Robierre’s French C2 log

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Robierre
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Re: Robierre’s French & Italian C2 journal

Postby Robierre » Sun Jul 09, 2017 11:35 am

Update for the weekend:

Italian

Un giorno in Italia 2 (corso intermedio-avanzato),
p. 256-272/363
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Robierre
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Re: Robierre’s French & Italian C2 journal

Postby Robierre » Sat Jul 15, 2017 7:38 pm

3rd year
Week 2


(Last week before summer holidays)


Français

Compréhension orale

J'étais assez fatigué aujourd'hui, du coup j'ai passé quelques heures devant la télé en regardant des documentaires. En réalité, je ne considère plus les documentaires comme un apprentissage car je ne fais presque aucun effort. Le vocabulaire y est très commun, les phrases toujours parfaitement standards, la prononciation super compréhensible etc. Donc, c'est juste pour la détente.

Quant aux films, séries télé, talk-shows, c'est toute autre chose. Là il y a toujours une partie plus exigeante, çà et là quelque phrase trop vite prononcée, des expressions imagées, des mots du langage familier. Sans soutitres, c'est probablement un tiers du continu qui exige un peu plus de concentration. Avec les soutitres, la compréhension est plutôt autour de 90%.

Alors, je continue avec des grandes quantités de films dans les prochains mois. L'objectif de la compréhension autour de >90% sans soutitres me semble très réaliste maintenant.
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Robierre
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Re: Robierre’s French & Italian C2 journal

Postby Robierre » Sun Jul 16, 2017 1:31 pm

Update for the weekend:

Italian

Un giorno in Italia 2 (corso intermedio-avanzato),
p. 272-282/363
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Robierre
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Re: Robierre’s French & Italian C2 journal

Postby Robierre » Sun Aug 06, 2017 1:39 pm

3rd year
Week 3


Italian
Un giorno in Italia 2 (corso intermedio-avanzato),
p. 282-294/363
Reading: Umberto Saba - Ernesto, p. 1-28/153


French

Reading: John Steinbeck - Des souris et des hommes, p. 1-60/175
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Robierre
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Re: Robierre’s French & Italian C2 journal

Postby Robierre » Thu Aug 10, 2017 7:41 pm

Grammaire

Les verbes avec la préposition "de" ou "à" ou sans préposition

Depuis quelques mois j'insiste beaucoup sur ce point de grammaire pendant mes lectures intensives. Dès que je trouve un verbe dans le texte, je l'analyse de près pour voir avec quelle proposition il est accompagné. Même les verbes très courants avec lesquels je fais souvent des erreurs, comme par exemple:

espérer (faire quelque chose)
commencer a (faire quelque chose)
aider a (faire quelque chose)
penser (faire quelque chose)


Très souvent mes erreurs sont influencées par l'italien. Voilà les mêmes verbes avec ses propositions en italien:

sperare di (fare qualcosa)
cominciare a (fare qualcosa)
aiutare a (fare qualcosa)
pensare di (fare qualcosa)


Alors je les transcris dans mon cahier et j'essaye de les mémoriser. En tout cas, c'est mieux que de les apprendre d'une liste interminable.
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Re: Robierre’s French & Italian C2 journal

Postby reineke » Thu Aug 10, 2017 8:13 pm

Check if you're also not influenced by Croatian prepositions or certain constructions. I'd run some of combinations through reverso it>fr and vice versa.

French could be interfering too.

penser à quelque chose
penser quelque chose de...
Qu'est-ce que tu penses de..
penser de faire...
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Re: Robierre’s French & Italian C2 journal

Postby Arnaud » Thu Aug 10, 2017 8:46 pm

Pense à sortir les poubelles, chéri !! :D
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Robierre
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Re: Robierre’s French & Italian C2 journal

Postby Robierre » Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:04 pm

Reineke: they are non influenced by Croatian propositions because we don't use any in this case (verb + verb).

But Arnaud's comment made me think again (repenser :mrgreen: ) about the verb penser. I guess it has two forms. :?
penser faire qch = Je pense aller au cinéma ce soir.
penser à faire qch = Je pense à acheter une voiture.

In Italian it would be always "di": Penso di andare in al cinema stasera. Penso di comprare una macchina.

...
Update: Ups, Italians also use "a" in Arnaud's example.
"Pensa a pulire la cucina!"
(ovvero "Pensa a far questo!")
solo nel caso in cui viene impartito un ordine
Last edited by Robierre on Tue Aug 15, 2017 10:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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reineke
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Re: Robierre’s French & Italian C2 journal

Postby reineke » Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:48 pm

Robierre wrote:Reineke: they are non influenced by Croatian propositions because we don't use any in this case (verb + verb).

But Arnaud's comment made me think again (repenser :mrgreen: ) about the verb penser. I guess it has two forms. :?
penser faire qch = Je pense aller au cinéma ce soir.
penser à faire qch = Je pense à acheter une voiture.

In Italian it would be always "di": Penso di andare in cinema stasera. Penso di comprare una machina.
...
Update: Ups, Italians also use "a" in Arnaud's example.
"Pensa a pulire la cucina!"
(ovvero "Pensa a far questo!")
solo nel caso in cui viene impartito un ordine


That was my point about using reverso.
Regarding verb+verb and pensare in Italian, you could also have:

ci penso io a fargli... sputare il rospo

Pobrini se da...te ne zafrknu prijedlozi.

Andare al cinema (Croatian : u kino/ I'm guessing that's how you got "in" cinema).... una macchina.

Croatian may trip you more during "oral production."

I am a firm believer in reading, listening, and gut instinct when dealing with prepositions (and other grammar issues) .
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Robierre
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Re: Robierre’s French & Italian C2 journal

Postby Robierre » Tue Aug 15, 2017 2:34 pm

reineke wrote:
That was my point about using reverso.
Regarding verb+verb and pensare in Italian, you could also have:

ci penso io a fargli... sputare il rospo

Pobrini se da...te ne zafrknu prijedlozi.

Andare al cinema (Croatian : u kino/ I'm guessing that's how you got "in" cinema).... una macchina.

Croatian may trip you more during "oral production."

I am a firm believer in reading, listening, and gut instinct when dealing with prepositions (and other grammar issues) .


Thanx, italian propositions are even more difficult; andare al cinema, a teatro, a cena, al mare, alla posta, a scuola; I need more intensive reading in Italian; onda će doći i, što kažeš, "gut instinct" :D
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