How to get past the B2-C1 plateau?

[guiguixx1]

Hi all!

I need some advice! I'm stuck with my Dutch, I'm around B2-C1 and need to get to a native-like level. I'm studying English and Dutch at university in order to become a teacher next year and I'm doing my MA dissertation in Dutch, I thus need a very high level, but I can't seem to get past a plateau. I have tried studying vocab, I've tried reading newspapers, but it doesn't seem to be working. I still make mistakes even though I know the grammar, and natives never seem to notice my mistakes (only my teachers do). I also have problems improving my academic language use and have a hard time guessing the difference in meaning of words having an almost identical meaning (ex: kiezen/uitkiezen for example). While I have acquired a native-like level in English (or at least decent enough so that I can really feel this language and use it almost as I use French), it's not the case for Dutch yet....

It's been more than a year, maybe even two years since I've reached a plateau and don't seem to make much progress...

If anyone knows any method or has any suggestion, let me know! Thanks in advance!

[Spoonary]

How did you reach your current level in English? It might be worth really breaking down what helped you reach such a high level in that language, in order to then apply the same techniques/habits to Dutch.

Obvious advice is obvious

[Teango]

I highly recommend 3 strategies at this stage:

• reading (and listening to) a variety of fun and interesting novels that are progressively comfortable for your current vocabulary level (these can be in paperback or via an e-reader with translation support, and accompanied by an audiobook with a clear and pleasant-sounding narrator in the initial stages);
  
• thinking and communicating in the language as much as you can during the day and finding gaps in your expressions to fill in as you do (immersion really helps here of course!);
  
• writing a regular journal in the language to send to a tutor or friend to track ongoing progress and help correct any grammar mistakes or disfluencies.

[PeterMollenburg]

Salut guiguixx1,

Récemment, j'ai posé des questions plus ou moins similaires sur ce forum au sujet de mon français et comment je pourrais l'améliorer. Peut-être que tu trouveras les réponses là-bas intéressantes, parce que, je crois qu'on pourrait appliquer les méthodes à n'importe quelle langue. Voici le lien :

Recently, I asked some questions more or less similar on this forum on the topic of my French and how I could improve it. Perhaps you will find the replies there interesting, because, I believe one could apply the methods to any language. Here's the link:

http://forum.language-learners.org/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=5037

[Dylan95]

You sound like you're way beyond the B2-C1 plateau. You're at a very advanced stage if I understood all of that correctly.

[PeterMollenburg]

You sound like you're way beyond the B2-C1 plateau. You're at a very advanced stage if I understood all of that correctly.

The OP is talking about Dutch, not English.

[Systematiker]

Guessing here, but I think there's two things going on. If you're getting input but still having trouble producing grammar features that you know, you need a little more focus on that grammar (understanding it and having it automatic aren't the same) and a lot more input (a lot!). However, you've also got a need for language specific to a field, which means you need to be getting a lot of input from that field - and input that's written according to the conventions for that field. You are probably already doing some research for what you're writing, so expand that, and become well-read in the Dutch treatments in your field (monographs, journals, everything you can get your hands on).

[tarvos]

I need some advice! I'm stuck with my Dutch, I'm around B2-C1 and need to get to a native-like level. I'm studying English and Dutch at university in order to become a teacher next year and I'm doing my MA dissertation in Dutch, I thus need a very high level, but I can't seem to get past a plateau. I have tried studying vocab, I've tried reading newspapers, but it doesn't seem to be working. I still make mistakes even though I know the grammar, and natives never seem to notice my mistakes (only my teachers do). I also have problems improving my academic language use and have a hard time guessing the difference in meaning of words having an almost identical meaning (ex: kiezen/uitkiezen for example). While I have acquired a native-like level in English (or at least decent enough so that I can really feel this language and use it almost as I use French), it's not the case for Dutch yet....

These techniques work up until B2. Above B2, writing is a much more important component of your daily routine. You need to push yourself to write complex essays where the differences between for example kiezen (to choose) and uitkiezen (to pick from several concrete alternatives) is important. At this level, nuance plays a role.

[guiguixx1]

@Spoonary: I guess it came from massive reading in English, but also using English all the time (it's my favourite language and is easily accessible). I also had more time when I learnt it (I wasn't at university yet and it was the only foreign language I was really studying, which isn't the case anymore)

@Teango: I've already tried reading more but this doesn't seem to work. I should maybe work more intensively on vocab and read even more. The problem is the reading time: I currently read in French and in English (I'm reading books on personal development which aren't avaliable in Dutch, or so it seems). I would like to read less in those languages and more in Dutch but books in French and English are more interesting for personal development :/

Regarding communication, I already do it, and I'm trying to fill in the gaps, but the information I'm looking for to learn are not always easily accessible on the Internet, I often use a corpus to guess meanings but it's not always working...

I have never written a diary in Dutch (well in English), but I'm working on a blog on which I put short stories in Dutch, and before submitting them, I make it read and correct by natives. Unfortunately, writing stories and having them corrected takes time and inspiration. For this reason, I haven't written much yet...

@PeterMollenburg: Merci pour le lien, j'avance petit à petit dans le post, mais il est long ^^'

@АмериканскийДурак : I was indeed talking about my Dutch level, not my English level ^^

@Systematiker: My problem with grammar concerns the small details and all small irregularities, Dutch is full of them when studyding the language at such an advanced level. I also sometimes make errors that I should avoid. I guess, as Teango said, that I should find a way to write more and be corrected...

Regarding reading books in scientific fields, the "problem" is that it takes time, and I also take notes of what I write, which slows my reading down (although writing in Dutch is also helping, of course). But since I'm not going fast, I don't cover much vocab if I read only 30' a day. Should I stop reading in French and English to only read in Dutch?

@tarvos: My main problem with what you (and the others) propose with writing, is that I find it difficult to understand the subtle difference(s) in meaning between two or more words which are almost synonyms. The best reference I have is the Grote Van Dale, but looking up the different words and writing the differences in meaning is very time consuming, I've done 30' of that this morning and haven't written more than 10 words, especially when looking at verbs which have many different meanings (it took me a good 5 minutes to get the meaning of "ik vind het niet kunnen" since the dictionary entry is big and I couldn't find any explanation on the internet, I had to guess the meaning using a corpus....).

Actually I have reached a C level in only one language (in 2 if I do have Dutch at C1), so I don't have enough experience to really know what works for me and how to reach the highest levels. I have much more experience in getting to B1...

[Jar-Ptitsa]

I think that Dutch is problematic because it has got so many dialects, and they are impossible to udnerstand for each other, I mean the different ones, and the people speak them, so it's difficult to leanr the standard Dutch.

Can you live in Holland during your studies? In some places in The Neterhlands they speak more standard Dutch than the Flemish, who've got such annoying dialects. not Limburg, of course, but further north?

Watch NL1,2 on the TV and read their newspapers and study in Dutch I mean what you can find, although I can imagine that it's better in English and French.

I will think of more ideas, I 've got to go now.