iTalki

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Perchta
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iTalki

Postby Perchta » Sat Mar 28, 2020 9:33 pm

Hi!

A few questions about how iTalki works appeared in my mind today (when browsing the app and having nothing else to do than thinking about my future and so):

Do you have any experience with the teachers? Any recommendations how to find a good teacher?

How do the lessons work? I mean I think I’ve read somewhere that on iTalki you only find the teacher and you have to connect by other means, like Skype. So how do I learn what way the teacher communicates? I didn’t find any mention about it in the teachers’ profiles... What to do before the lesson (I mean on the technical side)?

What is to be a "language partner" about? Ok, I agree, it’s about what you let it be about. But is usually meant to be about? I’m too shy to be too much personal (that means even talking on Skype with a person I don’t know that is not supposed to be my teacher or something so official). However, I’m thinking about finding someone to practice the language with, mainly by writing and then, if I feel enough comfortable, maybe via an online conversation... I hope it’s clear a bit what I mean...

Thank you for any answer or just any experience with iTalki!
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rdearman
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Re: iTalki

Postby rdearman » Sat Mar 28, 2020 10:46 pm

If you only want to write then iTalki probably isn't for you. Mainly it is teachers and tutors who you pay to speak with you and to teach. If you're more comfortable writing you might want to go to a site like conversationexchange.com and look for a penpal.

You do speak with the iTalki tutor via skype or hangouts since the lessons are virtual, but basically it is the same as hiring a local tutor who lives near you. The only difference it you do it online. Most tutors on the iTalki site have a video introduction and most tell you how they teach or tutor. Community tutors (who are normally cheaper) normally don't have any teaching qualifications, where as the professional tutors/teachers would have some kind of teaching qualification.
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Re: iTalki

Postby Speakeasy » Sat Mar 28, 2020 11:20 pm

Hello, Perchta. While you could not have known, as is clear from the list of discussion threads below, the questions which you raised have been discussed numerous times in the past. By the way, owing to the vagaries of the “Search” function, locating all of these discussion threads would not be a simple task; I prepared the list below from my own collection of bookmarks (with a view to saving myself some time should someone else ask this question, I included your own question “iTalki” in the list below).

I suggest that you begin by reading through the “iTalki Wiki” which is available via the “Wiki” tab at the top of the main page of the forum. Then, and I realize that it would be require quite a bit of effort, I suggest that you read through the discussion threads below. They all address issues raised in your questions.

iTalki - Wiki

Ideas on how make use of time with a study partner - LLORG - June 2018

Alternative to italki - LLORG - April 2019

Anybody learn from a private tutor? - HTLAL - December 2011

Are most tutors useless for advanced learners? - LLORG - May 2017

Are online teachers a good substitute for face to face lessons? - LLORG - March 2019

experience with unlimited tutoring services? - LLORG - June 2017

Find conversation partners - LLORG - June 2016

Finding a Language Coach - HTLAL - August 2012

How to prepare for a first Skype session? - LLORG - January 2016

iTalki - LLORG - March 2020

Language exchange partner - LLORG - January 2019

Learning to speak via skype - LLORG - June 2018

Skype Classes - LLORG - August 2016

Skype Lessons - Tips for Best Workout with Native Speaker? - LLORG - October 2015

Skype Speaking Practice - HTLAL - March 2014

Tutoring activities to activate or automate - LLORG - October 2016

when to start with tutors -- is it suitable for pure beginners? - LLORG - May 2017

Why do teachers like to teach? (rant) - LLORG - November 2016
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Cavesa
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Re: iTalki

Postby Cavesa » Sun Mar 29, 2020 1:10 am

Basically, the experience depends on what tutor you find, whether they fit your needs and expectations. You'll find posts describing experience ranging from totally terrible to absolutely awesome.

The problem is finding the tutor. Italki unfortunately sucks at giving people enough useful info about the tutor before actually paying and investing also your time into trying someone out. A better profile example is Verbling, another tutoring site. But on Italki, almost everybody has an extremely generic profile like "hi, I am X, teaching Y, I am great with learners of all levels and all ages and will totally customise everything to your needs." Well yeah, as long as your level is beginner and your customisation needs mean either conversation practice or generic course content. Nothing against that, teaching standard stuff well is great, but I feel like laughing every time I read a review like "oh, the teacher totally customised the lesson to my specific needs, which is tourism".

The search filters are not useful either. Many categories are missing completely, such as "advanced", "writing", etc. And I guess most tutors check everything, to widen the pool of potential customers. I already mentioned Verbling, that site is an example of well made profiles and filters. I haven't tried the tutors there yet (there are less nice aspects. Such as being advertised cheaper sample lessons, and getting the normal price as soon as I registered. It doesn't make them look trustworthy).

The student reviews are unfortunately mostly useless too. A million copies of "a great teacher, so nice and encouraging". Well yeah, nice behavious should be automatic. But you'll find really few good reviews. But a certain indicator can be the number of students, and I think you can also see a number of lessons per student (so, whether the tutor keeps the students). But you still won't know, what kind of students.

As we have a bit similar profile (native Czech speakers, high level English and French), I'm afraid you'll find just as few language exchange opportunities as me. Czech is simply not in demand among the natives of the languages on our lists. And there are so many native English and French speakers around, that few people would opt for us instead.

Writing is unfortunately another lost cause. I have no clue why there is no platform offering writing tutoring. You know, I'd pay per page or per a unit, get assignments at the appropriate level, write them when I can, send them in, get the feedback within a week. Unfortunately, the only way to get your writing checked on Italki or even in person, is bringing it and using the paid together time on this. It is sad, but I believe tutors just find writing correction to be too much work. But penpals might be findable.

You can definitely succeed. Out of the few tries, I definitely can say there are good tutors (they just didn't fit my needs and goals). But finding someone suitable is hard and time (+money) consuming.
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Re: iTalki

Postby tungemål » Sun Mar 29, 2020 9:29 am

Perchta wrote:Hi!
Do you have any experience with the teachers? Any recommendations how to find a good teacher?


Yes, I have used Italki... I am currently taking lessons in German.
I just browsed through all the profiles (well not all) and chose a person that had some qualifications, teaching experience, was not too expensive, and in addition a person that was a good fit for me personally. For the last bit you really need to do a trial lesson, but you will get an impression from their introduction video. I chose someone who is near me in age, same gender, and have a voice similar to mine. (probably not too important). And if you've got some common interest it helps with the conversation!

How do the lessons work? I mean I think I’ve read somewhere that on iTalki you only find the teacher and you have to connect by other means, like Skype.
...


I use skype. There is also a video call system on Italki but I haven't tried it.

What is to be a "language partner" about? Ok, I agree, it’s about what you let it be about. But is usually meant to be about? I’m too shy to be too much personal (that means even talking on Skype with a person I don’t know that is not supposed to be my teacher or something so official). However, I’m thinking about finding someone to practice the language with, mainly by writing and then, if I feel enough comfortable, maybe via an online conversation... I hope it’s clear a bit what I mean...


It can be scary to talk with a stranger especially in a foreign language, and I was nervous the first times. For some reason it is worse over video than in person. But I suggest just to dive into it! What is the worst that could happen?

And what it is about... either you define what it is going to be about, or the teacher will do it for you. Usually they've got a lot of exercises to give you.
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tungemål
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Re: iTalki

Postby tungemål » Sun Mar 29, 2020 9:36 am

Cavesa wrote:Writing is unfortunately another lost cause. I have no clue why there is no platform offering writing tutoring. You know, I'd pay per page or per a unit, get assignments at the appropriate level, write them when I can, send them in, get the feedback within a week. Unfortunately, the only way to get your writing checked on Italki or even in person, is bringing it and using the paid together time on this. It is sad, but I believe tutors just find writing correction to be too much work. But penpals might be findable.


Yes! I too would like to be able to have a text corrected. Something like an essay a page long, corrected by someone with some qualifications. If one can't find people on Italki that will do it, maybe there are translating services that would take a job like that. I wonder what that would cost.
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Perchta
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Re: iTalki

Postby Perchta » Sun Mar 29, 2020 9:08 pm

Thank you all!

rdearman wrote:If you're more comfortable writing you might want to go to a site like conversationexchange.com and look for a penpal.

I’ve already tried this. Most of those who were learning Czech were living in the Czech Republic, so "Let’s meet in a café and practice the language" was either in the first message, or in the second one. When I wrote that I’m not interested in meeting them until I know them a bit more, they usually stopped answering.

Speakeasy wrote:While you could not have known, as is clear from the list of discussion threads below, the questions which you raised have been discussed numerous times in the past. By the way, owing to the vagaries of the “Search” function, locating all of these discussion threads would not be a simple task; I prepared the list below from my own collection of bookmarks (with a view to saving myself some time should someone else ask this question, I included your own question “iTalki” in the list below).

I suggest that you begin by reading through the “iTalki Wiki” which is available via the “Wiki” tab at the top of the main page of the forum. Then, and I realize that it would be require quite a bit of effort, I suggest that you read through the discussion threads below. They all address issues raised in your questions.


Thank you for your useful links (that includes this post btw)! It’s not an effort to read all this (but it’ll take a bit of time, I admit that). I did try the "Search" button, but it showed me 260 pages of results, mainly logs like "I had a iTalki lesson and it was great". When on the third page and still not able to find almost any general ideas, I decided to post this... Maybe I’m not good in searching. So thank you!

Cavesa wrote:But on Italki, almost everybody has an extremely generic profile like "hi, I am X, teaching Y, I am great with learners of all levels and all ages and will totally customise everything to your needs."

Yes, that’s what I realized too... So I wanted to know if there is someone with some experience to give me advice how to pick up a good one among those tons of teachers.

Cavesa wrote:Writing is unfortunately another lost cause. I have no clue why there is no platform offering writing tutoring. You know, I'd pay per page or per a unit, get assignments at the appropriate level, write them when I can, send them in, get the feedback within a week. Unfortunately, the only way to get your writing checked on Italki or even in person, is bringing it and using the paid together time on this. It is sad, but I believe tutors just find writing correction to be too much work.

I use Lang-8 and iTalki for writing corrections. But for my English and French, I know this is only to correct the worst mistakes and it doesn’t help me to progress. On Lang-8, there’s one user (Doumka) whose corrections were great - not only he found all the mistakes, but proposed how to say it in a really advanced French with complicated sentence structure. He have never written there a single text, he only did corrections. I don’t know about any platform dedicated to professional writing corrections either, that’s pity...
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Cavesa
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Re: iTalki

Postby Cavesa » Sun Mar 29, 2020 9:40 pm

Perchta wrote:
Cavesa wrote:But on Italki, almost everybody has an extremely generic profile like "hi, I am X, teaching Y, I am great with learners of all levels and all ages and will totally customise everything to your needs."

Yes, that’s what I realized too... So I wanted to know if there is someone with some experience to give me advice how to pick up a good one among those tons of teachers.

There is no way. You can either find a recommendation like "JaneDoe is great". And if you trust the source, you can search specifically for JaneDoe. Or you need to spend time and money on a number of test lessons. You can find some luck at the second try, or you might not be satisfied after a dozen. The overall quality and type of problems also seems to vary between the languages. The problems some Chinese learners (for example) have described are different from what I've encountered, but totally belieavable.

Some time ago, someone from Italki's PR noticed my comments on reddit concerning this issue. The answered, asked a few more questions, gave me a few Italki dolars, and promissed to pass the feedback on, so that the ideas could be included in an update. They weren't. We didn't get even a few new filters to check.


Cavesa wrote:Writing is unfortunately another lost cause. I have no clue why there is no platform offering writing tutoring. You know, I'd pay per page or per a unit, get assignments at the appropriate level, write them when I can, send them in, get the feedback within a week. Unfortunately, the only way to get your writing checked on Italki or even in person, is bringing it and using the paid together time on this. It is sad, but I believe tutors just find writing correction to be too much work.

I use Lang-8 and iTalki for writing corrections. But for my English and French, I know this is only to correct the worst mistakes and it doesn’t help me to progress. On Lang-8, there’s one user (Doumka) whose corrections were great - not only he found all the mistakes, but proposed how to say it in a really advanced French with complicated sentence structure. He have never written there a single text, he only did corrections. I don’t know about any platform dedicated to professional writing corrections either, that’s pity...


I do not have an Lang8 account, and the site is closed for new users. But there are a few more places like this, for example eLingora. But that is still limited in some ways. Great for beginners and intermediates focusing on basic mistakes. As soon as you also need feedback on your style, on fitting the assignment, and other such things (typically exam writing preparation), these sites are useless. And it is only logical, nobody will spend too much time on a freely given feedback. And nobody with the right kind of background will do this for free.

But for some reason, these people do not want that much to do it for money either. Otherwise, we'd have a comfortable platform to submit texts for professional feedback.
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Re: iTalki

Postby rdearman » Mon Mar 30, 2020 9:45 am

I believe one member (iguanomon ??) paid for an online writing course, where the teacher did corrections on spelling, grammar, style, etc. That may be an option you'd want to explore.
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