Candadian french?

[Dudeguyman]

Is there any significant difference between the French spoke in France, and the French in Canada? Specifically Montreal, Quebec.

[Querneus]

It's different enough that it's normal for French people coming to Quebec to say they have quite a bit of trouble understanding the locals.

I'd say the main differences are found in pronunciation and vocabulary/cultural references, less so in grammar (although there are differences there as well, much of what applies to informal spoken French in Paris grammatically also applies to Montreal French).

[sillygoose1]

The French in Montreal seems more comprehensible. Yes, there is a noticeable accent but once you learn some of the basics of Quebecois pronunciation and slang it isn't that bad. The real problem is outside of the cities, especially rural areas. I watched a movie recently called "Les affamés" and I'm not sure if they were purposely putting on a thick rural accent or not on purpose, but I couldn't understand a damn word. I felt like a total beginner again watching it.

[Speakeasy]

This is a recurring question on the forum and it is often posed by someone who is presently learning French. The replies often come from someone who is in a similar situation, who may have visited the Province of Québec, but who is neither a native-speaker nor a truly advanced learner of French and whose experience is somewhat limited. At times, these discussions lead to some misconceptions concerning the differences between “Canadian French” and “European French.”

When one chooses to speak of “Canadian French” and its differences to “European French”, it might be useful to think of “American English” and its differences both to “European English” and to the numerous variants within “American English.” That is, depending on which regional, socio-economic-ethic-linguistic subgroup one chooses as a point of reference, there will be a range of differences in pronunciation and usage when compared to any other subgroup. Who sets the standard? What gives them the authority to do so? Does a standard even exist?

Whether we are speaking of English, French, Spanish, or Portuguese as spoken and written in Europe compared to how these languages are spoken and written in the Americas, the major differences resolve around pronunciation. Speakers of these languages in the “European homelands” display significant, regional and socio-economic-cultural differences in pronunciation within England, France, Spain, and Portugal, as well as, to a certain extent, differences in usage. The same can be said for speakers in the Americas; that is, differences in pronunciation exist within the American populations. Nevertheless, native speakers of Europe and of the Americas, generally speaking, have very few difficulties understanding one another. In cases where they experience difficulties, these are invariably the result of lack of exposure to one another’s regional accent and, once acclimatised to the differences in pronunciation, communication flows quite freely.

I have been living in Québec -- in French -- for over thirty years. I have worked, lived, and travelled extensively both in “les régions” and in “la grande région de Montréal”; my wife is a Francophone “de souche”, as are all of our friends and acquaintances. Before my retirement, I communicated on daily basis with shop floor workers in the regions whose formal education ceased around the age of 15, with managers the vast majority of whom began their careers as professional engineers, and with senior professionals holding doctorates in economics and metallurgy. They were all born and raised in different regions of the Province and they all spoke with a “Québécois accent” which I assume they picked up as children. The vast majority of the professionals travelled frequently to France either on business or for pleasure and many of the production workers visited various regions of France on vacation. As for myself, my friends and my extended family, none of them ever reported having experienced any noticeable difficulties in communicating with the “French of France” and, in the few instances where communications were difficult, these were, without exception, a matter of pronunciation. The difficulties in comprehension tended to occur in the regions of France furthest from the political centre of the country.

Finally, as to the difficulties which someone who is learning French might experience in the Province of Québec – and I submit that such an individual would experience similar difficulties anywhere in the world where the French language is spoken – the perceived differences in pronunciation and usage are not related to the region from which one’s “interlocteur” comes; rather, they are much more a function of the socio-economic group in which the individual learned their native-tongue. Do “Boston Brahmans” sound like Boston taxi-drivers? Were they not raised in the same city?

‘Tis time for my morning nap!

EDITED:
Typos, formatting.

[Ani]

Finally, as to the difficulties which someone who is learning French might experience in the Province of Québec – and I submit that such an individual would experience similar difficulties anywhere in the world where the French language is spoken – the perceived differences in pronunciation and usage are not related to the region from which one’s “interlocteur” comes; rather, they are much more a function of the socio-economic group in which the individual learned their native-tongue.

I am always interested in your posts but I really can't follow what you're trying to say here. Maybe you can clarify?

[Speakeasy]

... I am always interested in your posts but I really can't follow what you're trying to say here. Maybe you can clarify?

First, thank you for not beating up on me! I have to admit that that was a pretty rambling post, even for me. Having created the mess, I’ll try to clean it up a little, please bear with me …

It was stated above that, in Quebec, the “real problem is outside the cities, especially rural areas…” Well, I disagree with this assertion. In my experience, the differences in pronunciation amongst native-speakers of French in Quebec do not vary much at all between the urban and rural areas. I believe that the preceding statement erroneously conflates regional pronunciation differences with pronunciation differences based on the speakers’ socio-economic-ethic-and-whatever-else-you-want-to-throw-into-the-mix group. To wit, …

Anyone who possesses an advanced level of competence in a given language, and who has extensive experience living and working in a large cosmopolitan centre where that language predominates, would readily acknowledge that a wide range of differences in pronunciation exists amongst the local native-speakers of that language and that these differences in pronunciation are, for the most part, based on the speakers’ socio-economic origins within the population of native speakers. Boston Brahmans and Boston Taxi Drivers share a common language, but no one possessing an advanced level of competence in American English would ever suggest that they pronounce the same “worhds/woids” in the same manner. The same holds true for Montreal and the regions of Quebec. In my experience, and that of my extended family and social group, the differences in pronunciation between the cities and the regions are almost imperceptible. We should bear in mind that, as is the case elsewhere, there has been a depopulation of the regions in Quebec in favour of the cities; the rural immigrants pass unnoticed, in terms of their pronunciation. The real differences in pronunciation, either within the urban centres or between the urban centres and the regions, are based on differences the socio-economic-whatever origins of the speakers.

I have read numerous comments on this forum, posted by well-intentioned students of French, almost all of whom could not pass a rigorous B2 level examination in the language, to the effect that, based on a short visit to the province, or even on an extended sojourn, they somehow acquired an in-depth knowledge of the French language as it is habitually used by native speakers in this province, in in the workplace, in all social contexts, in the media at every level, in all spheres of activity, and everywhere else in the province. Quite frankly, I often find myself in profound disagreement with their views and irritatingly so.

Having lived in the Province of Québec for over thirty years, having adopted French as my primary means of communication upon arrival, having immersed myself into the local culture, having lived and worked the province, having worked closely with people who could barely spell their own names and having been accepted by them as a companion worthy of their trust and confidence despite my “maudit Anglais” origins, having worked as a trusted advisor to senior economists, metallurgists, and sales and marketing managers and having been accepted into their ranks, having travelled throughout the Québec countryside, having married into a Québécois family, having been invited to speak at weddings and funerals in the community, and having developed the ability to distinguish between “true” Québec pronunciation from the self-derisive (wink, wink) “pronunciation populaire” and deliberately-exaggerated (for comedic effect) joual that one hears far-too-often on Québec television and which only locals or truly integrated long-term residents can appreciate, I reject the assertions of many students of French on this forum, who have precious little exposure to the Québécois, to their language, and to their culture, that they can make authoritative pronouncements on "Canadian French"; they simply cannot. C’est-tu donc clair?

I will not dignify “… French people coming to Quebec … say they have quite a bit of trouble understanding the locals …” with a reply.

Uh, er, did I say "rambling"?

EDITED:
Typos, bien entendu!
Formatting.