Picking Yourself Up after Rough Practice Session

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issemiyaki
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Picking Yourself Up after Rough Practice Session

Postby issemiyaki » Fri Jun 17, 2022 2:29 am

Had a rough lesson today.

I felt ready. But, when time to perform, I was terrible. (Several times, my tutor was like: “I don’t understand what you said.”)
I had this sinking feeling: “It’s going to take me YEARS to get better.”

(Currently, I’m intimately going through the Uncovered Russian program by Olly Richards – it’s a great course. If you have questions, let me know and I’ll be happy to answer.)

Anyway, I figured my secret weapon was that, in addition to my doing the “Uncovered Russian Course,” I was also having 2 to 3 Zoom sessions a week with a native speaking Russian tutor. (We have small “controlled conversations” where we practice what I’m learning in Uncovered Russian.)

But, during today’s lesson, I just heard this voice in my head: “You sound terrible.” To make matters worse, I had prepared for four days for these Zoom sessions. So, after four days of preparation, you can image my disappointment when my performance before a live native speaker was subpar.

Maybe I’m expecting too much after just 90 days.

I don’t mind putting in the work, but I just had this sinking feeling that this is going to take 15 YEARS to make any headway in this language.

What about you? Anybody here experienced something similar. I’m almost positive I’ll feel more optimistic tomorrow, but today, I’m feeling pretty low. They paint language learning as “fun,” like we’re at the beach enjoying a vacation. But people don’t see the psychological toll that comes with this undertaking.
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Re: Picking Yourself Up after Rough Practice Session

Postby zenmonkey » Fri Jun 17, 2022 9:15 am

issemiyaki wrote:Maybe I’m expecting too much after just 90 days.


It's probably a little of this.
But it's also a little bit of undervaluing your successes so far.

You stuck to it for 90 days!
You already have some vocabulary!
you are already doing zoom sessions!

It took me way more than 90 days to get ... well, anywhere.
Trust the process. Build on small successes.
Your thoughts are programming your future.

No one. Not one single person here ever went through a successful learning process without some sense of difficulty, frustration or tension.

If it was easy ...
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Re: Picking Yourself Up after Rough Practice Session

Postby rdearman » Fri Jun 17, 2022 1:10 pm

90 days and you're not already fluent in Russian and "Shocking Unsuspecting Russian Waiters!" then you need to keep your day job, because you have no future on YouTube. :)

Anyway, I can sympathise. My Korean teacher gave me five simple sentences to learn and a week to practice saying them. After almost 20 hours of practice and shadowing, in the next lesson, my tongue somehow got glued to the top of my mouth or something and nothing came out except baby gibber sounds.

But I have one advantage over you...
issemiyaki wrote:I had this sinking feeling: “It’s going to take me YEARS to get better.”

My expectation is that it is going to take me the remainder of my life to learn Korean. So I don't get bothered by the little bumps in the road. When you're driving slow the bumps aren't so painful, but if you have the accelerator pressed all the way to the floor, when you hit a small bump it almost jerks your head off.

issemiyaki wrote:They paint language learning as “fun,” like we’re at the beach enjoying a vacation

Strange, I look on language learning a bit like going to the dentist for a cleaning. You dread it right up to the moment you sit in the chair, you dread it even more when they start digging around in your mouth with metal shite. But afterwards you can't stop running your tongue over your teeth and enjoying it. But you never get to step five or six until you've done steps one, two, three, and four. So if you can't enjoy it, at least grin and bear it.

I never understood people who say language learning is fun, but then again I never saw anything interesting about running around kicking the shite out of a ball that never did anything to me, or watching people swinging golf bats on TV. :lol:
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Re: Picking Yourself Up after Rough Practice Session

Postby BeaP » Fri Jun 17, 2022 1:52 pm

I don't want to repeat the advice you've already got (I totally agree with both), I'd rather draw attention to another aspect.

If you're doing controlled practice of the Uncovered Russian course, and your tutor doesn't understand what you say, why are you so sure that Uncovered Russian is a great course? Maybe it doesn't put enough emphasis on pronunciation.

Also, Olly Richards and your tutor are not helping you, you're giving them money for a service. It's normal to analyse our own shortcomings, but you can't blame everything on yourself. If you're demotivated after a session, maybe it's a good idea to talk about this with the tutor. It's absolutely possible that they will lift your mood with a couple of sentences or give you some practical advice that helps you to improve. Teaching is about trust. You can show your resource to the tutor and maybe they'll come up with the reason why the controlled practice doesn't work. There's a chance that only with a small adjustment things can get better.

Language learning is like a beach vacation only for those who are learning the language in an immersion environment on the beach.
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Re: Picking Yourself Up after Rough Practice Session

Postby Cenwalh » Fri Jun 17, 2022 1:57 pm

Did I understand this right? You've been learning Russian for a mere 3 months, had a conversation in Russian, and only "several" times there were comprehension problems?
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Re: Picking Yourself Up after Rough Practice Session

Postby Le Baron » Fri Jun 17, 2022 2:21 pm

rdearman wrote:90 days and you're not already fluent in Russian and "Shocking Unsuspecting Russian Waiters!" then you need to keep your day job, because you have no future on YouTube. :)

:lol:
rdearman wrote:My expectation is that it is going to take me the remainder of my life to learn Korean. So I don't get bothered by the little bumps in the road. When you're driving slow the bumps aren't so painful, but if you have the accelerator pressed all the way to the floor, when you hit a small bump it almost jerks your head off.

Wise observation and advice. Going at a reasonable pace at least allows you you to see the obstacles coming at you.So often the 3-month plan gets knocked back to two months of actual work (if you're lucky) and 1 month of solving unforeseen problems (if you're lucky). I've done this.
rdearman wrote:I never understood people who say language learning is fun, but then again I never saw anything interesting about running around kicking the shite out of a ball that never did anything to me, or watching people swinging golf bats on TV. :lol:

'Golf bats' :lol: This is what my father always said to annoy sports fans by deliberately getting the equipment name wrong. He also said 'golf stick'. I do have some fun learning, but it's more like 90% work to 10% bursts of enjoyment from having learned something. We inflict it upon ourselves.
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Re: Picking Yourself Up after Rough Practice Session

Postby Carmody » Fri Jun 17, 2022 2:34 pm

"LeBaron: but it's more like 90% work to 10% bursts of enjoyment from having learned something. We inflict it upon ourselves."

I swear I thought I was the only one...........Seriously!
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Re: Picking Yourself Up after Rough Practice Session

Postby luke » Fri Jun 17, 2022 2:51 pm

Le Baron wrote:
rdearman wrote:90 days and you're not already fluent in Russian and "Shocking Unsuspecting Russian Waiters!" then you need to keep your day job, because you have no future on YouTube. :)

rdearman wrote:I never understood ... watching people swinging golf bats on TV. :lol:

I do have some fun learning, but it's more like 90% work to 10% bursts of enjoyment from having learned something. We inflict it upon ourselves.
Le Baron wrote:So often the 3-month plan gets knocked back to two months of actual work (if you're lucky) and 1 month of solving unforeseen problems (if you're lucky).

My math turns this into 6 months and later I find that doubles. :lol:
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issemiyaki
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Re: Picking Yourself Up after Rough Practice Session

Postby issemiyaki » Fri Jun 17, 2022 5:05 pm

zenmonkey wrote:
issemiyaki wrote:Maybe I’m expecting too much after just 90 days.


It's probably a little of this.
But it's also a little bit of undervaluing your successes so far.

You stuck to it for 90 days!
You already have some vocabulary!
you are already doing zoom sessions!

It took me way more than 90 days to get ... well, anywhere.
Trust the process. Build on small successes.
Your thoughts are programming your future.

No one. Not one single person here ever went through a successful learning process without some sense of difficulty, frustration or tension.

If it was easy ...


Thank you for this - I'm going to print it out. Such therapy for me.
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issemiyaki
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Re: Picking Yourself Up after Rough Practice Session

Postby issemiyaki » Fri Jun 17, 2022 5:08 pm

rdearman wrote:90 days and you're not already fluent in Russian and "Shocking Unsuspecting Russian Waiters!" then you need to keep your day job, because you have no future on YouTube. :)


Jajajajajajaja - nooooo - I am certainly not expecting to be fluent in 90 days.

I know what you mean. The 90-day fluent crowd is not what got me into learning Russian. Many of them sound like they are just one step above a phrasebook. Most of their stuff on YouTube is pre-recorded, so I would be shocked if they legitimately understood a Russian native speaker, speaking normally, not using watered down sentences. Sure, they're excited about their progress, and they should be, and we support them. But my learning goals are a bit different - ha! (That's an understatement.) So the smoke and mirrors treatment just won't cut it. So, we're totally on the same page. And no future for me on YouTube - thank goodness. :lol:

Thanks for the laugh!

(And it's terrible how this thing keeps track of how many times I edit a message. I'm a terrible proofreader, okay. Gees.)
Last edited by issemiyaki on Fri Jun 17, 2022 5:50 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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