Judge My French

Ask specific questions about your target languages. Beginner questions welcome!
User avatar
tastyonions
Blue Belt
Posts: 964
Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2015 5:39 pm
Location: Dallas, TX
Languages: EN (N), FR, ES, IT, PT, DE, NL
x 1882

Re: Judge My French

Postby tastyonions » Sat Mar 03, 2018 11:59 pm

Sarafina wrote:03/03/18
https://vocaroo.com/i/s13E8fSnmSYd

Corrections in brackets, "???" is where I wasn't sure what you were saying:

Je me souviens ["iens" should sound like the end of "bien"] d'avoir regardé cette série animée [extra "r" sound on the end]. Il [Elle] s'appelle "Timothy Goes To School." J'ai regardé cette [ce] dessin [last syllable should be "sain"] animé avec mon petit frère quand il était enfant. Je pense que j'ai [j'avais] neuf ou dix ans quand j'ai commencé [extra "r" again] de [à] regarder cette série animée. Malgré la [le] fait que j'étais trop [don't pronounce "p"] grande pour [la] regarder [don't pronounce last "r"]. Il était ??? pour des enfants plus petits [extra "r" after "e" here]. Je l'aime beaucoup parce que j'aime ??? j'ai ??? que j'ai [je] pourrais [sounds like "peurai"] aller à l'école comme ça. Les personnages ne sont pas toujours parfaits mais ils essayaient [you hesitated and said "essayèrent," don't think you meant to use passé simple?] d'être gentils et respecter un autre [se respecter]. Les professeurs dans cette série étaient vraiment cools. Pour moi [extra "r"], c'est ??? durant cette période de ma vie j'ai [j'avais] vraiment besoin de cette série.

You've already noticed the intrusive R. Nasal vowels need a little work as well, I think.
1 x

Cavesa
Black Belt - 4th Dan
Posts: 4063
Joined: Mon Jul 20, 2015 9:46 am
Languages: Czech (N), English (C1), French (C2), Spanish (intermediate), German (somewhere on the path), Italian (passive advanced, active basic)
x 12577

Re: Judge My French

Postby Cavesa » Sun Mar 04, 2018 12:20 am

It is quite good in general. But I've looked into your log and seen high ambitions there, C1 in June, so I apologize if I'll sound a bit too negative now. I think the most striking imperfection, or perhaps rather uncertainty, are the vowels. The length, the exact sound. People focus on R or the nasals all the time. But I would say the vowels are extremely important and underestimated. The pronunciation of the vowels is actually a big part of making the grammar obvious while speaking (e,é,è etc.). Also, any vowel is used much more often than any consonant, so fixing one vowel improves a larger % of the production (I hope I am explaining this clearly). I am not a native, so take this advice with a grain of salt, but I think that working on the vowels could help you sound much more precise and confident. Being comfortable with the vowels helps a lot, when you want to sound good.

My favourite real life example of the importance of the vowels (which I was struggling with in France): when your heart doesn't work properly, sOUs décalage and sUs décalage ST on your ECG makes a lot of a difference. :-)
2 x

User avatar
tastyonions
Blue Belt
Posts: 964
Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2015 5:39 pm
Location: Dallas, TX
Languages: EN (N), FR, ES, IT, PT, DE, NL
x 1882

Re: Judge My French

Postby tastyonions » Sun Mar 04, 2018 12:23 am

Interesting example. When discussing that distinction I reach for the trusty "beaucoup / beau cul."
0 x

Sarafina
Green Belt
Posts: 355
Joined: Tue Sep 26, 2017 6:02 pm
Languages: English (N)
French (Intermediate )
Japanese (Beginner)
Yoruba (Advanced Comprehension)
x 768

Re: Judge My French

Postby Sarafina » Sun Mar 04, 2018 1:14 am

Cavesa wrote:It is quite good in general. But I've looked into your log and seen high ambitions there, C1 in June, so I apologize if I'll sound a bit too negative now.

I am not planning on taking C1 in this June. Even I'm not that delusional :lol: . I am hoping to challenge myself and take it by March 2019.
2 x

Sarafina
Green Belt
Posts: 355
Joined: Tue Sep 26, 2017 6:02 pm
Languages: English (N)
French (Intermediate )
Japanese (Beginner)
Yoruba (Advanced Comprehension)
x 768

Re: Judge My French

Postby Sarafina » Sun Mar 04, 2018 1:25 am

tastyonions wrote:
Sarafina wrote:03/03/18
https://vocaroo.com/i/s13E8fSnmSYd

Corrections in brackets, "???" is where I wasn't sure what you were saying:

Je me souviens ["iens" should sound like the end of "bien"] d'avoir regardé cette série animée [extra "r" sound on the end]. Il [Elle] s'appelle "Timothy Goes To School." J'ai regardé cette [ce] dessin [last syllable should be "sain"] animé avec mon petit frère quand il était enfant. Je pense que j'ai [j'avais] neuf ou dix ans quand j'ai commencé [extra "r" again] de [à] regarder cette série animée. Malgré la [le] fait que j'étais trop [don't pronounce "p"] grande pour [la] regarder [don't pronounce last "r"].

Il était ??? pour des enfants plus petits [extra "r" after "e" here].

I was trying (and apparently failing) to say that it is aimed at young children. I was trying to say visé but it's a poor word choice.

Je l'aime beaucoup parce que j'aime ??? j'ai ??? que j'ai [je] pourrais [sounds like "peurai"] aller à l'école comme ça. Les personnages ne sont pas toujours parfaits mais ils essayaient [you hesitated and said "essayèrent," don't think you meant to use passé simple?] d'être gentils et respecter un autre [se respecter]. Les professeurs dans cette série étaient vraiment cools. Pour moi [extra "r"], c'est ??? durant cette période de ma vie j'ai [j'avais] vraiment besoin de cette série.

You've already noticed the intrusive R. Nasal vowels need a little work as well, I think.[/quote]

Thank you so much for the detailed feedback. It's really helpful. I appreciate you taking the time to listen to it.
0 x

Sarafina
Green Belt
Posts: 355
Joined: Tue Sep 26, 2017 6:02 pm
Languages: English (N)
French (Intermediate )
Japanese (Beginner)
Yoruba (Advanced Comprehension)
x 768

Re: Judge My French

Postby Sarafina » Sun Mar 04, 2018 1:31 am

Cavesa wrote: I think the most striking imperfection, or perhaps rather uncertainty, are the vowels. The length, the exact sound. People focus on R or the nasals all the time. But I would say the vowels are extremely important and underestimated. The pronunciation of the vowels is actually a big part of making the grammar obvious while speaking (e,é,è etc.). Also, any vowel is used much more often than any consonant, so fixing one vowel improves a larger % of the production (I hope I am explaining this clearly).


I realised that I've been worrying about my weird way that I pronounce the French r but I haven't taken into consideration my pronunciation of the vowels.
0 x

User avatar
tastyonions
Blue Belt
Posts: 964
Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2015 5:39 pm
Location: Dallas, TX
Languages: EN (N), FR, ES, IT, PT, DE, NL
x 1882

Re: Judge My French

Postby tastyonions » Sun Mar 04, 2018 2:23 am

For something made for kids you can say “destiné aux enfants.”
1 x

User avatar
MamaPata
Brown Belt
Posts: 1022
Joined: Tue Jun 21, 2016 9:25 am
Location: London
Languages: English (N), French (C1*), Russian (B1), Spanish (B1).

Long lost: Arabic and Latin.
Language Log: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=3004
x 1800

Re: Judge My French

Postby MamaPata » Sun Mar 04, 2018 9:34 am

I'm not in a position to comment on your French sorry. However, I would probably not put too much work into pronunciation just yet. You're focusing on a specific exam and I would say your accent is good enough for the IB (though, as mentioned I would try and frop the ums). It may have changed, but my understanding of IB marking was that pronunciation is a fairly small area to get marks from. Your accent definitely seems good enough for that. You don't have that much time, focus on stuff that you'll get more marks from. In the future, you can go back and work with pronunciation textbooks, etc.
2 x
Corrections appreciated.

Kraut
Brown Belt
Posts: 1183
Joined: Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:37 pm
Languages: German (N)
French (C)
English (C)
Spanish (A2)
Lithuanian
x 1497

Re: Judge My French

Postby Kraut » Sun Mar 04, 2018 1:46 pm

Sarafina, could you read us a short written text that you have practised before? Then we could see better whether something basic goes wrong.
0 x

User avatar
reineke
Black Belt - 3rd Dan
Posts: 3496
Joined: Wed Jan 06, 2016 7:34 pm
Languages: Fox (C4)
Language Log: https://forum.language-learners.org/vie ... =15&t=6979
x 6241

Re: Judge My French

Postby reineke » Sun Mar 04, 2018 9:12 pm

I am listening on phone loudspeakers and my TV is also running in the background.

I note gender issues ("la maladie soudain"), anglicized -tion ("relashioun"),
Pays industrialisés (you apprently mixed up this word with "industrialiser" and voiced the r then corrected yourself). You seem to be pronouncing some consonants that are not pronounced in French.
"Comme" - the o should be more open
"On peut" sounds like on pooh.

You have improved.

"Accurate acquisition of L2 phonology leads not only to more effective listening skills but also to better vocabulary and grammar acquisition.

A number of studies have systematically evidenced the fact that L2 learners who have successfully acquired L2 phonology usually have a better mastery of L2 vocabulary, grammar and syntax. Why? Because they are more likely to pick up from aural comprehensible input grammatical features that L2 learners with a less developed grasp of the L2 phonology may not be able to notice."

https://www.google.com/amp/s/gianfranco ... -know/amp/
4 x


Return to “Practical Questions and Advice”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Maiwenn and 1 guest