Sites/Apps like Readlang, Lingq, Lingua.ly, etc.

All about language programs, courses, websites and other learning resources
User avatar
language2015
Yellow Belt
Posts: 91
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 4:08 am
Languages: English (N) French (A0) Spanish (A0)
x 106

Re: Sites/Apps like Readlang, Lingq, Lingua.ly, etc.

Postby language2015 » Fri Jan 22, 2016 4:15 am

Soclydeza wrote:I've come across a few sites/app like these and wanted to hear opinions from anyone that's used them and also others like them. I've played with Readlang, which is great, and am thinking about getting the premium membership, but I want to know what others I should look at before I settle one into my routine. Any thoughts?


I had a premium membership to readlang and it was awesome. Worked like a dream. I might restart my membership.

My only problem with readlang is the translator. The readlang translator for spanish wasn't perfect.
0 x
Why did I decide to become a polyglot when I knew I am a super lazy student?!?

Anki or Die

: 700 / 10000 Mine 10,000+ Spanish Sentences
: 700 / 10000 Mine 10,000+ French Sentences
: 80 / 10000 Anki All Of It

User avatar
Allison
Orange Belt
Posts: 248
Joined: Fri Dec 18, 2015 4:21 am
Location: New York City, NY, US
Languages: English (native), Spanish (high intermediate-ish), American Sign Language (ASL) (I dabble occasionally)
Language Log: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=5177
x 411

Re: Sites/Apps like Readlang, Lingq, Lingua.ly, etc.

Postby Allison » Fri Jan 22, 2016 4:56 am

MorkTheFiddle wrote:You can also sign up for a free account of LWT at Benny Lewis' site.

Not anymore you can't. There was an announcement on December 19th that support for LWT on FI3M would be phased out. Newly registered accounts can't log in to the LWT system.

Of course, that fact is seemingly non-publicized, so I only found this out after registering an account at FI3M solely for the purpose of trying out LWT. :roll: I don't know if you need an account to see this thread, but the announcement is here: http://www.fluentin3months.com/forum/lwt-basic-questions/lwt-to-be-phased-out-new-registrations-impossible/
6 x

User avatar
Serpent
Black Belt - 3rd Dan
Posts: 3657
Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2015 10:54 am
Location: Moskova
Languages: heritage
Russian (native); Belarusian, Polish

fluent or close: Finnish (certified C1), English; Portuguese, Spanish, German, Italian
learning: Croatian+, Ukrainian; Romanian, Galician; Danish, Swedish; Estonian
exploring: Latin, Karelian, Catalan, Dutch, Czech, Latvian
x 5181
Contact:

Re: Sites/Apps like Readlang, Lingq, Lingua.ly, etc.

Postby Serpent » Fri Jan 22, 2016 9:26 am

language2015 wrote:
Serpent wrote:In terms of ethics, the founder of LingQ got banned from old HTLAL twice, and the lingQ forum automatically replaces the letters lwt with asterisks.
lol

Please explain why.

I need to know.
Mostly for promoting/defending LingQ :roll: His usernames were Zhuangzi and Švejk.
Or do you mean why they don't allow posts about lwt? Because it's a free open-source alternative and they claim it isn't the same thing.
1 x
LyricsTraining now has Finnish and Polish :)
Corrections welcome

Xmmm
Blue Belt
Posts: 821
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2015 1:19 am
Languages: ru it tr
x 2221

Re: Sites/Apps like Readlang, Lingq, Lingua.ly, etc.

Postby Xmmm » Fri Jan 22, 2016 3:50 pm

Serpent wrote:Or do you mean why they don't allow posts about lwt? Because it's a free open-source alternative and they claim it isn't the same thing.


http://lwt.sourceforge.net/

Note the author's admission that it's "inspired by" LingQ. I realize in legal terms reverse-engineering is legal and ideas can't be copyrighted, but in ethical terms someone please tell me the difference between:

1. Watch a great movie, make a digital copy put it on torrents
2. See a great software app, reverse engineer and code it up so "it's the same thing", put it on source forge.

I realize some people on this board are okay with torrents, and they should be okay with LWT. I understand this point of view, although I don't share it.

Other people think torrents is bad but love LWT. Can you explain the difference? Is it just that copying movies takes a few minutes and coding LWT probably took a few weeks? I don't get this point of view at all.

I'm happy to pay $10 a month to the guy that thought up the original idea and enriched to world, and reward the innovator.

As for the founder of LingQ getting banned from the form, I agree the ban was justified as the board terms of use were clearly violated despite warnings.
1 x

Ещё раз сунешь голову туда — окажешься внутри. Поняла, Фемида? -- аигел

User avatar
rdearman
Site Admin
Posts: 7260
Joined: Thu May 14, 2015 4:18 pm
Location: United Kingdom
Languages: English (N)
Language Log: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=1836
x 23316
Contact:

Re: Sites/Apps like Readlang, Lingq, Lingua.ly, etc.

Postby rdearman » Fri Jan 22, 2016 4:01 pm

Xmmm wrote:
Serpent wrote:Or do you mean why they don't allow posts about lwt? Because it's a free open-source alternative and they claim it isn't the same thing.


http://lwt.sourceforge.net/

Note the author's admission that it's "inspired by" LingQ. I realize in legal terms reverse-engineering is legal and ideas can't be copyrighted, but in ethical terms someone please tell me the difference between:

1. Watch a great movie, make a digital copy put it on torrents
2. See a great software app, reverse engineer and code it up so "it's the same thing", put it on source forge.

I realize some people on this board are okay with torrents, and they should be okay with LWT. I understand this point of view, although I don't share it.

Other people think torrents is bad but love LWT. Can you explain the difference? Is it just that copying movies takes a few minutes and coding LWT probably took a few weeks? I don't get this point of view at all.

I'm happy to pay $10 a month to the guy that thought up the original idea and enriched to world, and reward the innovator.

As for the founder of LingQ getting banned from the form, I agree the ban was justified as the board terms of use were clearly violated despite warnings.


The difference in this case is the LWT software is basically a re-write. So to use your movie analogy, he didn't make a digital copy. He hired all the same actors, script writers, production crew, stuntmen, cameras, and sound people. He remade the movie from scratch, had it edited, did post edit production, had it manufactured on to DVD and released it. That is the difference. If he'd hacked into LingQ and downloaded the source code an put it up as a torrent, then he is stealing and it would be the same as making a copy of a movie.

Reverse engineered software isn't the same as the original, anymore than if you reproduced the Mona Lisa in watercolour. Your watercolour would be an original it just looks like the Mona Lisa. LWT was created using the authors own creative powers and it is a different piece of intellectual property. If the first guy who though of an idea was the owner of the idea, then you'd never see more than one western, there would only be one mystery book, there would only be one type of tire for a car, etc.
19 x
: 26 / 150 Read 150 books in 2024

My YouTube Channel
The Autodidactic Podcast
My Author's Newsletter

I post on this forum with mobile devices, so excuse short msgs and typos.

User avatar
MorkTheFiddle
Black Belt - 2nd Dan
Posts: 2141
Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2015 8:59 pm
Location: North Texas USA
Languages: English (N). Read (only) French and Spanish. Studying Ancient Greek. Studying a bit of Latin. Once studied Old Norse. Dabbled in Catalan, Provençal and Italian.
Language Log: https://forum.language-learners.org/vie ... 11#p133911
x 4886

Re: Sites/Apps like Readlang, Lingq, Lingua.ly, etc.

Postby MorkTheFiddle » Fri Jan 22, 2016 4:12 pm

Allison wrote:
MorkTheFiddle wrote:You can also sign up for a free account of LWT at Benny Lewis' site.

Not anymore you can't. There was an announcement on December 19th that support for LWT on FI3M would be phased out. Newly registered accounts can't log in to the LWT system.

Of course, that fact is seemingly non-publicized, so I only found this out after registering an account at FI3M solely for the purpose of trying out LWT. :roll: I don't know if you need an account to see this thread, but the announcement is here: http://www.fluentin3months.com/forum/lwt-basic-questions/lwt-to-be-phased-out-new-registrations-impossible/

Thank you for this update.
Although I do have an account at Fi3M, I did not have to log in to see the message that you reference. That post does have a link to a video with LWT installation instructions. I have not seen that video, so I can't vouch for its effectiveness.
0 x
Many things which are false are transmitted from book to book, and gain credit in the world. -- attributed to Samuel Johnson

Xmmm
Blue Belt
Posts: 821
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2015 1:19 am
Languages: ru it tr
x 2221

Re: Sites/Apps like Readlang, Lingq, Lingua.ly, etc.

Postby Xmmm » Fri Jan 22, 2016 4:14 pm

rdearman wrote:The difference in this case is the LWT software is basically a re-write. So to use your movie analogy, he didn't make a digital copy. He hired all the same actors, script writers, production crew, stuntmen, cameras, and sound people. He remade the movie from scratch, had it edited, did post edit production, had it manufactured on to DVD and released it. That is the difference. If he'd hacked into LingQ and downloaded the source code an put it up as a torrent, then he is stealing and it would be the same as making a copy of a movie.

Reverse engineered software isn't the same as the original, anymore than if you reproduced the Mona Lisa in watercolour. Your watercolour would be an original it just looks like the Mona Lisa. LWT was created using the authors own creative powers and it is a different piece of intellectual property. If the first guy who though of an idea was the owner of the idea, then you'd never see more than one western, there would only be one mystery book, there would only be one type of tire for a car, etc.


I sort of take your point. But ethically reverse-engineering can a gray area.

For example, if I thought HP was the greatest book ever written so I wrote "Mary Otter and the Philosopher's Stick" and it took me a year and I wrote every word and I self-published it with my own money using all my own unique characters (who very often resemble characters in that other book I love so much), Rowling would sue me for every nickel I had. There have been such cases.

So ... the world being the way it is ... I suppose it's no problem if people want to use LWT. Personally, I still wouldn't but obviously it's legal so what do I know (or care).

But Serpent was implying that LingQ was somehow unfair to suppress discussion of LWT on the LingQ forum. This to me, is unfair. To continue the JK Rowling example, she is personally okay with fan fiction that is posted for free online where no one will read it, but will sue the pants off anybody who tries to make a buck off it. In the case of LingQ, LWT can draw away paying customers, so they have to be aggressive not let it being promoted on their own site. This seems reasonable to me.
2 x

Ещё раз сунешь голову туда — окажешься внутри. Поняла, Фемида? -- аигел

User avatar
Serpent
Black Belt - 3rd Dan
Posts: 3657
Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2015 10:54 am
Location: Moskova
Languages: heritage
Russian (native); Belarusian, Polish

fluent or close: Finnish (certified C1), English; Portuguese, Spanish, German, Italian
learning: Croatian+, Ukrainian; Romanian, Galician; Danish, Swedish; Estonian
exploring: Latin, Karelian, Catalan, Dutch, Czech, Latvian
x 5181
Contact:

Re: Sites/Apps like Readlang, Lingq, Lingua.ly, etc.

Postby Serpent » Fri Jan 22, 2016 4:32 pm

He wasn't just inspired but also disappointed by LingQ. I never bothered to install LWT but it seems like it's better. Which would mean it's indeed not the same thing :D I'm mostly frustrated by their vague unfounded statements - feel free to say LingQ is better, but how about actually trying LWT and saying which advantages it lacks? (I mean the LingQ staff here, not regular members like you who are satisfied with what they use and see no need to try LWT)

I'm sure HP actors have contract clauses preventing them from playing HP-related roles for another studio. Also, if you wrote a parody you could publish it. And btw JKR actually says she loves shippers. Okay, not the same situation, but surely by saying positive things about shippers she makes people more aware of fanfiction, to the point that they may decide they don't want to read her original work? :D (not necessarily the main HP books but other small projects she did like Fantastic Beasts) Furthermore, influential people's ability to win lawsuits that John Doe would lose is hardly an argument...

LingQ wasn't as revolutionary as it may seem. Yandex has been offering similar services for a while, I don't think they even know about LingQ or LWT.
1 x
LyricsTraining now has Finnish and Polish :)
Corrections welcome

User avatar
rdearman
Site Admin
Posts: 7260
Joined: Thu May 14, 2015 4:18 pm
Location: United Kingdom
Languages: English (N)
Language Log: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=1836
x 23316
Contact:

Re: Sites/Apps like Readlang, Lingq, Lingua.ly, etc.

Postby rdearman » Fri Jan 22, 2016 4:34 pm

Xmmm wrote:
rdearman wrote:The difference in this case is the LWT software is basically a re-write. So to use your movie analogy, he didn't make a digital copy. He hired all the same actors, script writers, production crew, stuntmen, cameras, and sound people. He remade the movie from scratch, had it edited, did post edit production, had it manufactured on to DVD and released it. That is the difference. If he'd hacked into LingQ and downloaded the source code an put it up as a torrent, then he is stealing and it would be the same as making a copy of a movie.

Reverse engineered software isn't the same as the original, anymore than if you reproduced the Mona Lisa in watercolour. Your watercolour would be an original it just looks like the Mona Lisa. LWT was created using the authors own creative powers and it is a different piece of intellectual property. If the first guy who though of an idea was the owner of the idea, then you'd never see more than one western, there would only be one mystery book, there would only be one type of tire for a car, etc.


I sort of take your point. But ethically reverse-engineering can a gray area.

For example, if I thought HP was the greatest book ever written so I wrote "Mary Otter and the Philosopher's Stick" and it took me a year and I wrote every word and I self-published it with my own money using all my own unique characters (who very often resemble characters in that other book I love so much), Rowling would sue me for every nickel I had. There have been such cases.

So ... the world being the way it is ... I suppose it's no problem if people want to use LWT. Personally, I still wouldn't but obviously it's legal so what do I know (or care).

But Serpent was implying that LingQ was somehow unfair to suppress discussion of LWT on the LingQ forum. This to me, is unfair. To continue the JK Rowling example, she is personally okay with fan fiction that is posted for free online where no one will read it, but will sue the pants off anybody who tries to make a buck off it. In the case of LingQ, LWT can draw away paying customers, so they have to be aggressive not let it being promoted on their own site. This seems reasonable to me.


You bring up some interesting points about copyright, which have nothing to do with languages, so I'm going to drop my side of the conversation and leave you with this interesting article. http://www.rightsofwriters.com/2011/04/ ... can-i.html

BTW: If your "Mary Otter and the Philosopher's Stick" is shown as a parody, then JK is out of luck and won't make a dime off you. :)
1 x
: 26 / 150 Read 150 books in 2024

My YouTube Channel
The Autodidactic Podcast
My Author's Newsletter

I post on this forum with mobile devices, so excuse short msgs and typos.

User avatar
lusan
Green Belt
Posts: 463
Joined: Sat Aug 15, 2015 1:25 pm
Location: Greensboro, NC, USA
Languages: Spanish(Native)
English (Naïve)
French(Intermediate)
Italian(Intermediate)
Polish(In Alcatraz)
x 985

Re: Sites/Apps like Readlang, Lingq, Lingua.ly, etc.

Postby lusan » Fri Jan 22, 2016 4:49 pm

I like and use readlang because I can use it mobile wherever there is a hot spot. I specially love that it helps me reading webpages withe a web reader.
I used linqg once but they have so many server problems that I gave up.
LWT is nice but I already use readlang.
0 x
Italian, polish, and French dance
FSI Basic French Lessons : 10 / 24 17 of 24 goal


Return to “Language Programs and Resources”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 2 guests