French audio -- life after Pimsleur?

[kulaputra]

Honestly, FSI. Some people find it dry, but it works. Just space it out and use another program concurrently.

[jstan]

Thanks again for all of your ideas. I pulled out my copy of Assimil to get a sense of my level relative to the content in French with Ease. Broadly, the material in the first half of the course seems quite easy to me; the next quarter of the course feels comfortable, but not easy; and the last quarter feels challenging: I didn't see any grammar that I've not yet studied and I can understand the written text pretty well, but it presents some vocabulary that I don't know and I struggled to understand some of it when listening to audio without the aid of reading. So, I think it the second half of Assimil might be worth my time. That said, it seems like a course that really needs to be done with the book I'm not sure how to work it into my schedule without pushing FIA out.

Adrianslont, thanks for suggesting those podcasts! I listened to a few of them and they are dead on for my level: challenging but not out of reach.

So, I am still a bit tempted to take on FSI. After doing 150 Pimsleur lessons I think that I can fairly claim that I'm able to tolerate pretty dry material. I'm considering doing FSI French Phonology as a next step. I've found a few posts on the forum about it, but it doesn't seem terribly popular. Are there any opinions on it here?

Thanks again to you all!

[jonm]

Hi jstan, just want to put one more intermediate French podcast on your radar. It's called Inner French. Each episode is about a half hour long, so the right length for your commute. Hugo, the podcaster, speaks slowly and clearly. And he discusses interesting topics. I find that I listen for pleasure, for interesting content, and then I pick up vocabulary and grammar patterns along the way. I see it as kind of a bridge to authentic material, since the content is genuinely interesting and wouldn't be out of place in a podcast for native speakers, but the French is more accessible. Oh, and there are transcripts too. I really enjoy it a lot and find it very motivating.

Edit: I agree with zjones (later in this thread and here) that the level is around A2/B1. I had estimated B1/B2, but I think that's too high. I think it's accessible at A2 and could be a real confidence boost.

[jstan]

trippingly, that podcast is awesome! I listened to the first three episodes and, like you said, it's something that I'd listen to for pleasure because it is actually interesting. The level is also very approachable -- I understand the gist of everything he says, and probably understand at least 75% of the content in detail. Really great suggestion!

[jonm]

So glad you like it! I find it easy to keep coming back to. Some of my language-learning activities I only really do when I'm feeling at least somewhat sharp, but I can put on an episode of Inner French just about anytime, even if I'm tired or out of sorts or something. It's like linguistic comfort food. It really helps that the content is interesting and that it has a warm tone. I'd say my comprehension is similar to what you describe, and it's motivating to be able to listen to a half hour of French and understand that much and be engaged in what's being discussed. Very happy to hear you're enjoying it!

[Ani]

I dislike FSI French phonology and would recommend against it. I did do the entire course and I did not find much benefit. I found pimsler gave me a better base pronunciation, only the first one (that's all that existed way way back when lol). If you want a true phonology course, I'd recommend Phonétique Progressive from CLE.
That said, I think you can jump into FSI French Basic without any interim material.

[kulaputra]

What didn't you like about FSI French Phonology? Pimsleur doesn't have a written component, it doesn't explicitly train pronunciation at all, it doesn't work with minimal pairs. FSI FP does all of those things.

[garyb]

Personally I wouldn't recommend FSI Phonology or Pimsleur for pronunciation. Pimsleur for the exact reasons Kulaputra just said - no explicit instruction so it relies entirely on the learner having a good ear - and Phonology is better than nothing but not very comprehensive despite being so boring (I also got very little benefit from it) and there are simply better resources out there. If I remember correctly, it teaches /œ/ and /ø/ as the same sound, for example.

In terms of general courses, Assimil and FSI Basic are probably both good choices. I prefer Assimil as it teaches more modern language and covers more subjects; FSI feels a bit formal and old-fashioned, but is hard to beat for making grammar more automatic. In Spanish I did Assimil then FSI, and I believe that worked well for me, although the language in Spanish FSI feels considerably less dated than in the French one.

[Ani]

Personally I wouldn't recommend FSI Phonology or Pimsleur for pronunciation. Pimsleur for the exact reasons Kulaputra just said - no explicit instruction so it relies entirely on the learner having a good ear - and Phonology is better than nothing but not very comprehensive despite being so boring (I also got very little benefit from it) and there are simply better resources out there. If I remember correctly, it teaches /œ/ and /ø/ as the same sound, for example.

I'm leaning towards no phonology is better than bad phonology
It's actually /ə/ and /ø/ that they merged, (maybe /œ/ too, I can't remember) and /e/ and /ɛ/ as well. I think that's a dangerous path that will come back to bite you. Basically sorting out those sounds is almost the only reason to do a pholology course, and they make it worse, not better.
The second reason to do pholology is rhythm/intonation. They have a bit but not enough for how long the course is.

[kulaputra]

No, I believe it only does that for the nasal variants of œ and ø that it teaches as the same, because it teaches an accent that does not have such a distinction. It does briefly point out, with audio that the distinction exists. Unless you really care about this distinction I'm not sure what the big deal is. Increasingly, the distinction is maintained by fewer and fewer French natives. In particular, standard Parisian French (a prestige dialect, as I'm sure you know) has eliminated that distinction, i.e. brun and brin sound the same.

I'm leaning towards no phonology is better than bad phonology
It's actually /ə/ and /ø/ that they merged, (maybe /œ/ too, I can't remember) and /e/ and /ɛ/ as well. I think that's a dangerous path that will come back to bite you. Basically sorting out those sounds is almost the only reason to do a pholology course, and they make it worse, not better.
The second reason to do pholology is rhythm/intonation. They have a bit but not enough for how long the course is.

Why sort out sounds if they've merged? What about the distinctions the course does sort out, e.g. /i/ vs. /y/ vs. /u/, or the tendency for English speakers to dipthongize everything?