The Nature Method Courses

All about language programs, courses, websites and other learning resources
galaxyrocker
Brown Belt
Posts: 1120
Joined: Mon Jul 20, 2015 12:44 am
Languages: English (N), Irish (Teastas Eorpach na Gaeilge B2), French, dabbling elsewhere sometimes
Language Log: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=757
x 3328

Re: The Nature Method Courses

Postby galaxyrocker » Mon Aug 22, 2022 9:48 am

lowsocks wrote:After watching the video, it is not clear, to me at least, how these courses were meant to be used. Is one meant to puzzle out the grammar on one's own? That might be intriguing for some. Rather like a field linguist, documenting a previously unknown language, who must work with monolingual native speakers. But I am not sure every learner is ready for such a task.

On the other hand, if there are grammars and other aids available as part of the course (which seems to be the case for Lingua Latina), then how is the course so very different from some traditional courses, where the lessons are centered around a graded set of texts?


The extra materials for Lingua Latina do not include a grammar, but more just further exercises developing on what you learned and more practice dialogues with some output stuff iirc. The whole point is to notice patterns in the language based on the text itself. It starts with very basic things like "John is a man" and works upwards from there using, as mentioned, lots of pictures. There's not meant to be any explicit grammatical instruction in the nature method. For languages at least close to your own, so for most of those from Western Europe, it's quite intuitive. It'll be interesting to see how the Turkish and Azerbaijani ones go that Ayan Academy is working on, as well as the Czech which is a bit farther away from English than the others that've been released even if it's still IE
4 x

polllyglot
White Belt
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed Apr 20, 2022 10:40 pm
Languages: Latin, French, English
x 21

Re: The Nature Method Courses

Postby polllyglot » Mon Aug 22, 2022 10:52 am

lowsocks wrote:
chanchy34 wrote:
galaxyrocker wrote:
aspartamo wrote:German one hasn't been completely digitized


So there are more than 24 lessons in it? I have lesson 1-24. I've been in contact with the person I got them from, but haven't heard anything back from them recently.

Where can I find the digitized German course?
It might be available here:
https://www.patreon.com/posts/index-for-and-in-63544985

However, it seems you will need to become a patreon supporter to access it. (I have not tried it myself.) You will also need to become a supporter, to access most of the chapter videos. (Only a few are freely and publicly available on youtube).

Also, note some of the comments further down that page. Although they have been able to fix some things, it sounds like chapters 9 to 12 are still difficult to read. (Perhaps Galaxyrocker has a better copy for those particular chapters?)

From what they say, it seems that 36 chapters were all that were ever produced for the German course. Now, according to their shopify page for the printed copies, the German course is only 253 pages. Compare this with the English course (742 pages), French (1124 pages), and Italian (765 pages). In comparison, it looks like German might be around one third of a full course. It strikes me that the German course was probably never completed, to the point where it would cover all the basic grammar of the language.

So, much as I would like to have a complete, full Nature Method course for German (and many other languages too), my feeling is that this particular course may not be worth chasing after. But admittedly, I have not been able to examine the books myself. I would be interested to hear the opinions of others.


253 pages of the German book is equivalent to ~506 pages of the English one since, just like LLPSI, the interlinear phonological script is omitted. The last edition of the pdf file they uploaded looks pretty nice and clean.
1 x

lowsocks
Orange Belt
Posts: 134
Joined: Mon Oct 23, 2017 4:00 am
Location: Southern Ontario, Canada
Languages: English (N), French (beginner), German (beginner)
x 353

Re: The Nature Method Courses

Postby lowsocks » Mon Aug 22, 2022 10:11 pm

polllyglot wrote:253 pages of the German book is equivalent to ~506 pages of the English one since, just like LLPSI, the interlinear phonological script is omitted. The last edition of the pdf file they uploaded looks pretty nice and clean.
Thanks for the information, and also to jeff_lindqvist and galaxyrocker. I'm considering buying it.

My main issue now is that I dislike subscription based services, with automatically recurring fees. I would prefer to just purchase a copy of the pdf file, once, and be finished with the financial transaction. Though purchasing the printed copy is an alternative, I suppose.

Has anyone been able to examine a printed copy of the German course? Is the text clear?
1 x
One need not hope in order to undertake, nor succeed in order to persevere.

galaxyrocker
Brown Belt
Posts: 1120
Joined: Mon Jul 20, 2015 12:44 am
Languages: English (N), Irish (Teastas Eorpach na Gaeilge B2), French, dabbling elsewhere sometimes
Language Log: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=757
x 3328

Re: The Nature Method Courses

Postby galaxyrocker » Tue Aug 23, 2022 1:59 pm

Here's a list of other books in this method. Some probably out of date: https://www.reddit.com/r/classicalliber ... ct_method/
2 x

lowsocks
Orange Belt
Posts: 134
Joined: Mon Oct 23, 2017 4:00 am
Location: Southern Ontario, Canada
Languages: English (N), French (beginner), German (beginner)
x 353

Re: The Nature Method Courses

Postby lowsocks » Tue Aug 23, 2022 6:21 pm

All right. I have decided to purchase the pdf, at least for German, and possibly for all their languages. However, I am unsure of what they are selling. For example, for the "All Languages" option, you would receive:
All the Nature Method recordings in English, French, Italian, Spanish, German, Russian, Danish and Turkish.

- Ad-free Recordings
- Exclusive content
- Early access
- Your Name at the End of the Videos
But does it include the pdf files? This is really what interests me. Can I download the pdf to my computer, with no DRM, and be free, for example, to print out a copy to study away from a computer? Any advice would be most appreciated.
0 x
One need not hope in order to undertake, nor succeed in order to persevere.

polllyglot
White Belt
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed Apr 20, 2022 10:40 pm
Languages: Latin, French, English
x 21

Re: The Nature Method Courses

Postby polllyglot » Wed Aug 24, 2022 8:42 am

lowsocks wrote:All right. I have decided to purchase the pdf, at least for German, and possibly for all their languages. However, I am unsure of what they are selling. For example, for the "All Languages" option, you would receive:
All the Nature Method recordings in English, French, Italian, Spanish, German, Russian, Danish and Turkish.

- Ad-free Recordings
- Exclusive content
- Early access
- Your Name at the End of the Videos
But does it include the pdf files? This is really what interests me. Can I download the pdf to my computer, with no DRM, and be free, for example, to print out a copy to study away from a computer? Any advice would be most appreciated.


That tier includes everything they share on patreon, including the pdf files.
1 x

lowsocks
Orange Belt
Posts: 134
Joined: Mon Oct 23, 2017 4:00 am
Location: Southern Ontario, Canada
Languages: English (N), French (beginner), German (beginner)
x 353

Re: The Nature Method Courses

Postby lowsocks » Thu Aug 25, 2022 2:37 am

polllyglot wrote:That tier includes everything they share on patreon, including the pdf files.
Thanks for all your help. I now have a pdf copy of Deutsch Nach Der Naturmethode from Ayan Academy.

The printing is, for the most part, good. But chapters 9 to 12 are quite rough looking, though still readable. The book is missing pages 73 and 74, at the end of chapter 12. Fortunately, to judge from other chapters, these probably just contained some practice exercises for chapter 12, and should not seriously impair the usefulness of the book. (My guess is that chapters 9 to 12 were in one booklet that was in very bad condition, and had lost the final two pages. If anyone has those two pages, it would be nice to send Ayan Academy a copy.)

I do not know German well enough at this point to judge whether all the basic grammar is covered. But it looks like fairly complex sentences are being used by the end. In my opinion, this is probably a worthwhile book to obtain, whether the natural method interests you, or if you are just looking for some additional basic reading material for practice.
2 x
One need not hope in order to undertake, nor succeed in order to persevere.

Beli Tsar
Green Belt
Posts: 384
Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2018 3:59 pm
Languages: English (N), Ancient Greek (intermediate reading), Latin (Beginner) Farsi (Beginner), Biblical Hebrew (Beginner)
Language Log: https://forum.language-learners.org/vie ... =15&t=9548
x 1294

Re: The Nature Method Courses

Postby Beli Tsar » Thu Aug 25, 2022 3:55 pm

galaxyrocker wrote:
lowsocks wrote:After watching the video, it is not clear, to me at least, how these courses were meant to be used. Is one meant to puzzle out the grammar on one's own? That might be intriguing for some. Rather like a field linguist, documenting a previously unknown language, who must work with monolingual native speakers. But I am not sure every learner is ready for such a task.

On the other hand, if there are grammars and other aids available as part of the course (which seems to be the case for Lingua Latina), then how is the course so very different from some traditional courses, where the lessons are centered around a graded set of texts?


The extra materials for Lingua Latina do not include a grammar, but more just further exercises developing on what you learned and more practice dialogues with some output stuff iirc. The whole point is to notice patterns in the language based on the text itself. It starts with very basic things like "John is a man" and works upwards from there using, as mentioned, lots of pictures. There's not meant to be any explicit grammatical instruction in the nature method.

Except this isn't quite true... every chapter of Lingua Latina has explicit grammar instruction (in Latin) and explicit grammar drills (in Latin); the Companion volumes offer grammar in English; and the Excercita etc. offer more grammar drills.

Inferring grammar from context is a significant part of the method, but explicit instruction is there to back it up and make sure you don't miss things. It's a belt-and-braces approach, using both methods in tandem. Maybe that is why it works...
3 x
: 0 / 50 1/2 Super Challenge - Latin Reading
: 0 / 50 1/2 Super Challenge - Latin 'Films'

galaxyrocker
Brown Belt
Posts: 1120
Joined: Mon Jul 20, 2015 12:44 am
Languages: English (N), Irish (Teastas Eorpach na Gaeilge B2), French, dabbling elsewhere sometimes
Language Log: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=757
x 3328

Re: The Nature Method Courses

Postby galaxyrocker » Thu Aug 25, 2022 4:09 pm

Beli Tsar wrote:
galaxyrocker wrote:
lowsocks wrote:After watching the video, it is not clear, to me at least, how these courses were meant to be used. Is one meant to puzzle out the grammar on one's own? That might be intriguing for some. Rather like a field linguist, documenting a previously unknown language, who must work with monolingual native speakers. But I am not sure every learner is ready for such a task.

On the other hand, if there are grammars and other aids available as part of the course (which seems to be the case for Lingua Latina), then how is the course so very different from some traditional courses, where the lessons are centered around a graded set of texts?


The extra materials for Lingua Latina do not include a grammar, but more just further exercises developing on what you learned and more practice dialogues with some output stuff iirc. The whole point is to notice patterns in the language based on the text itself. It starts with very basic things like "John is a man" and works upwards from there using, as mentioned, lots of pictures. There's not meant to be any explicit grammatical instruction in the nature method.

Except this isn't quite true... every chapter of Lingua Latina has explicit grammar instruction (in Latin) and explicit grammar drills (in Latin); the Companion volumes offer grammar in English; and the Excercita etc. offer more grammar drills.

Inferring grammar from context is a significant part of the method, but explicit instruction is there to back it up and make sure you don't miss things. It's a belt-and-braces approach, using both methods in tandem. Maybe that is why it works...


Ah. I was unaware the companion volumes offered grammar in English. Thanks for that information. As for what I meant as a 'grammar', it was mostly there was no grammar reference guide (though I guess there is!) like you often see for other languages.
1 x

Beli Tsar
Green Belt
Posts: 384
Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2018 3:59 pm
Languages: English (N), Ancient Greek (intermediate reading), Latin (Beginner) Farsi (Beginner), Biblical Hebrew (Beginner)
Language Log: https://forum.language-learners.org/vie ... =15&t=9548
x 1294

Re: The Nature Method Courses

Postby Beli Tsar » Fri Aug 26, 2022 9:32 am

galaxyrocker wrote:
Beli Tsar wrote:
galaxyrocker wrote:
lowsocks wrote:After watching the video, it is not clear, to me at least, how these courses were meant to be used. Is one meant to puzzle out the grammar on one's own? That might be intriguing for some. Rather like a field linguist, documenting a previously unknown language, who must work with monolingual native speakers. But I am not sure every learner is ready for such a task.

On the other hand, if there are grammars and other aids available as part of the course (which seems to be the case for Lingua Latina), then how is the course so very different from some traditional courses, where the lessons are centered around a graded set of texts?


The extra materials for Lingua Latina do not include a grammar, but more just further exercises developing on what you learned and more practice dialogues with some output stuff iirc. The whole point is to notice patterns in the language based on the text itself. It starts with very basic things like "John is a man" and works upwards from there using, as mentioned, lots of pictures. There's not meant to be any explicit grammatical instruction in the nature method.

Except this isn't quite true... every chapter of Lingua Latina has explicit grammar instruction (in Latin) and explicit grammar drills (in Latin); the Companion volumes offer grammar in English; and the Excercita etc. offer more grammar drills.

Inferring grammar from context is a significant part of the method, but explicit instruction is there to back it up and make sure you don't miss things. It's a belt-and-braces approach, using both methods in tandem. Maybe that is why it works...


Ah. I was unaware the companion volumes offered grammar in English. Thanks for that information. As for what I meant as a 'grammar', it was mostly there was no grammar reference guide (though I guess there is!) like you often see for other languages.

And you are certainly right, in that that many people use the series as if there was no grammar in that way!
2 x
: 0 / 50 1/2 Super Challenge - Latin Reading
: 0 / 50 1/2 Super Challenge - Latin 'Films'


Return to “Language Programs and Resources”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests