formal or informal on this forum

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Cavesa
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formal or informal on this forum

Postby Cavesa » Mon May 15, 2017 6:51 pm

Hi,

we are used to talking in English. But fortunately, we write in other languages as well and I am trying to do so more these days. But I have a practical problem. Tu or vous? Du or Sie?

Don't get me wrong, I have no problem with these in real life, they work the same like in Czech. I am just as (un)likely to make a mistake in each of the three. But I don't write on any Czech forums, therefore I lack experience.

Is there a prefered norm for this type of communication in each of the languages? Or do some people have strong personal preferences I should stick to? Or is it possible to agree on a forum norm?

I fully realize that I'd use the formal form with most of you in real life, unless offered the informal one. Should I stick to it? The problem is not that I feel weird of using the formal form after the comfort of not having to give a damn in English. Informal tu is now being norm in so many situations in Spanish, that it feels almost weird, it is clearly expanding its realms. But in the others, I am afraid of either offending you by being too informal, or by offending you (especially younger people) by using the formal you.

I am using the formal options now, but it just feels weird. And it feels "distant" after the friendly chat in English.

I am qualified to only give one example: Czech.
In real life, I am used to being addressed with the polite vy (vous, Sie), and I find it ok. Except for talking with people around my age in clearly informal setting. Meeting other students around the faculty. Meeting people at a popular music festival, that is an example of a situation asking for ty even among people usually distanced with the respectful vy. I am not sure I'd feel comfortable with other Czech speakers and learners here calling me "ty". We've known each other here for quite some time, after all, many of you are approximately my age. But I would go with vy to many other people.

Not sure what is the answer. Or rather: I know I would use vy on iversen or rdearman, not only out of social convention but as well out of honest respect. But would younger forum members feel good being addressed "vy"? Or rather, is it possible to come to a universal forum norm, without either offending people (which I would hate to accidentally do!) and without damaging the friendly atmosphere around here? Would classical real-life norm work in the forum conditions: start with formal and use informal after personal permission from the socially more important person? Would we keep track of it? How would new members flow into this?

And I don't doubt the norm may be very different in French or German (or any other) online setting.
In Czech, where I have only limited and passive experience, there are some forums and communities with "ty" as the default option, and there are others with "vy", where "ty" is clearly intended as an offence.

What do you think about the issue? What do you prefer? Does your preference change, based on the language? What is the online politeness norm in your native language? Do you like it or would you prefer a slightly different one in this community?
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Re: formal or informal on this forum

Postby zenmonkey » Mon May 15, 2017 6:58 pm

It's a forum - so in general you are free to use either (done in French) or mostly likely to use informal (in German, in Spanish after the 90's). But don't mix them. Rare are the forums I've seen that have a focused formal register for those languages.

With regards to myself - feel free to use informal and be as aggressive as you like about ideas or concepts. Not only is my skin thick but I can't ever feel insulted within this arena of subjects. Even if I ever strongly disagree with something posted here I appreciate that it is posted and will share food or drink over it.

And I'm totally open to whatever the community prefers.
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Re: formal or informal on this forum

Postby aaleks » Mon May 15, 2017 7:47 pm

I don't know if my answer would be relevant to the topic but ... :)
On the Russian forums I've participated (it's mostly figure skating forums) people usually address to each other 'вы'. Sometime it could be 'Вы' but it looks too formal. If someone wants to use 'ты' s/he has to ask to permission, in other cases it will be sounds rude or strange, depending on situation.
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Re: formal or informal on this forum

Postby Stelle » Mon May 15, 2017 8:53 pm

On a forum, I would use "tu". If I met you in real life, I would probably start with "vous", knowing that other countries are more formal, but if it felt comfortable I would probably ask you within the first five minute if we could "tutoyer".

I prefer using "tu" with colleagues, and I feel as though you're my language learning colleagues. I feel as though "vous" creates distance. But it doesn't bother me if someone prefers to stay in the formal register, and I always try to respect their wishes - I just apologize in advance and tell them that I might forget, and that it isn't because I don't respect them. Growing up, we never used "vous" except as the second person plural. Our teachers were always "tu", and even my grandmother (who passed away this summer at 105 years old) preferred that her grandchildren call her "tu".
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Re: formal or informal on this forum

Postby tomgosse » Mon May 15, 2017 9:36 pm

Just recently there was a discussion of 'vous' or 'tu' in this thread: Use of vous or tu in the movie Blue. I find that as I get older I am more likely to become more polite (formal) versus informal in my speech.
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Re: formal or informal on this forum

Postby aokoye » Mon May 15, 2017 11:31 pm

In a forum like this I would use du.
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Re: formal or informal on this forum

Postby tomgosse » Tue May 16, 2017 12:43 am

aokoye wrote:In a forum like this I would use du.

Or thou because I want to bring back the T-V distinction. :lol:
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Re: formal or informal on this forum

Postby aokoye » Tue May 16, 2017 1:25 am

tomgosse wrote:
aokoye wrote:In a forum like this I would use du.

Or thou because I want to bring back the T-V distinction. :lol:


Good luck bringing it back! :lol:
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Re: formal or informal on this forum

Postby Henkkles » Tue May 16, 2017 7:56 am

I believe in most of Europe it's basically canon to never use formal pronouns in public online discourse. Personal e-mails are a separate thing of course.
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Re: formal or informal on this forum

Postby s_allard » Tue May 16, 2017 3:38 pm

I won't speak for the other languages but in French it's more complicated than just the contrast between informal and formal. First of all, keep in mind that while TU is informal singular, VOUS can be either singular formal or plural informal. So, even in an informal chat room one would use TU when speaking to a specific person but VOUS when speaking to the group.

Things become more complicated when TU is used not to refer to a specific person (you) but to an indefinite generic person - just as we can do in English with YOU. This is very common in Québec but also exists in France. So, even when talking with someone with whom one usually uses VOUS one could use this generic indefinite TU because you are not actually referring to this person.

The second point to keep in mind is that the subject pronoun ON in French can often be used instead of this generic TU and also in place of VOUS in general. In fact ON can replace all the other subject pronouns when used properly.
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