Spanish Learning - Next step

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harikishore
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Spanish Learning - Next step

Postby harikishore » Tue Apr 10, 2018 8:22 pm

Lets say I pick up a commercially available Spanish learning course and complete it. I understand the language structure, rules, tenses etc and know what ever vocabulary that course provided.

The next biggest step is in expanding the vocabulary (mainly verbs, adjectives and adverbs) since a course will expose only very limited verbs (buy, sell, eat, understand, read, write etc) and use the same verb over and over again to explain all tenses etc. What's an effective way to do that. Simply pick up a word list and start memorizing words? Pick up a book or story and note down the words, get meaning and memorize it? I have a feeling that my "memory" is weak and I find it extremely hard to remember new vocabulary. Is it a normal feeling that everybody has?

Even before learning the first word in Spanish, I set a target to understand the below story some day.
https://www.odaha.com/antoine-de-saint-exupery/maly-princ/el-principito

I picked it now (after spending 1 year, learning a course and understanding everything the course taught) and I don't know 75% of the words in the first few pages. I've begun to note down the words, get its meanings and start memorizing. Is that the right way, or should I try something else before getting back to the above story?
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Re: Spanish Learning - Next step

Postby eido » Tue Apr 10, 2018 9:50 pm

Ah, is that "The Little Prince"? Never read it. It seems to have a lot of common words in it, though. One I can remember is "verdaderamente". I think you could solve your problem by trying to express yourself. What words are you missing? This word I mentioned is not necessarily something you'd need right away, but a common offshoot, if you could call it that, is "en verdad", or "really". That's a useful phrase. Know one, get the gist of another. If you get to knowing the more common words you use and how Spanish is similar to English, you'll be reading this story in no time. I'm no expert, though. I'm actually used to doing things the hard way.
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Re: Spanish Learning - Next step

Postby lavengro » Wed Apr 11, 2018 1:05 am

In terms of advancing your learning generally of Spanish beyond the commercial course you have finished, may I recommend FSI Spanish Basic. The price is right, and you will never for the remainder of your life have to prove your courage in any other way if you manage to get through this.

In support specifically of your goal of one day working through El principito, the following memrise course may be of interest to you (note: I have not tried this memrise course and accordingly am not vouching for it).

https://www.memrise.com/course/79164/el-principito/

Also, one of the forum members has published a bilingual version with audio - David Zweig.
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Re: Spanish Learning - Next step

Postby Jaleel10 » Wed Apr 11, 2018 8:47 am

I am probably not qualified to answer you. But I do remember a friend telling me about this method by Luca Lampariello. He studies languages in 3 phases. For the 2nd phase, which is what you're at probably; he does his version of bi-directional translation and a friend of mine who has bought (150$, ¡Joder!) and used said it is pretty helpful to him.

But here is a passage that my friend explain to me. This is phase 2, badly summarised.

Day 1, read part of document, then reread underline words he doesn't know and wants to learn. Then search up the definition/translation and write them on the outside of the page. Then reread the entire document after having found the translation/definitions. Day 3, he transfers said definitions on the side of the page from the paper he wrote them on onto a journal or notebook. He puts on one side the words in the target language and on the other half of his journal page in his native tongue. On Day 4 he looks at the target language definitions and tries to write them in his native language. On Day 5 he reverses the process, he looks at his native language and tries to write them in his target language.
On Day 6 he basically takes all of the words and makes a story out of it and tries to make them "Active" either in a live conversation with a speaking partner or by sending a voicenote file and getting corrections. He'll then take all the corrections, write them down, and review them several times. He really emphasizes on feedback in learning. So that feedback is 100% important to review and internalize.





I am creeping closer to A2 and I want to personally do this (in conjuction with reading and speaking practice): Use Lingo Player (free software that can show subtitles in both L1 and L2) and maaaayyybe Subs2SRS. I am not a huge fan of Anki but I do want to give it a shot.

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Re: Spanish Learning - Next step

Postby James29 » Wed Apr 11, 2018 12:03 pm

harikishore wrote:Lets say I pick up a commercially available Spanish learning course and complete it. I understand the language structure, rules, tenses etc and know what ever vocabulary that course provided.

The next biggest step is in expanding the vocabulary (mainly verbs, adjectives and adverbs) since a course will expose only very limited verbs (buy, sell, eat, understand, read, write etc) and use the same verb over and over again to explain all tenses etc. What's an effective way to do that. Simply pick up a word list and start memorizing words? Pick up a book or story and note down the words, get meaning and memorize it? I have a feeling that my "memory" is weak and I find it extremely hard to remember new vocabulary. Is it a normal feeling that everybody has?

Even before learning the first word in Spanish, I set a target to understand the below story some day.
https://www.odaha.com/antoine-de-saint-exupery/maly-princ/el-principito

I picked it now (after spending 1 year, learning a course and understanding everything the course taught) and I don't know 75% of the words in the first few pages. I've begun to note down the words, get its meanings and start memorizing. Is that the right way, or should I try something else before getting back to the above story?


For that second step you are asking about get a Kindle and read books in Spanish that amount to a total of 2,000,000 words and use the pop-up translator. That will get you to a good solid vocabulary. Reading on a Kindle is the best and fastest way to expand your vocabulary and internalize the language.

I agree with the poster above who recommended FSI Basic. It is the perfect intermediate step between a first course and the vocabulary acquisition you are asking about.
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Re: Spanish Learning - Next step

Postby harikishore » Wed Apr 11, 2018 9:35 pm

@lavengro
Thank you very much for the mermise link. I didn't even know mermise had a deck for El principito..
I was not expecting a suggestion to start another "Course" :cry: I don't understand your comment about the price and courage. I see that FSI Spanish Basic (any FSI course) is free to download. Are you not talking about it? I see that it is a course with 60 hours of audio material. The link that has free download suggests 6 months of completion time (Which translates to 1 year for me). Do you still think I should give it a shot?

@Jaleel10
Looks like I've been doing "Day 1" activity with El principito. I guess I should continue doing it and convert it into the process you mentioned. Using Lingo player (Another thing that I was not aware of) seems interesting. I sure will give it a try.
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Re: Spanish Learning - Next step

Postby lavengro » Wed Apr 11, 2018 11:16 pm

harikishore wrote:@lavengro
Thank you very much for the mermise link. I didn't even know mermise had a deck for El principito..
I was not expecting a suggestion to start another "Course" :cry: I don't understand your comment about the price and courage. I see that FSI Spanish Basic (any FSI course) is free to download. Are you not talking about it? I see that it is a course with 60 hours of audio material. The link that has free download suggests 6 months of completion time (Which translates to 1 year for me). Do you still think I should give it a shot?


Hi harikishore,

I was largely being facetious in some of my comments about FSI Spanish Basic. The "price is right" comment is something I always say about anything that is free, and the comment about proving your courage results from my experience and the comments of many other posters about how heavy a burden the FSI materials sometimes are: the FSI materials have broken many here, including myself when I previously tried FSI French and German. I am working through both FSI Basic and FSI Programmatic Spanish materials right now; while I cannot vouch for their effectiveness personally, many of the accomplished language learners who have completed them, such as James29, recommend them and I was mostly passing along a recommendation based on the recommendations of better learners than myself.

As to the merit of taking another course after having already completed one other course, others on this site may have different advice about moving more quickly into native materials, but based on my understanding of how much practice is available in the usual commercial course, someone who is serious about learning Spanish would benefit from the extensive drills and practice (and careful pronunciation, intonation, stress, rhythm instruction) available, at the right price, via the freely available audio and printed FSI material.
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Re: Spanish Learning - Next step

Postby Brun Ugle » Thu Apr 12, 2018 5:16 am

Regarding FSI, the courses are excellent. I used both Programmatic and Basic and can vouch for their effectiveness. They will help you to gain good pronunciation and grammar. However, they won’t give you much vocabulary. After I finished, or actually a bit before, I started watching telenovelas and reading books. I naturally gained vocabulary from those activities, but when I felt I was no longer gaining enough vocabulary fast enough, I started using other methods specifically for learning vocabulary. I did a bit of Memrise for a while. And then I gave Goldlist a try.
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Re: Spanish Learning - Next step

Postby Whodathunkitz » Thu Apr 12, 2018 7:57 am

I only have very basic Spanish in anything other than reading.

I read (including A1 and A2 music videos/lyrics) about 180,000 words on readlang. Readlang let's you click on a word and get a translation and then logs these for review exports (eg. turning into decks). It works well on phones.

The prince might be there already depending on copyright. You can upload texts and make them private or public. Do your own research as regards legal stuff.

I've paused Spanish for now, but I was just about coping with 'pride and prejudice' and got 20%+ through it. I also dabbled in some old Spanish novels.

I haven't tried kindle. I suspect there are a few ways to achieve this objective of extensive reading with lookups that don't interrupt the flow.
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Re: Spanish Learning - Next step

Postby James29 » Thu Apr 12, 2018 12:01 pm

harikishore wrote:@lavengro
Thank you very much for the mermise link. I didn't even know mermise had a deck for El principito..
I was not expecting a suggestion to start another "Course" :cry: I don't understand your comment about the price and courage. I see that FSI Spanish Basic (any FSI course) is free to download. Are you not talking about it? I see that it is a course with 60 hours of audio material. The link that has free download suggests 6 months of completion time (Which translates to 1 year for me). Do you still think I should give it a shot?

@Jaleel10
Looks like I've been doing "Day 1" activity with El principito. I guess I should continue doing it and convert it into the process you mentioned. Using Lingo player (Another thing that I was not aware of) seems interesting. I sure will give it a try.


If your long term Spanish goal is to have advanced Spanish skills you should do FSI. It is not "fun" but it is well worth it. It is a necessary step in the most efficient journey to advanced Spanish.
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