How to improve my listening so I can pass a C1 DALF listening section

[trui]

I know lots of English learners that are using subtitles "until they don't need them anymore". The problem is: the moment never happens. They will never feel ready. Many of them try out, when they get a feeling like this, and then turn the subtitles back on after ten minutes, becase "I am not ready and don't want to waste my time". Noone is ever as ready as they would like to.

Exactly this. My listening in Dutch is B2, but what I say applied to when I was B1 in listening and B2 in reading as well.

You mentioned this in your post about timeframes, Cavesa, and others have talked about this, but I'll give a personal anecdote. Just a few days ago, I watched a few episodes of a couple TV programs. The first program went well. I could understand most of it and fairly easily follow the plot. The second program--not so much. It felt like people were talking faster and I felt like I could only understand half of it! After 30 minutes or so, I gave up and turned subtitles on for a few minutes, but, feeling guilty, I soon turned them off and decided to try again later.

On my second attempt, I watched an episode from earlier on in the season. Still ~50% comprehension of what people were saying, but I pushed through the 90 minute episode. I felt like I was missing a lot but I could still understand generally what was going on by the words I could understand and the actions. Second episode-- still missing a lot, but I felt it was maybe easier to understand. By the third episode, I could understand a lot more due to getting familiar with the accents and also getting more familiar with the plot. It felt like I was watching that other program--I was finally at a decent comprehension level. But this took 3 hours of watching one program without subtitles.

As long as you can understand the subtitles, you can understand the speech. It just takes a bit of getting used to. Of course extensive listening is just like extensive reading--it's ideal if you understand 80-90%+ of what's being said, but even at B2 it can take a bit of time to get used to the accents/whatnot, nevermind B1, so don't get discouraged. Of course it'd be better to start with unsubtitled programs that aren't too far away from your listening level. If you really like shows that are far away from your current level and need subtitles to really enjoy them that's fine of course, but I wouldn't count them as part of your listening practice. And like I said, don't be too quick in judging a program as too far away from your current level before you've watched a few hours of it or more. If you want to attempt programs that are quite far away from your listening level without subtitles for practice, I don't see any problem with that, but I'd also include programs that are closer to your level in your routine.

[Sarafina]

Overdue Update

My listening has improved a lot. I've listened to a couple of B2 mock listening papers recently. I've found it to be surprisingly really accessible and understandable. I was able to follow along clearly. Although I don't know if I would necessarily call my listening at B2 even though I am comfortable and understand B2 listening tasks.

I received some great advice. Thank you to everyone who offered a word or two of advice. Although it took me a while to act on them. There were days where I didn't listen to any French. I went through some dubbed American series but they become a chore as I found it hard to concentrate for longer 30 minutes of just hearing pure French. I eventually changed to cartoons dubbed in French and binge watching episodes no longer became a chore anymore. I listen to random French YouTubers that interest me and I particularly like watching videos Le Monde and Le Firago YouTube channels. I do some background listening of FranceCulture but not as often I should. In my school every now and again we do an activity of TV5Monde B2 section.

At first when I tried listening to French without any subtitles, it felt really uncomfortable. What really helped me is that I stopped beating myself up if I didn't understand something. I came to realise that it's not a reflection of my intelligence but how much time I've spent practising that particular skill. I think my previous mindset was probably my biggest obstacle. I would get so frustrated when I struggled to understand something and I would then sulk and avoid listening to French for days and the cycle repeats. Giving myself freedom to just enjoy what I am listening and concentrate on that is helped my listening comprehension immensely.

Before I was a low B1 in terms of listening. Now I would say that I fluctuate between a low B2/high B1.
According to the self-assessment B2 listening criteria I would say that "I can understand extended speech and lectures and follow even complex lines of argument provided the topic is reasonably familiar. I can understand most TV news and current affairs programmes". Although there are TV news that really challenge i.e. there was one that I listened to about something to do with neurobiology that left me completely baffled. But those moments are becoming rarer and rarer. For that particular one, I listened to it over a month ago so maybe I might be able to understand it better now.

There is still a massive gap between high B1/low B2 to passing confidently C1 listening section and being able understand completely 95% of native French TV series/movies. I still have a lot of work to do.

Since the time I asked for advice and now I've probably done 30-50 hours worth of listening. I know I could have done so much more but these last three months had been very trying and tiring.
These days my listening on a good day is 60 minutes of cartoons in French, 30-40 minutes of listening French YouTubers on the bus and at least 30 minutes of background listening to FranceCulture/NoFun
Some days I spend 3 hours and other days I spend 30 minutes. I'm hoping to consistently do 90-120 minutes worth of listening to French except on Friday, Saturday, Wednesday where I binge watch up 3 hours of episodes/videos in French.

I struggle with doing intensive listening. I almost always neglect to it at all. I am not sure if I even know exactly what intensive listening consists. Already I can understand and follow it along and I do understand majority of what I listen to. I want to be able to understand clearly specific details.

1. Does anyone have any advice on how to effectively do intensive listening that would require ideally no longer than 30 minutes a day?
1b) If possible please provide an example of a intensive listening schedule with particular tasks/actions that you would recommend
2. Is extensive listening sufficient enough to achieve my goals? (Obviously I still working on my other skills like reading and writing)

[DaveBee]

I struggle with doing intensive listening. I almost always neglect to it at all. I am not sure if I even know exactly what intensive listening consists. Already I can understand and follow it along and I do understand majority of what I listen to. I want to be able to understand clearly specific details.

1. Does anyone have any advice on how to effectively do intensive listening that would require ideally no longer than 30 minutes a day?
1b) If possible please provide an example of a intensive listening schedule with particular tasks/actions that you would recommend
2. Is extensive listening sufficient enough to achieve my goals? (Obviously I still working on my other skills like reading and writing)

I'm currently going through the first series of Un gars, une fille. These are 6 minute episodes, with transcripts for most of the first series (some of them are mixed up.)

I watch an episode, then read the script and look up any unknown words, then I watch it again.

-------

With other programmes I might look up a word I think I can hear, but don't know. But I only seem to do that with short programmes or YouTubers, very rare for me to do that when watching a film.

[Cavesa]

2. Is extensive listening sufficient enough to achieve my goals? (Obviously I still working on my other skills like reading and writing)

Extensive listening was the key to my C2 French. And I've had similar success with it in my other languages, just to lower level, because I haven't spent as much time on it yet and/or haven't done the other parts properly.

You have put in a few dozen hours, that is a good start. But I don't think you can truly judge the results until you'll have spent 200-300 hours or more on it. That is the key. Extensive means extensive, like tons of listening. Not lazy, which is what the most zealous intensive listening advocates believe. It means HUNDREDS of hours.

I am not saying anything like "you should have done more", or any similar nonsense. You did what you could fit in your schedule and it is great! Your progress sounds very promising! I am not discouraging you from intensive listening either of course.

There's just the simple fact that extensive listening requires time. And I am really convinced that a few long sessions are awesome at the beginning of the extensive listening adventure. Of course it feels tiring after half an hour (or much less), but if you choose something fun, you can push through that barrier. It's like sports training. No athlete stops right when the start feeling tired. That is often the problem. I think we often do not force ourselves enough (I am certainly guilty of this ).

These days my listening on a good day is 60 minutes of cartoons in French, 30-40 minutes of listening French YouTubers on the bus and at least 30 minutes of background listening to FranceCulture/NoFun
Some days I spend 3 hours and other days I spend 30 minutes. I'm hoping to consistently do 90-120 minutes worth of listening to French except on Friday, Saturday, Wednesday where I binge watch up 3 hours of episodes/videos in French.

I thin your binge watching is great. I am just not sure whether switching what are you listening to so much is that efficient. One of the main advantages of tv series: they are looong and you are therefore listening to more or less the same people for a long time, which makes it easier. But in 60 minutes, there is little time to improve, after you tune yourself for that program. After that, there are 30-40 minutes of something else, several videos, various speakers, and so on. That might be great for intensive listening training, But I am not sure that is the best way to approach extensive listening. And why are you torturing yourself with 30 minutes of NoFun? I am not convinced about background listening, but I know the opinions vary a lot. I just think that it might be better to get rid of 30 minutes of boredom per day, and instead adding at least a part of that saved time to the fun listening practice, when your brain really accepts the information.

I find it awesome you like cartoons, that is a good starting point. You can stick to them till you feel comfortable and they are mostly fun, not learning. Then switch to something else. And of course it will hard at first again, you will need time to get comfortable again. And then another switch. You'll need several rounds of this, to get to C1 or C2 listening (I personally think that the gap between C1 and C2 listening is much less obvious, or rather the line more blurry, than between B2 and C1)

You're absolutely right you shouldn't stop working on your other skills at any point. Not just reading and writing and speaking, it is really not just about the famous 4 skills. The 4 skills are all just practical applications of the basics, grammar and vocabulary. I recommend working on those continuously too. Not necessarily at the same time through intensive listening, just don't allow yourself to stop building this foundation, it will complete the puzzle and improve your listening, writing, and everything else.

[reineke]

I find it awesome you like cartoons, that is a good starting point. You can stick to them till you feel comfortable and they are mostly fun, not learning...

Shock! Gasp! Horror!

[Cavesa]

I find it awesome you like cartoons, that is a good starting point. You can stick to them till you feel comfortable and they are mostly fun, not learning...

Shock! Gasp! Horror!

Sorry, that might have sounded weird. I could have worded it better.
I meant to illustrate the cyclic process of finding something appropriate, sticking to it for long enough, and then moving on, and feeling the "I don't understand panic" again.

[Sarafina]

You have put in a few dozen hours, that is a
I thin your binge watching is great. I am just not sure whether switching what are you listening to so much is that efficient. One of the main advantages of tv series: they are looong and you are therefore listening to more or less the same people for a long time, which makes it easier. But in 60 minutes, there is little time to improve, after you tune yourself for that program. After that, there are 30-40 minutes of something else, several videos, various speakers, and so on. That might be great for intensive listening training, But I am not sure that is the best way to approach extensive listening. And why are you torturing yourself with 30 minutes of NoFun? I am not convinced about background listening, but I know the opinions vary a lot. I just think that it might be better to get rid of 30 minutes of boredom per day, and instead adding at least a part of that saved time to the fun listening practice, when your brain really accepts the information.

If I have 90-120 minutes that I can devote to weekdays and 3 hours on weekends, what percentage should I devote to just TV series? I can devote my weekends and possible Friday to long 3 hour bingewatching sessions of TV.

So far I have watch three episodes a day of three different TV cartoons because I like all three of them and they complement it each other. The reason I do background listening of FranceCulture is that I also want to get exposed to higher register and vocabulary of French that isn't available in the TV series I currently watch. Although that might be with my current choice of series.

My plan in terms of TV series include cartoons dubbed in French (I have roughly 268 left worth of episodes to watch in the total which isn't too bad considering some episodes are only 11 minutes long) < French cartoons (52 episodes worth) < dubbed live action TV series e.g. Orange is the New Black, Daredevil, < French TV series e.g. Engrenages, Le Bureau and possibly Les Revenants or Braquo.

Should I devote all 90 minutes to getting through TV series ( I want to experiment with 15-30 minutes a day of intensive listening which I can use the same video to double up as shadowing practice). So would 90 minutes of TV series be better with 15-30 minutes of intensive listening of YouTube videos then on weekends I can do 3-4 hours binge watching.

[Cavesa]

You have put in a few dozen hours, that is a
I thin your binge watching is great. I am just not sure whether switching what are you listening to so much is that efficient. One of the main advantages of tv series: they are looong and you are therefore listening to more or less the same people for a long time, which makes it easier. But in 60 minutes, there is little time to improve, after you tune yourself for that program. After that, there are 30-40 minutes of something else, several videos, various speakers, and so on. That might be great for intensive listening training, But I am not sure that is the best way to approach extensive listening. And why are you torturing yourself with 30 minutes of NoFun? I am not convinced about background listening, but I know the opinions vary a lot. I just think that it might be better to get rid of 30 minutes of boredom per day, and instead adding at least a part of that saved time to the fun listening practice, when your brain really accepts the information.

If I have 90-120 minutes that I can devote to weekdays and 3 hours on weekends, what percentage should I devote to just TV series? I can devote my weekends and possible Friday to long 3 hour bingewatching sessions of TV.

So far I have watch three episodes a day of three different TV cartoons because I like all three of them and they complement it each other. The reason I do background listening of FranceCulture is that I also want to get exposed to higher register and vocabulary of French that isn't available in the TV series I currently watch. Although that might be with my current choice of series.

My plan in terms of TV series include cartoons dubbed in French (I have roughly 268 left worth of episodes to watch in the total which isn't too bad considering some episodes are only 11 minutes long) < French cartoons (52 episodes worth) < dubbed live action TV series e.g. Orange is the New Black, Daredevil, < French TV series e.g. Engrenages, Le Bureau and possibly Les Revenants or Braquo.

Should I devote all 90 minutes to getting through TV series ( I want to experiment with 15-30 minutes a day of intensive listening which I can use the same video to double up as shadowing practice). So would 90 minutes of TV series be better with 15-30 minutes of intensive listening of YouTube videos then on weekends I can do 3-4 hours binge watching.

I don't think the main problem is using other stuff than tv series, not at all. TV series are great but they are not the only option.

What I find impractical are the short pieces and switches. The main values of extensive listening come with the longer pieces, or a chain of several short episodes of the same thing. Not with focusing on everything changing every ten minutes. If it is a longer radio program you like, or longer audiobook, or long youtube videos, I think it works just fine. From my experience, I take much more from an hour long session with five or six episodes of the same webseries, than from an hour spent on one short episode+two practice audios from a coursebook+a standard youtube video for learners+a bit of radio. I find that very difficult.

If I were you (if I may suggest, please don't take it as any kind of offense), I would simply watch two episodes around 45 minutes every weekday. That would fit in that time frame. But listening to an audiobook for the same amount of time could work the same and audiobooks are great for intermediate listeners. Actually, an audiobook could be a solution for your background listening needs, if you need to be listening while ironing or something (which is normal).

I don't think FranceCulture is the right choice at this moment, because you don't seem to be enjoying it at all. Brains are not that eager to let something we are bored of enter. I understand you want to be exposed to higher register and vocabulary. But do you need to be exposed to it right now? Or perhaps you can wait a bit, till you can switch to more difficult series and movies? There are also other options. Documentary movies and series tend to be much easier than normal stories and action, or non fiction audiobooks. Perhaps you might like those and they could be the right level for you. A documentary is meant to be easily understood, so the higher register and vocabulary is obvious but still meant for people with average education. Usually, there is one person speaking at a time and rather clearly, they are explaining something and want the viewer to understand clearly.

Btw thanks for Le Bureau recommendation.

I can't tell you much about intensive listening, I simply don't have enough experience with this. But with the extensive, I am convinced about this.

[Sarafina]

If I were you (if I may suggest, please don't take it as any kind of offense), I would simply watch two episodes around 45 minutes every weekday. That would fit in that time frame. But listening to an audiobook for the same amount of time could work the same and audiobooks are great for intermediate listeners. Actually, an audiobook could be a solution for your background listening needs, if you need to be listening while ironing or something (which is normal).

I don't think FranceCulture is the right choice at this moment, because you don't seem to be enjoying it at all. Brains are not that eager to let something we are bored of enter. I understand you want to be exposed to higher register and vocabulary. But do you need to be exposed to it right now? Or perhaps you can wait a bit, till you can switch to more difficult series and movies? There are also other options. Documentary movies and series tend to be much easier than normal stories and action, or non fiction audiobooks. Perhaps you might like those and they could be the right level for you. A documentary is meant to be easily understood, so the higher register and vocabulary is obvious but still meant for people with average education. Usually, there is one person speaking at a time and rather clearly, they are explaining something and want the viewer to understand clearly.

Thank you for your response. It's been really valuable.

I actually quite like FranceCulture- I find some podcasts to be really interesting. In the beginning I didn't like it as much because I didn't understand that much. Now that I can actually understand what they're talking about, I find it to be quite informative and even enjoyable. On the other hand, I love reading but I get incredibly bored of audiobooks and I actually prefer listening FranceCulture to an audiobook.

I normally alternate between one episode of three different cartoons (rough 60 minutes in total) because I really enjoy all three and I can never decide which one I just want to focus on finishing entirely but I might be missing out of the benefits of truly extensive listening

In total the time I spend on the bus to and from school is around 50-60 minutes depending on traffic. I can devote that time to watching on 3-4 episodes of one TV series. Then when I can do 45 minutes of FranceCulture. Then 15-30 minutes of intensive listening practice.

[Expugnator]

I would dare disagree with Cavesa here. I've had good results with much shorter sessions, ranging around 10 min for movies and 25 for audiobooks. If my level isn't as high as hers it's because of the total amount of time spent on the task (at roughly 30 min a day, I don't get more than 3 hours a week for French), but in terms of relative progress (i.e. comparing myself to my earlier learner self) I've seen sound progress particularly over this year and a half when I started the audiobook part. I went from being totally clueless about spoken French (while being able to read, so the problem was listening indeed) to understanding even unfocusedly, almost on an eavesdropping level. Background listening also helped me, much more than one would assume it would. At one point I'd just listen to game of thrones while browsing the internet. That helped me understand French at other situations when I was not paying full attention or when there was background noise. It also helped when that background noise was part of the film itself. It made me ready for listening, in the sense that I learned to be prepared for hearing French anytime, the way we do in our L1s. Of course this was a side work with these side benefits. My main learning happened when watching TV properly and listening to audiobooks even more concentrated.