Initiation au Grec Ancien by Vernhes and other Ancient Greek Resources

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cito
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Initiation au Grec Ancien by Vernhes and other Ancient Greek Resources

Postby cito » Tue Jun 14, 2022 5:59 pm

Hey there! I've been going through Dobson's Learn New Testament Greek and been somewhat enjoying it. I've heard from numerous videos and articles that there really aren't many good methods and books for Ancient Greek in the way there are for modern languages or even Latin (I can't even imagine how hard it must be to learn Syriac or Coptic resource wise). I've also heard that Dobson gets really bad/hard to follow after lesson 20 and I'm halfway through lesson 19 :).

While at a bookstore in France today, I found a copy of Initiation au grec ancien by Jean-Victor Vernhes, and after some quick searches, many people seem to be saying it's one of the best French books on Ancient Greek. Has anyone tried it / heard anything about it? I couldn't really find many comprehensive reviews, just folks on Amazon saying that they loved it.

Here's my other issue: I have a copy of JACT Reading Greek at home (will not be home until August), and my University library actually has the UK/American Athenaze. Should I just wait and try and work through Dobson despite the somewhat... bizarre... grammar explanations? I also have the option of buying the Italian Athenaze right now, and was even planning on it- it's about the same price as Vernhes.

Any advice? Sorry I know this post is a bit of a mess. I may try and go to textkit to see what they have to say but it seems like their forum is less active nowadays (maybe we should encourage the stragglers to come here :lol:)
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Re: Initiation au Grec Ancien by Vernhes and other Ancient Greek Resources

Postby księżycowy » Tue Jun 14, 2022 6:31 pm

Unfortunately I know less than nothing regarding Invitation au Grec Ancient, but as I know some minor Greek (I also am in the process of reviewing some Greek) and am familiar with a good few resources, I would hope to be of some assistance. You mostly mention Classical Greek, but say you're going through Dobson. Are you interested in both Classical and Koine Greek or just one?
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Re: Initiation au Grec Ancien by Vernhes and other Ancient Greek Resources

Postby einzelne » Tue Jun 14, 2022 7:12 pm

I only dabbled in Ancient Greek and from my own limited experience I would say: use all available sources. In comparison to Latin, there is definitely less available learning sources while Ancient Greek is arguably more difficult. So, if you're really crazy about Ancient Greek (as you should be, otherwise you would throw in the towel right away) arm yourself with as many textbook materials as possible.
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Re: Initiation au Grec Ancien by Vernhes and other Ancient Greek Resources

Postby cito » Tue Jun 14, 2022 7:40 pm

księżycowy wrote:You mostly mention Classical Greek, but say you're going through Dobson. Are you interested in both Classical and Koine Greek or just one?


I'm interested in both, but it seems like a lot of quality resources focus more on classical. I'll definitely stick with Dobson for as long as it serves me, but I'm really thinking that if so many people say it really drops in quality beyond being introductory, I might as well prepare myself for when that happens :lol: .
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Re: Initiation au Grec Ancien by Vernhes and other Ancient Greek Resources

Postby księżycowy » Tue Jun 14, 2022 8:44 pm

I have a copy of Dobson, but I can't say as I've used it. I have used Mounce's Basics of Biblical Greek to great effect. I've also been thinking of taking a run at McLean's New Testament Greek: A Introduction this time. I'd definitely recommend Mounce without a doubt.

I also have the JACT Greek (and Latin) course, and regard it favorably. McLean is probably closer to that than Mounce. JAST and McLean both also have audio, if that's your kinda thing.

Depends on what you're looking for in a textbook really, I suppose. But those are my thoughts thus far.
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Re: Initiation au Grec Ancien by Vernhes and other Ancient Greek Resources

Postby kundalini » Tue Jun 14, 2022 9:26 pm

I'm not familiar with the book by Vernhes, but if you can read French, you might also consider checking out Assimil's Le Grec Ancien. I finished it some years ago and thought it was superb. Working through the book and repeatedly listening to the dialogues gave me an internalized intuition for the Greek language, which was very different from how I learned to read Latin.
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Re: Initiation au Grec Ancien by Vernhes and other Ancient Greek Resources

Postby cito » Tue Jun 14, 2022 10:06 pm

kundalini wrote:I'm not familiar with the book by Vernhes, but if you can read French, you might also consider checking out Assimil's Le Grec Ancien. I finished it some years ago and thought it was superb. Working through the book and repeatedly listening to the dialogues gave me an internalized intuition for the Greek language, which was very different from how I learned to read Latin.


Ah okay, thank you! I've heard really great things about it from a few sources but was always having trouble finding a complete review of the book. It seems really intriguing. Who knows... maybe I should just do both :lol:

Honestly I'm returning home for August-December, but going back to France January-May so maybe I'll pick up the ASSIMIL then once I'm finished with ASSIMIL Spanish. I also have to debate whether or not I'll purchase the Italian Athenaze while I'm here. It's way too much of a hassle to get it sent to America.
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Re: Initiation au Grec Ancien by Vernhes and other Ancient Greek Resources

Postby cito » Tue Jun 14, 2022 10:11 pm

księżycowy wrote:I have a copy of Dobson, but I can't say as I've used it. I have used Mounce's Basics of Biblical Greek to great effect. I've also been thinking of taking a run at McLean's New Testament Greek: A Introduction this time. I'd definitely recommend Mounce without a doubt.

I also have the JACT Greek (and Latin) course, and regard it favorably. McLean is probably closer to that than Mounce. JAST and McLean both also have audio, if that's your kinda thing.

Depends on what you're looking for in a textbook really, I suppose. But those are my thoughts thus far.


I've heard pretty good things about Mounce too. I wonder how it compares to Vernhes- unfortunate there isn't much info out there. Luckily I've been able to find some stuff on French teacher forums :lol: they're all swearing by it. Many of them also refer to it as "Hermaïon."

Thanks a ton for the input! I'll continue my investigation.
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Re: Initiation au Grec Ancien by Vernhes and other Ancient Greek Resources

Postby guyome » Wed Jun 15, 2022 6:23 am

I used Hermaion at some point during my Ancient Greek journey but that was some 15 years ago so take my comment with due caution.

I used it after gaining some basic knowledge using old high school textbooks and I didn't think the book was anything special. The grammar sections are made of charts followed by a lot of (too much?) text and details. The book's layout doesn't help, it feels...stuffy. The good thing is that there is a decent amount of exercises.

My Ancient Greek studies really took off only after I started using Athenaze. Unlike Vernhes, it didn't get lost in accentuation minutiae and the like and provided a simpler (but, to me, more efficient) exposition of grammar, together with copious reading material (and more interesting than Vernhes's isolated sentences).

In my opinion, the book being so well regarded in French speaking circles says more about the dire state of Ancient Greek teaching here rather than about the book itself.

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Re: Initiation au Grec Ancien by Vernhes and other Ancient Greek Resources

Postby cito » Wed Jun 15, 2022 5:32 pm

guyome wrote:
My Ancient Greek studies really took off only after I started using Athenaze. Unlike Vernhes, it didn't get lost in accentuation minutiae and the like and provided a simpler (but, to me, more efficient) exposition of grammar, together with copious reading material (and more interesting than Vernhes's isolated sentences).


Thanks so much!
If you do't mind me asking, did you have a specific way of using Athenaze (like a regiment, plan, etc), and did you use the Italian or UK/American one (or both)?
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