Compelling Input + Beginner + LCTL = Frustration!!

Ask specific questions about your target languages. Beginner questions welcome!
mjb1971
White Belt
Posts: 28
Joined: Sun Apr 26, 2020 9:28 am
Languages: English (N), French (B1 Reading), Spanish (B1 Reading), German (A1 Reading), Korean (B2 Reading), Chinese (A1 Reading), Japanese (B1 Reading), Turkish (something), Russian (something), Amharic (ohhhh Amharic)
x 24

Compelling Input + Beginner + LCTL = Frustration!!

Postby mjb1971 » Mon Oct 18, 2021 12:12 am

TLDR; How to create a study plan for a LCTL using compelling input methods but with no material?

I am living in Ethiopia and working on Amharic as a beginner. While I can read the script (fidel), and know several hundred nouns, my conjugation is terrible. My motivation is high!

I find that compelling input methods work great for me in other languages. Unfortunately, there is a lack of level-graded material for Amharic. there are 3-4 texts (Routledge being a standard here) and some grammar guides on Amazon (have all of them). But, there is no real body of material. I keep going thru the Routledge again and again and again up to the level that I am at. It is becoming non-compelling.

I have dabbled in creating my own "Assimil for Amharic", that is take some of my Assimil copies and just make them Amharic-English instead of French-English, German-English etc. Kind of fun, but it is not exactly input, but construction-input.

My tutors, while well meaning, do not quite get input methods. Our lessons are usually being presented with a list of words or conjugations (ugh). Likewise, although I am in immersion setting, I feel at a basic level and with day-to-day responsibilities in English I cannot just dive in and be.

Lingq has some Amharic material for edit, so perhaps I can check that out.

Any suggestions? Not material suggestions, but methodology suggestions for dealing with the challenging equation of Compelling Input + Beginner + LCTL?
0 x

User avatar
Yunus39
Orange Belt
Posts: 185
Joined: Thu Sep 09, 2021 8:44 am
Languages: English (N)
Bangla (Advanced Low ACTFL 060723)
Spanish (dormant)
Ancient Greek

Wishlist:
Scots
Ancient Hebrew
Aramaic
German
Latin
Hindi
Language Log: https://forum.language-learners.org/vie ... 20#p217017
x 464

Re: Compelling Input + Beginner + LCTL = Frustration!!

Postby Yunus39 » Mon Oct 18, 2021 1:22 am

If you have tutors, check out GPA. The methodology relies on language nurturers, but no written material. The social / relational aspect makes the input more compelling.

https://www.growingparticipation.com/3-knowable
0 x
Bangla Pages: 8382
Ancient Greek Pages: 2194
Scots Pages: 449

mjb1971
White Belt
Posts: 28
Joined: Sun Apr 26, 2020 9:28 am
Languages: English (N), French (B1 Reading), Spanish (B1 Reading), German (A1 Reading), Korean (B2 Reading), Chinese (A1 Reading), Japanese (B1 Reading), Turkish (something), Russian (something), Amharic (ohhhh Amharic)
x 24

Re: Compelling Input + Beginner + LCTL = Frustration!!

Postby mjb1971 » Mon Oct 18, 2021 2:24 am

jammon39 wrote:If you have tutors, check out GPA. The methodology relies on language nurturers, but no written material. The social / relational aspect makes the input more compelling.

https://www.growingparticipation.com/3-knowable



One of my tutors uses GPA method. There is no input material, let alone compelling input. Further, GPA focuses on output rather than input.
0 x

User avatar
iguanamon
Black Belt - 2nd Dan
Posts: 2352
Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2015 11:14 am
Location: Virgin Islands
Languages: Speaks: English (Native); Spanish (C2); Portuguese (C2); Haitian Creole (C1); Ladino/Djudeo-espanyol (C1); Lesser Antilles French Creole (B2)
Studies: Catalan
Language Log: viewtopic.php?t=797
x 14187

Re: Compelling Input + Beginner + LCTL = Frustration!!

Postby iguanamon » Mon Oct 18, 2021 2:32 am

I don't know if this will be "compelling", or if you can read at this level... GlobalVoices.org Amharic has varied articles of non-mainstream newsy topics both translated from other languages and original with translations. Links to other language versions at the top of the page. Less commonly learned languages often have fewer resources available. The ones that are available are often less than ideal. At least this one is free. Good luck!
2 x

mjb1971
White Belt
Posts: 28
Joined: Sun Apr 26, 2020 9:28 am
Languages: English (N), French (B1 Reading), Spanish (B1 Reading), German (A1 Reading), Korean (B2 Reading), Chinese (A1 Reading), Japanese (B1 Reading), Turkish (something), Russian (something), Amharic (ohhhh Amharic)
x 24

Re: Compelling Input + Beginner + LCTL = Frustration!!

Postby mjb1971 » Mon Oct 18, 2021 2:57 am

iguanamon wrote:I don't know if this will be "compelling", or if you can read at this level... GlobalVoices.org Amharic


Thanks. I was not aware of this resource. It reminds me of DW or VoA Amharic. A bit above my level, but good to know it exists.
0 x

User avatar
Yunus39
Orange Belt
Posts: 185
Joined: Thu Sep 09, 2021 8:44 am
Languages: English (N)
Bangla (Advanced Low ACTFL 060723)
Spanish (dormant)
Ancient Greek

Wishlist:
Scots
Ancient Hebrew
Aramaic
German
Latin
Hindi
Language Log: https://forum.language-learners.org/vie ... 20#p217017
x 464

Re: Compelling Input + Beginner + LCTL = Frustration!!

Postby Yunus39 » Mon Oct 18, 2021 3:36 am

mjb1971 wrote:
jammon39 wrote:If you have tutors, check out GPA. The methodology relies on language nurturers, but no written material. The social / relational aspect makes the input more compelling.

https://www.growingparticipation.com/3-knowable



One of my tutors uses GPA method. There is no input material, let alone compelling input. Further, GPA focuses on output rather than input.


It seems like a lot of people do not actually follow the GPA manuals, but I did GPA into Phase 5, and most of it should be input 3 to 1 or so. The first 100 hours are silent. Phase 2 and 3 should be wordless books, comic strips, and later simple third-culture stories. If your tutor is demanding output without giving you 3 times the input, they are probably doing it wrong. Even in phase 4 and 5 the main activities are "massaging" native speech (interviews in phase 4, native-to-native content in Phase 5) and "massaging" means you listen/watch the material over and over and ask questions.

What phase is your tutor working from? What GPA activities are you doing? Have you read or looked at the manuals?
0 x
Bangla Pages: 8382
Ancient Greek Pages: 2194
Scots Pages: 449

mjb1971
White Belt
Posts: 28
Joined: Sun Apr 26, 2020 9:28 am
Languages: English (N), French (B1 Reading), Spanish (B1 Reading), German (A1 Reading), Korean (B2 Reading), Chinese (A1 Reading), Japanese (B1 Reading), Turkish (something), Russian (something), Amharic (ohhhh Amharic)
x 24

Re: Compelling Input + Beginner + LCTL = Frustration!!

Postby mjb1971 » Mon Oct 18, 2021 5:19 am

jammon39 wrote:
mjb1971 wrote:
jammon39 wrote:If you have tutors, check out GPA. The methodology relies on language nurturers, but no written material. The social / relational aspect makes the input more compelling.

https://www.growingparticipation.com/3-knowable



One of my tutors uses GPA method. There is no input material, let alone compelling input. Further, GPA focuses on output rather than input.


It seems like a lot of people do not actually follow the GPA manuals, but I did GPA into Phase 5, and most of it should be input 3 to 1 or so. The first 100 hours are silent. Phase 2 and 3 should be wordless books, comic strips, and later simple third-culture stories. If your tutor is demanding output without giving you 3 times the input, they are probably doing it wrong. Even in phase 4 and 5 the main activities are "massaging" native speech (interviews in phase 4, native-to-native content in Phase 5) and "massaging" means you listen/watch the material over and over and ask questions.

What phase is your tutor working from? What GPA activities are you doing? Have you read or looked at the manuals?


I think your responses belong in a GPA thread rather than in this thread.

I had already stated that my tutors do "not quite get" input method. So even though you might have some opinions based on your experience with it, that experience is not salient here. Further, without any written materials - depending on a tutor - there is little input for a student to have when they are outside of the lesson.

Also, even though I did not specifically state it in my original post, I think my examples showed that I was looking for suggestions for written material.

Thanks for your opinions on GPA. However, I think this is a dead-end for this thread.
0 x

User avatar
Yunus39
Orange Belt
Posts: 185
Joined: Thu Sep 09, 2021 8:44 am
Languages: English (N)
Bangla (Advanced Low ACTFL 060723)
Spanish (dormant)
Ancient Greek

Wishlist:
Scots
Ancient Hebrew
Aramaic
German
Latin
Hindi
Language Log: https://forum.language-learners.org/vie ... 20#p217017
x 464

Re: Compelling Input + Beginner + LCTL = Frustration!!

Postby Yunus39 » Mon Oct 18, 2021 6:08 am

mjb1971 wrote:
jammon39 wrote:
mjb1971 wrote:
jammon39 wrote:If you have tutors, check out GPA. The methodology relies on language nurturers, but no written material. The social / relational aspect makes the input more compelling.

https://www.growingparticipation.com/3-knowable



One of my tutors uses GPA method. There is no input material, let alone compelling input. Further, GPA focuses on output rather than input.


It seems like a lot of people do not actually follow the GPA manuals, but I did GPA into Phase 5, and most of it should be input 3 to 1 or so. The first 100 hours are silent. Phase 2 and 3 should be wordless books, comic strips, and later simple third-culture stories. If your tutor is demanding output without giving you 3 times the input, they are probably doing it wrong. Even in phase 4 and 5 the main activities are "massaging" native speech (interviews in phase 4, native-to-native content in Phase 5) and "massaging" means you listen/watch the material over and over and ask questions.

What phase is your tutor working from? What GPA activities are you doing? Have you read or looked at the manuals?


I think your responses belong in a GPA thread rather than in this thread.

I had already stated that my tutors do "not quite get" input method. So even though you might have some opinions based on your experience with it, that experience is not salient here. Further, without any written materials - depending on a tutor - there is little input for a student to have when they are outside of the lesson.

Also, even though I did not specifically state it in my original post, I think my examples showed that I was looking for suggestions for written material.

Thanks for your opinions on GPA. However, I think this is a dead-end for this thread.


Okay, I wish you all the best in your study.
1 x
Bangla Pages: 8382
Ancient Greek Pages: 2194
Scots Pages: 449

User avatar
Sonjaconjota
Green Belt
Posts: 271
Joined: Tue Apr 13, 2021 8:12 am
Location: Barcelona
Languages: German (N) - English, Spanish, Catalan (advanced) - French, Dutch, Italian (intermediate) - Turkish (beginner)
Language Log: https://forum.language-learners.org/vie ... 24#p192024
x 1094

Re: Compelling Input + Beginner + LCTL = Frustration!!

Postby Sonjaconjota » Mon Oct 18, 2021 8:17 am

1 x

User avatar
Deinonysus
Brown Belt
Posts: 1216
Joined: Tue Sep 13, 2016 6:06 pm
Location: MA, USA
Languages:  
• Native: English
• Advanced: French
• Intermediate: German,
   Spanish, Hebrew
• Beginner: Italian,
   Arabic
x 4620

Re: Compelling Input + Beginner + LCTL = Frustration!!

Postby Deinonysus » Mon Oct 18, 2021 11:56 am

I guess this is kind of a combination of a material suggestion and a methodology suggestion, so I hope it's okay.

Your personal definition of "compelling" might be different from mine, but there are generally three types of native material that I consume at the beginner level:
  • Children's books (preferably original books in the language)
  • News headlines
  • Songs
I personally do not employ graded readers or bilingual texts outside of my course materials (so for example, Assimil for languages where it is available). My goal is not perfect understanding but identifying known words. As you progress in your course materials, you will be able to identify more and more words until you are eventually understanding whole sentences.

I have studied several "Less Commonly Taught Languages" (I had to look that acronym up!), including Inuktitut, Navajo, and Xhosa, and this sort of media was plentiful in all three languages, with the exception that most Xhosa books available in the US are translations and it's really hard to get books shipped from South Africa to the US. Since you are in Ethiopia you should have no problem accessing these materials in Amharic. Again, my methodology is to rely on my coursework alone for understanding which eliminates the need for bilingual texts or graded readers. As the coursework progresses, the material becomes increasingly comprehensible.
2 x
/daɪ.nə.ˈnaɪ.səs/


Return to “Practical Questions and Advice”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Learning Is Hard and 2 guests