows:

Speakeasy: “Before sending you my request for the transcript to the old Camino del éxito CDs, which I purchased on a whim from a reseller of odds-and-ends on eBay, I searched the internet for information on this title and came upon some ancient posts suggesting that the original version of your course was a derivative of the well-known 1960’s era FSI Spanish Basic course. However, having tried the “free samples” on your website, the sound files did not evoke my memories of the FSI course, a matter which only increased my curiosity. Now then, when you say “we now have brand new audios for all three levels of Camino del Éxito”, am I to conclude that you have retained the general approach to teaching that was used in the FSI course (the audio-lingual method), but that you have rewritten the dialogues and sentence-pattern drills? Now, this would be newsworthy! Should you be in a position to confirm that the Camino del Éxito course is no longer a variant of the FSI Spanish Basic course, a Premium Membership becomes immediately more interesting!”

Camino del Exito: “Camino del Exito is not a clone to the FSI Spanish course. It is true that is based on the original course of the FSI course, but years of development and investements have been put into Camino del Exito, over 24 years. We took the original audios and structure and we had them recorded by a team of professional voices in Latin America. The audios are high quality, and we now offer three different levels: beginners, intermediate and advanced. What makes Camino del Exito unique and very effective is the fact that we built 110 grammar lessons that complement each of the audio units in those three levels of the audio course. Each audio unit for CDE will link the user to the appropriate grammar lessons that complement the conversational skills taught during that unit. This makes the course extremely complete, as it teaches not only the conversational skills to learn Spanish, but also the grammar, which is the foundation to properly learn a language. FSI and Camino del Exito are linked, but Camino del Exito is now the luxury version of the old FSI course, much more complete and efficient.”


Nota Bena!
A carefully reading of the above Email exchange suggests that the matter has not really been clarified; that is, to my question: "am I to conclude that you have retained the general approach to teaching that was used in the FSI course (the audio-lingual method), but that you have rewritten the dialogues and sentence-pattern drills?", the reply was: "We took the original audios and structure and we had them recorded by a team of professional voices in Latin America." Granted, they added notes on grammar, but the very specific question as to the dialogues and sentence-pattern drills has not yet been answered. Addendum: Please refer to "Update-1".

Links to the Camino del éxito / StudySpanish website
http://www.caminodelexito.com/
https://studyspanish.com/camino

Comments?
Has anyone had experience with the “Camino del éxito / StudySpanish” course or know of someone who has? All comments are welcome.

EDITED:
Tinkering.
Addendum to "Nota Bena"
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Last edited by Speakeasy on Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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dgc1970
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Re: Camino del éxito versus FSI Spanish Basic

Postby dgc1970 » Mon Oct 15, 2018 2:14 am

https://studyspanish.com/demos/free-sample-dialog

This is word for word the same dialog of Unit 3 in the FSI course.

https://studyspanish.com/demos/substitution

Same for the substitution drills.

https://studyspanish.com/demos/replacement

Same with the replacement drills All the samples are from Unit 3 word for word.

I'm too lazy to double check everything else but I think it's safe to say that everything is word for word. If this was sold for less money it would be worth the immensely improved audio.
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dgc1970
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Re: Camino del éxito versus FSI Spanish Basic

Postby dgc1970 » Mon Oct 15, 2018 2:22 am

I'm thinking of emailing them an offer of $50. Maybe they'll go for it if I include the link to the free FSI site. The audio is remarkably better.
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Speakeasy
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Re: Camino del éxito versus FSI Spanish Basic

Postby Speakeasy » Mon Oct 15, 2018 2:58 am

dgc1970 wrote:I'm thinking of emailing them an offer of $50...
It is certainly worth trying! Nevertheless, when I requested a copy of the transcript to accompany the CDs that I had purchased (even though I had purchased them on eBay, Camino del éxito would have received the initial sales revenues when the CDs were put into circulation), their reaction was to suggest that I first purchase a Premium Membership after which they would direct me to a section of the website (not available to unregistered visitors) where I could purchase the transcripts (the price of which should have been included in the price of the CDs). This suggests to me that your negotiations with Camino del éxito will be short-lived. Good luck, all the same! Please let us know how all this works out.
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dgc1970
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Re: Camino del éxito versus FSI Spanish Basic

Postby dgc1970 » Mon Oct 15, 2018 6:11 pm

Speakeasy wrote:
dgc1970 wrote:I'm thinking of emailing them an offer of $50...
It is certainly worth trying! Nevertheless, when I requested a copy of the transcript to accompany the CDs that I had purchased (even though I had purchased them on eBay, Camino del éxito would have received the initial sales revenues when the CDs were put into circulation), their reaction was to suggest that I first purchase a Premium Membership after which they would direct me to a section of the website (not available to unregistered visitors) where I could purchase the transcripts (the price of which should have been included in the price of the CDs). This suggests to me that your negotiations with Camino del éxito will be short-lived. Good luck, all the same! Please let us know how all this works out.


I was told I could buy the entire program at full price and then use only the audio. :roll:

Upon closer inspection they only have the updated audio up to unit 45.
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Speakeasy
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Re: Camino del éxito versus FSI Spanish Basic

Postby Speakeasy » Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:01 pm

Camino del éxito versus FSI Spanish Basic: Update-1
My initial report on the Camino del éxito Spanish course was based on my searches on the Internet, comments on the HTLAL, a visit to the company’s website, which included playing the Free Trial sets, and my exchange of Emails with the company. However, I had not yet listened to the my set of CDs and compared the recordings to the original FSI Spanish Basic course, something that I have just completed.

Origins of the Camino del éxito Spanish course
Track01 of CD1 contains the following introductory statement: “Welcome to Spanish Learning Resources Camino el éxito, a course designed for the serious Spanish student. The course, which focuses on Spanish as a spoken language, is based on a course developed by the Foreign Service Institute of the Department of State, the same course used to train U.S. Diplomatic Personnel …”

CD Audio Recordings
The 15 CDs that I purchased cover the first 15 lessons of the course, one lesson per CD. Each lesson begins with (a) a reminder that the transcript and other materials are available on the company’s website and (b) a general comment on the difficulties of learning a foreign language and encouragement to adopt a regular practice schedule. The voice-over sets the stage for the lesson, explaining the action that is about to take place in the dialogue. Similar to the Barrons’ Mastering Spanish version of the FSI Spanish Basic course, “Culture Capsules” are included in the audio recordings. As far as I can tell, the dialogues and practice sets have not been modified as had been done, for example, in the Platequemos version of the FSI Spanish Basic course. Rather, the dialogues and exercise sets are identical to those of the original FSI Spanish Basic course.

A nice feature of the CD recordings is that, the dialogues, exercises, and other recorded materials have been split into shorter segments, as Barrons had done with their version of the FSI Spanish Basic course. However, the audio tracks in the CDs do not appear to have been re-recorded; rather, they are the original FSI recordings. As the CDs are imprinted ©1999, it is likely that any re-recording took place more recently.

Website Audio Recordings
In my exchange of Emails with Camino del éxito, the company’s represantant commented: “We took the original audios and structure and we had them recorded by a team of professional voices in Latin America. The audios are high quality …” dcg1970 has kindly confirmed my initial impression that the audio recordings on the Camino del éxito website do, indeed, seem to have been re-recorded.

Transcripts
Transcripts of the audio recordings are available “on screen” via the Camino del éxito website, within the individual lessons. However, while a printable copy of the transcripts is available for downloading, it must be purchased (price unknown at this time).

Conclusion
The company’s statement “Camino del Exito is not a clone to the FSI Spanish course.” is superficially correct in that the course is not a genetic copy of the original. The company’s point of view is supported by the fact that the audio portion of the course has been re-recorded and that notes on Spanish grammar have been incorporated into the lessons. Nevertheless, taking into consideration the course content (the dialogues and exercise sets), some might find the “not a clone” statement a little misleading.

EDITED:
Formatting.
Typos.
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cjango
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Re: Camino del éxito versus FSI Spanish Basic

Postby cjango » Mon Dec 13, 2021 3:55 am

Speakeasy wrote:Camino del éxito versus FSI Spanish Basic: Update-1
Similar to the Barrons’ Mastering Spanish version of the FSI Spanish Basic course,


I remember finding the Barron's course when I was a teenager but I could never afford the second level. Eventually I found the FSI recording on the internet and loved them. I've also dabbled in Camino and Platiquemos since the recordings are a little different. Are there other versions of the FSI program? I'm wondering if there's a list somewhere of all the different incarnations of FSI Spanish Basic.
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ilmari
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Re: Camino del éxito versus FSI Spanish Basic

Postby ilmari » Mon Dec 13, 2021 11:44 am

I'm wondering if there's a list somewhere of all the different incarnations of FSI Spanish Basic.

http://dicendipublishing.com
https://forum.language-learners.org/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=2574

Full disclosure: I'm the author of this version:)
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cjango
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Re: Camino del éxito versus FSI Spanish Basic

Postby cjango » Mon Dec 13, 2021 4:47 pm

ilmari wrote:
I'm wondering if there's a list somewhere of all the different incarnations of FSI Spanish Basic.

http://dicendipublishing.com
https://forum.language-learners.org/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=2574

Full disclosure: I'm the author of this version:)


I've come across that iBook before but I've mostly just used the old pdfs. It would be nice to be able to copy and paste from the text to make Anki flashcards though. What kind of typos did you find in the originals?

I'm mostly wondering if there are other commercial programs for sale that are pretending to be original or have renamed it but are actually just FSI.
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