A proposal for one-to-one Letter - Keyboard sign system

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Speakeasy
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Re: Let's rename the Numbers/and the other Signs on the keyboard/

Postby Speakeasy » Wed Jan 15, 2020 11:23 am

QWERTY is a keyboard design for Latin-script alphabets. The name comes from the order of the first six keys on the top left letter row of the keyboard (Q W E R T Y). The QWERTY design is based on a layout created for the Sholes and Glidden typewriter and sold to E. Remington and Sons in 1873. It became popular with the success of the Remington No. 2 of 1878, and remains in ubiquitous use.

Place your hands on the Home Row and type:
frf juj, frf juj, frf juj, frf juj, frf juj, frf juj,frf juj, frf juj, …

Now then, type after me: The quick brown fox jumps over the lazy grey dog.

Touch-typing 101, 102
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Re: Let's rename the Numbers/and the other Signs on the keyboard/

Postby Deinonysus » Wed Jan 15, 2020 11:28 am

What is the purpose of this? It sounds like a weird version of the major system, which is a method of creating mnemonics to memorize numbers. But that has nothing to do with keyboards.
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Re: Let's rename the Numbers/and the other Signs on the keyboard/

Postby Deinonysus » Wed Jan 15, 2020 2:16 pm

None of this explains the purpose of picking new names for numbers and symbols. Is it to help with memorization or learning? In that case, it may belong on this forum but you will need to elaborate and explain how it would be relevant to a language learner, because I don't understand the purpose.

If there is no purpose and you are just picking new names for fun, that doesn't have anything to do with language learning and this forum isn't the place for it.
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Re: Let's rename the Numbers/and the other Signs on the keyboard/

Postby SCMT » Wed Jan 15, 2020 2:26 pm

Speakeasy wrote:Now then, type after me: The quick brown fox jumps over the lazy grey dog.


For me in a 1980s semi-rural US middle school, the quick red fox jumped over the lazy brown dog. I guess you have to allow for regional differences in the colors of dogs and foxes.
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Re: Let's rename the Numbers/and the other Signs on the keyboard/

Postby Speakeasy » Wed Jan 15, 2020 4:35 pm

SCMT wrote: For me in a 1980s semi-rural US middle school, the quick red fox jumped over the lazy brown dog. I guess you have to allow for regional differences in the colors of dogs and foxes.
You may be right here, the Wikipedia version seemed a little incomplete to me and I inserted "grey" from a rather shaky memory (my touch typing training dates from the early sixties). In addition, I remember typing "jumped", not "jumps" as in the Wikipedia version. As to the colour of the fox, I would leave it to our resident expert, reineike, to adjudicate the matter.
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Re: Let's rename the Numbers/and the other Signs on the keyboard/

Postby Speakeasy » Wed Jan 15, 2020 5:09 pm

QWERTY Keyboard
I am surprised that the Wikipedia article does not mention a very serious effort in the 1960’s to replace the QWERTY keyboard layout with one more suited to the actual frequency of letters in English. I recall reading an advertisement for the revised keyword, promising faster typing speeds with fewer errors, explaining that the “new” design was actually similar to the “original” one which was not a success because it allowed the typists to type faster than the mechanical typewriters of the day permitted, thereby causing jamming of the mechanism. Since coaching the typists to type more slowly (that is, at a speed which would not exceed the equipment's mechanical limits) was judged to have irregular results and that the typists would naturally return to their maximum typing speed in any case, the “original” keyboard layout was rearranged so as to slow down the typists’ speed (that is, the QWERTY keyboard was modified so that some of the more frequently-occurring letters were placed under the least efficient fingers), thereby reducing the frequency of the keys jamming together. This is, essentially, the keyboard layout that we all inherited! The “new” design of the 1960’s, which allowed for faster typing, would have worked on the mechanically faster machines of the period. However, as millions of English-speaking typists, crossing several generations, had already taken their classes and were now in the workplace, and as most offices had all the typewriters they needed, convincing the owners to purchase new machines and the typists to adopt a new keyboard was simply unfeasible (they same problem would have presented itself for other languages which used a modified version of the QWERTY keyboard: too little, too late). As a result, today’s computer keyboards, which are still modelled on the “original (rearranged)” QWERTY keyboard design, are inefficient. However, as there are fewer “touch typists” around because technology has eliminated much of their work, and as most of us do our own typing (at speeds greatly inferior to the 100-plus word-a-minute which professional typists easily achieved), few of us take notice of the obsolete keyboard design. Owing to advances in technology, "Hunt and Peck" won out!

Waive15’s Proposed Changes to the Keyboard
I do not see how the proposed changes to the keyboard would increase the efficiency of its use (hence my initial QWERTY post). Rather, they would seem to place letters on the top row, which would have the effect of decreasing the typing speed and increasing the error rate.

EDITED:
Tinkering.
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Re: Let's rename the Numbers/and the other Signs on the keyboard/

Postby lowsocks » Wed Jan 15, 2020 7:20 pm

Speakeasy wrote:
SCMT wrote: For me in a 1980s semi-rural US middle school, the quick red fox jumped over the lazy brown dog. I guess you have to allow for regional differences in the colors of dogs and foxes.
You may be right here, the Wikipedia version seemed a little incomplete to me and I inserted "grey" from a rather shaky memory (my touch typing training dates from the early sixties). In addition, I remember typing "jumped", not "jumps" as in the Wikipedia version. As to the colour of the fox, I would leave it to our resident expert, reineike, to adjudicate the matter.
It seems that many people remember the sentence as using "jumped" rather than "jumps". But in fact, that doesn't quite work. You need "jumps" in order to have a sentence containing the letter "s". (Or else, change "dog" to "dogs"; or insert another word such as "sleeping", to give "...the lazy sleeping dog".)
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Re: Let's rename the Numbers/and the other Signs on the keyboard/

Postby SCMT » Thu Jan 16, 2020 12:30 am

lowsocks wrote:
Speakeasy wrote:
SCMT wrote: For me in a 1980s semi-rural US middle school, the quick red fox jumped over the lazy brown dog. I guess you have to allow for regional differences in the colors of dogs and foxes.
You may be right here, the Wikipedia version seemed a little incomplete to me and I inserted "grey" from a rather shaky memory (my touch typing training dates from the early sixties). In addition, I remember typing "jumped", not "jumps" as in the Wikipedia version. As to the colour of the fox, I would leave it to our resident expert, reineike, to adjudicate the matter.
It seems that many people remember the sentence as using "jumped" rather than "jumps". But in fact, that doesn't quite work. You need "jumps" in order to have a sentence containing the letter "s". (Or else, change "dog" to "dogs"; or insert another word such as "sleeping", to give "...the lazy sleeping dog".)


Yes, the exercise contained the word "jumps." However, I figured the fox vaulted the dog concurrently with my typing class in 1988, so I used the simple past to describe it. I believe the fox had jumped before, and I have heard the fox has jumped since, and I hope the fox will jump again. But that fox jumped then, as he probably jumps now. He would jump...

Ah, nevermind. I'm going to go review Spanish verb tenses again.
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Re: Let's rename the Numbers/and the other Signs on the keyboard/

Postby Serpent » Fri Jan 17, 2020 11:49 am

Thread moved to the multilingual room.
waive15 wrote:When someone makes English subtitles of a movie, some WORDS are not allowed/permitted. Usually are used the odd signs on the keyboard but RANDOMLY. This is a kind of standardization. Probably not the best solution but a some solution of a simple task.

Phone numbers: for telephone prefixes. Intentionally all numbers are CONSONANTS so syllables can be made for easy pronunciation.

There are already various spelling systems https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spelling_alphabet
However, this thread is not against the rules. If you don't think the system is useful, try your best to be constructive.

PS by the first part do you mean stuff like #%&(#% replacing insults?
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Re: A proposal for one-to-one Letter - Keyboard sign system

Postby Serpent » Sat Jan 18, 2020 12:06 am

yeah it was just a keymash lol.
Hmm I think in general the whole idea is that the insults or swear words swapped for characters like ¤#/)#% should not be readable. (Any euphemism eventually ends up being used as the word itself - a Russian example)
If a secret alphabet was necessary they would've created it already. When the audience needs to know which word it is, asterisks can be used: sn*w :lol:

In comic strips I've also seen punctuation characters used as unspecified swear words. This makes them easier to translate and also makes them accessible for a bigger audience, as everything is in the eye of the viewer :lol:
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