How I have been using Clozemaster

[Expugnator]

I have been willing to write this post ever since I came back from the last vacations where all I could do each day was using Clozemaster. As a result, I increased considerably my daily usage. Even when I got back to normal studying, I decided to keep using it as a man asset of my learning language mix.

The greatest improvement in the basic version (I don't have the pro one) has been the constant addition of new languages with graded tracks. You get to study the 100, 200, 500 most common words in a reasonably coherent order. It works like a shortcut (or a sidetrack) to fluency and has the potential to save time with plain reviewing of beginner's textbooks and/or with creating one's own Anki decks.

As I study several languages, I realized I can employ different tactics to different subgroups (please refer to my profile for full listing). These are the patterns I could identify so far:

Wanderlust Opaque Language's Warm Up
Clozemaster helped me solve an immediate problem: to quench my thirst for adding new languages. I have a fixed list of the languages I'll be studying next, but I don't have time slots available for structurally adding resources such as beginner's textbooks. With Clozemaster, at less than 5 minutes a day I can slowly expose myself to the basic constructs of the languages I want to learn. It also serves as a warm-up and a heads-up for when I actually start learning those languages. I'll then be able to make a better use of the other material such as textbooks, because the extremely frequent vocabulary will be taken care of, and so I'll be able to focus on grammar and the bordering, next-level vocabulary within each lesson of the occasional textbook. I only add languages that Clozemaster seems to take good care of, due to an early idea I have of how the language works, or the basic levels being basic enough. Currently I'm doing Romanian, Turkish and Czech. I tried Indonesian, Hungarian, Hebrew and Finnish, but zero knowledge simply won't work.

How I study: Most common words, multiple choice.
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B1ish Opaque Languages
These are languages I have been studying for long but still having trouble improving. I am still stuck at my initial approach: random, multiple choice turns. Text input wouldn't be that practical yet, even if I were supposed to start back at the most common words, because of the too high/over 70% mistakes ration. Current I have Mandarin, Estonian and Georgian at this category. Despite the inconvenience of inputting hanzi either at the phone or desktop at such an app, I might consider also doing the most common (sorted by HSK levels) tracks for it. Estonian is here just because there are very few sentences and no lists by common words. I actually have a higher, B2ish level on Georgian but it has even fewer sentences, so I'm just about to master all of it as well.

How I study: Random, multiple choice.
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B1+/B2ish Opaque Languages
These are languages that started as opaque but which I have near basic fluency in reading. They're also languages with a huge gap between passive and active skills. Clozemaster is helping me consistently bridge this gap. I had started them at the random, multiple choice mode and I keep to it, but as a later development I'm doing a final set of text input sessions starting with the most common words, with focus on activating my skills. It's working, Languages listed here: German, Russian.

How I study: Random, multiple choice; then most common words, text input at the end of the daily sessions.

B2 From Opaque to Transparent Languages
These are languages that started opaque but now are approaching fluency. It consists only of Norwegian right now, actually. Norwegian sentences at random would be too easy for multiple choice, and yet too hard for text input. So I'm doing only text input, but starting at the lowest level with unseen sentences (from the time I only did random, multiple choice) and then at later sessions going back for activating more repeatedly at the lower levels until reaching mastery. So, the basic idea is seeing all the new sentences by order of frequency while mastering the already seen ones by order of frequency too, but at lower levels.

How I study: Most common unseen, text input; then most common yet to master, text input at the end of the daily sessions.

B2 False Beginner and Almost Transparent Languages
These would be Romance-based languages where I have a previous knowledge but which I hadn't used before on Clozemaster nor have studied actively since my daily routine. Currently it consists of Esperanto. I am a false-beginner (A2ish) and I'm doing only text input starting from most common words, currently aiming at reaching 100% seen first. Eventually I'll start reviewing by working on mastering the earlier levels.

How I study: Most common unseen, text input.

A2ish Opaque Languages
I started Modern Greek at random, but when increasing my Clozemaster usage I decided it's better to work on it through the most common first path. I'm doing both multiple choice and text input. The new, unseen higher levels are multiple choice, and then I go on consolidating the earlier levels through text input, which was a struggle already at the second level but has been proved really effective. Greek is the first language at which I'm not allowing for the passive X active gap to widen, and this alone is enough credit to be given to Clozemaster for. Why not do just like Esperanto, text-input only? Because Esperanto is almost Romance, and Greek is more opaque.

How I study: Most common unseen, multiple choice; then most common yet to master, text input, from the earlier levels.

Transparent languages
These are the strong, transparent Romance languages French, Spanish and Italian. Until my aforementioned holidays, I thought it wouldn't be efficient to use Clozemaster on them. I can understand nearly everything, after all. Then I gave random, text-input a try and I noticed it's really being useful. Going through levels would be too easy, and starting on a higher level would beat my completionist mind, so random that is. Why not include Esperanto here? Because it's less opaque and has its own, unique grammar and word formation.

How I study: Random, text input.

My approach to Clozemaster is a compromise among my lack of sympathy to SRS or frequency lists, my appreciation for graded input, my need for activating my languages in a more practical way and the convenience of the application. Others may have different approaches, and we should all keep an eye open for new features on the app.

[crush]

How long have you been doing this? And how have you noticed your progress? I tried Clozemaster a year or two back when it was still fairly new, it was interesting, but the multiple choice was way too easy and the text input was a bit of a pain because of multiple possibilities (is it coche or carro?), weird translations, or just plain wrong translations. And it felt like i was just wasting my time with multiple choice.

How have you used it for Mandarin? I'm not too concerned about Mandarin, but i would like to use it for Cantonese. Unfortunately, most of my target languages have relatively few sentences (1-3,000). I wonder if i wouldn't just have a better time using it with one of the larger languages (maybe German or even Greek).

[Expugnator]

How long have you been doing this? And how have you noticed your progress?

I started the full set above 1 1/2 months ago. Before that, I only did random , multipli choice sessions on Estonian, Norwegian, Mandarin, German, Russian and Greek. I've noticed progress both in passive and in active skills for the languages I mentioned at the first post of the thread.

I tried Clozemaster a year or two back when it was still fairly new, it was interesting, but the multiple choice was way too easy and the text input was a bit of a pain because of multiple possibilities (is it coche or carro?), weird translations, or just plain wrong translations. And it felt like i was just wasting my time with multiple choice.

You're right that multiple choice becomes too easy, too fast, but I find it quite useful for my Mandarin, Estonian and even Russian; that is, for any non-transparent language. Doing it for a language you already understand fully thanks to your linguistic background would be overkill, indeed. The translation issues exist, they are more of a problem with some languages than with others (I'd name Italian being worse than French then Spanish on that matter), but since I'm not a beginner anyway I can deal with it and I think the benefits overcome those small issues. Those Romance decks have been particularly contrastive, it almost feels like I'm focusing on the differences and learning to keep each of these (plus Portuguese) apart, which is a feat on its own.

How have you used it for Mandarin? I'm not too concerned about Mandarin, but i would like to use it for Cantonese. Unfortunately, most of my target languages have relatively few sentences (1-3,000). I wonder if i wouldn't just have a better time using it with one of the larger languages (maybe German or even Greek).

I am focusing on reading, on solving ambiguity for the most common hanzi. So I've been only doing multiple choice. For multiple choice I've been doing random words, and I noticed it helped me parse longer sentences, which in turn is helping me read subtitles faster on the series I'm watching. I'm paying attention to meaning, hanzi and pinyin, the way I've always worked on Mandarin. I'm probably not giving it the attention it deserves yet, but even so I noticed a considerable improvement on texts such as the one I'm listening/reading. Yesterday I did text input for the HSK 1 hanzi and I noticed it helps me get used to a more natural, typical phrasing. I expect my active skills to improve as I move onto HSK 2 and HSK 3 for text input.

[Tristano]

Thank you very much for this post!
I find it very clear.
Do you ever use ignore sentence or set to mastered? I set to mastered all the very trasparent ones because my goal is being able to read as soon as possible and transparent phrases (that for me are the ones where I understand all the words without needing to use the context to make guesswork) I can anyway read so I don't need to study them. But that is my own way of course. I'm curious what is your strategy here.

Another question is if you use only your c1+ languages as a base or if you use weaker languages to try to improve both at the same time. I have a "mezza idea" of doing text input on Dutch (b2+) with German base (I don't know German).

[Expugnator]

Do you ever use ignore sentence or set to mastered? I set to mastered all the very trasparent ones because my goal is being able to read as soon as possible and transparent phrases (that for me are the ones where I understand all the words without needing to use the context to make guesswork) I can anyway read so I don't need to study them. But that is my own way of course. I'm curious what is your strategy here.

My goal starts as transparency but then shifts to production. In the case of transparent languages, it's all production,

I totally despise the SRS aspect of it just like I don't use Anki or Memrise. What I like about Clozemaster is its progressive aspect. You have a goal. For each word, you master it once you get it correct 4 times. You lose percentage when you answer it wrongly. My goal is to turn everything green/mastered, but Clozemaster provides los of checkpoints: I can for example master the first 500 most common words first, for opaque languages.

Bear in mind that from being able to read to reading at natural speed and/or to producing there's a steep slope. Italian and now Spanish taught me that.

Another question is if you use only your c1+ languages as a base or if you use weaker languages to try to improve both at the same time. I have a "mezza idea" of doing text input on Dutch (b2+) with German base (I don't know German).

I avoid this, laddering, with Clozemaster, because I want to work intensively on each sentence. I want to go for detail in my L2 and thus I don't want to get distracted by analyzing L1s as well. That's why I only use English. Whenever possible, Portuguese. So I let go of much larger Spanish-English, French-English, Italian-English decks for Portuguese-based ones. I confess I did this also out of a feeling that less is more in this case; some decks are overinflated but then you get bunches of sentences that differ only through pronoun gender and formality while teaching the same nuclear words - nouns and verbs, and I find it a waste of time to do, like, nearly identical sentences 80 times instead of drilling new nouns or verbs in the meantime. This is critical with the German and Russian deck, not surprisingly two large ones that probably got their numbers inflated through this expedient.

[Xmmm]

Hi Expug,


I've been using Anki for a couple weeks to see why it's so recommended, and I don't think it's for me. Feels like homework.

So I read your post and downloaded the Clozemaster app. But I'm not sure I understand how to use it.

I selected the fast track to fluency for Russian, multiple choice. That's 44 thousand words. And I played with it for half an hour and did 330 reps ... and got about 90% right. Does this mean multiple choice is too easy me? One thing I noticed is if a verb is required, they often give you four options only one of which is a verb. So you can often get them right without actually learning the word.

Also, it looks like going through multiple choice once would take about 60 hours, so "mastering" would take about 240 hours. That's a big chunk of time.

I read your posts on how to use Clozemaster but they were too subtle. Allow me to ask stupidly.

If you were a B1 would you be doing fast track to fluency at 90% accuracy, or type-it-out with much lower accuracy? I assume the later but want to check before I do anything drastic.

Thanks!

[Xmmm]

I guess I will try your instructions for B1+ opaque.

I will do random, multiple choice on the "fast track for fluency" and text input on the most common 5,000.

Anyway, thanks for the idea ...

[Expugnator]

I guess I will try your instructions for B1+ opaque.

I will do random, multiple choice on the "fast track for fluency" and text input on the most common 5,000.

Anyway, thanks for the idea ...

That. Or even:

I don't know exactly what your level is. I can't read Russian properly yet, so I do random for multiple words. Then I start over for text input. But like I wrote on my log, the deck is too extensive. You spend too much time on repeated words.

I'd recommend you to do multiple choice also through most-common levels. You can ignore the levels on which you are working on text input. Like, in theory, you could start multiple choice for 2000 most common and text input on 100 most common and keep working till they 'met'. Just don't waste too much time on the first level because it's too repetitive and rather easy. Don't wait till mastering for the first level, text input. I'll be doing just 'viewed'/played (= turning everything into yellow).

[lusan]

Thanks for your comments on the use of Clozemaster. I did not know about it. I like it very much. I will include it in my study routine.

My plan for Polish:
1. Translate L1 to L2, choosing from the multiple choice menu.
2. Read ALOUD L2. It seems like a good practice.
*reduce repetitions to 4. Maybe 3 would be better. Why not to 1 and to use it for general vocabulary review ?

How many sentences a day do you recommend? 50, 100?

[Expugnator]

I do 40 sentences for multiple choice and then at another round 40 more for those I do text input. But then I'm working on 10+ languages. In your case probably 100 sentences in Polish wouldn't be that much. Just be sure to stop when you feel you have trouble focusing and absorbing new vocabulary.