Two languages to C1 concurrent or sequential?

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Two languages to C1 concurrent or sequential?

Postby rdearman » Fri Jun 23, 2017 7:21 am

I want to get both Italian and French to C1. Should I do this at the same time or one after the other, or sone kinda time slice thing with 3 month on one then another?

Suggestions, opinions?
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Re: Two languages to C1 concurrent or sequential?

Postby DaveBee » Fri Jun 23, 2017 7:57 am

rdearman wrote:I want to get both Italian and French to C1. Should I do this at the same time or one after the other, or sone kinda time slice thing with 3 month on one then another?

Suggestions, opinions?
I'd just focus on your strongest one until it hits C1. Switch out if your enthusiasm starts to flag though.
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Re: Two languages to C1 concurrent or sequential?

Postby smallwhite » Fri Jun 23, 2017 8:38 am

rdearman wrote:I want to get both Italian and French to C1. Should I do this at the same time or one after the other, or sone kinda time slice thing with 3 month on one then another?

Suggestions, opinions?

What is your current level?

How much time do you have each day?
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Re: Two languages to C1 concurrent or sequential?

Postby PeterMollenburg » Fri Jun 23, 2017 11:21 am

3 months of each, alternating.

Recently, I recommended you focus on one language, but...

Given your love of both these languages, I doubt you could put one down for long enough for a one language only policy to work. And you've already done a lot of work in both, so I don't know that it's advisable to drop one altogether either.

Work hard for 3 months, see it as a 90 day challenge to either complete so many hours, or get through so many films and novels, or something similar. Allow some forgetting time when you switch languages for the next 90 days (you could allow a bit of the language which is not in focus to be in your day with a podcast or bit of TV or something to keep exposure up with the pressure off). Keep switching like this. I think that's a sound plan given your personality and goals.
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Re: Two languages to C1 concurrent or sequential?

Postby PeterMollenburg » Fri Jun 23, 2017 11:59 am

LesRonces wrote:
PeterMollenburg wrote:3 months of each, alternating.

Recently, I recommended you focus on one language, but...

Given your love of both these languages, I doubt you could put one down for long enough for a one language only policy to work. And you've already done a lot of work in both, so I don't know that it's advisable to drop one altogether either.

Work hard for 3 months, see it as a 90 day challenge to either complete so many hours, or get through so many films and novels, or something similar. Allow some forgetting time when you switch languages for the next 90 days (you could allow a bit of the language which is not in focus to be in your day with a podcast or bit of TV or something to keep exposure up with the pressure off). Keep switching like this. I think that's a sound plan given your personality and goals.

Do you recommend this because of the similarity of the languages or is it more to do with focussing on one over the other ?


It's to do with focus, not similarity. As far as I understand rdearman has been studying both French and Italian for a while (how long i'm not sure) and is a little frustrated with (lack of) progress. Correct me if I'm wrong rdearman. Thus it's a focus thing. I've done some recent contemplation on the 'bow wave effect' that many forum members were recently discussing and when wanting to advance in more than one language, taking breaks I feel, could be a good strategy to employ. This would allow rdearman a certain amount of time to get down to business in one language with an aim to advance before the 90 days run out, then swap and do the same in the other. It arguably keeps one fresher than doing 2 languages completely simultaneously, although it really depends on the person.

LesRonces wrote:If the latter, could he not say, do 3 hours of French a day as part of his 'study' and then just do whatever he likes in Italian whenever he feels like it just for enjoyment/exposure and no explicit study ?


That is kinda what I've said- do serious French for 3 months with particular objectives in mind, while allowing some time for Italian exposure each day (a podcast, TV show perhaps- recommended only after the day's serious French has been completed). Then swap after 90 days- serious Italian, casual French exposure.

There's potentially some gains to be made in forgetting during the less serious language's down time, but with some casual exposure, not all is forgotten, by a long shot. Then motivation builds for the next 90 days of serious study, while the other language goes into casual idle.

Such a plan I think is good for someone who is reluctant to drop one language over another when they have done a lot of work in both, and it's also beneficial, imo, for those who are constantly plagued by wanderlust and simply could not handle putting down a language completely. I really think for rdearman that if he were to do only one language, he would be likely thinking about the other language and feeling guilty he's not giving it any attention and feeling regret at having dropping it (assumptions on my part). 3 months can be tolerated and used as motivation to get as far as one can in the current language, feel guilt free as in 90 days you can paint the town red with the other language.

Edit: I generally feel that serious focus in any given language is really required to advance a language considerably. With such a 3 month rotation plan you do not piss fart around with 2 languages not knowing which way to look. Serious focus is attained, and yet one language doesn't lose out over the other.

I also know, that from my own personal experience, when studying one language alone, you can take your time for granted and waste time or be lazy. 90 days being limit, puts an end date to your current language thereby, theoretically, keeping one's focus and making one more accountable to actually get down to business.
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Re: Two languages to C1 concurrent or sequential?

Postby rdearman » Fri Jun 23, 2017 12:20 pm

My frustration is I feel if I had concentrated on a single language to C1 or C2 level, then there wouldn't be so much backsliding when I switched to learning the other. At the moment I seem to go to B2 then switch to the other language, it gets to B2 but the first has now slid back to B1, so I bring it back, but the other has slipped. Hence I seem to be eternally B1 or B2 but not progressing.

Doing both can cause a lot of code switching and problems for me personally.

Anyone dropped a B2 language for six months or a year? Difficult to return?

Also anyone stooped using a C1 or C2 language if so how hard to pickup where you left off?
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Re: Two languages to C1 concurrent or sequential?

Postby Xenops » Fri Jun 23, 2017 12:35 pm

What a timely thread! I'm also considering the language rotation, though maybe not as long as 90 days, or maybe I should... 8-)
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Re: Two languages to C1 concurrent or sequential?

Postby smallwhite » Fri Jun 23, 2017 1:17 pm

rdearman wrote:At the moment I seem to go to B2 then switch to the other language, it gets to B2 but the first has now slid back to B1, so I bring it back, but the other has slipped. Hence I seem to be eternally B1 or B2 but not progressing.

If my B2 was so volatile, if I'm B2 right after study and B1 after a reasonable break, then I'd consider myself B1 or B1.5 instead of B2. If I weigh 50kg in the morning and 53kg after a buffet, I won't say I weigh 53kg. If you're willing to see yourself as B1 then the problem might just be that you're at the intermediate plateau and not feeling progress.

It could also be that you've been using study methods that cause volatile results instead of permanent results.
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Re: Two languages to C1 concurrent or sequential?

Postby rdearman » Fri Jun 23, 2017 2:23 pm

smallwhite wrote:
rdearman wrote:At the moment I seem to go to B2 then switch to the other language, it gets to B2 but the first has now slid back to B1, so I bring it back, but the other has slipped. Hence I seem to be eternally B1 or B2 but not progressing.

If my B2 was so volatile, if I'm B2 right after study and B1 after a reasonable break, then I'd consider myself B1 or B1.5 instead of B2. If I weigh 50kg in the morning and 53kg after a buffet, I won't say I weigh 53kg. If you're willing to see yourself as B1 then the problem might just be that you're at the intermediate plateau and not feeling progress.

It could also be that you've been using study methods that cause volatile results instead of permanent results.


So what do you recommend?
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Re: Two languages to C1 concurrent or sequential?

Postby smallwhite » Fri Jun 23, 2017 3:10 pm

rdearman wrote:So what do you recommend?

I don't know how you've been studying or how your progress compares with the average LLorger. You tend not to tell us about your real study activities and real progress so I have no idea. If you've been doing worse than the average LLorger then you can look at advice threads regarding study methods and plateaus. If you've been doing better than the average LLorger then... then you're above-average already. If you want to be as good as Iversen or Tarvos then you can look at their study guides and logs.
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