All Things Communication [retired!]

[SGP]

There was a bit (or even more than just a bit) of skyrocketing, speaking of the increase of this log's views.

But very few people posted any reply.

To "stress" (emphasize) it again in a fully stress-less way:
I am not asking for replies as in "please do help me find some Communication Bigger Picture Mosaic Stones".

And I also already mentioned that I intend to continue writing as if I would know with the utmost certainty that nobody ever will reply. I did so and I still do it that way for the sake of the writing flow.

But as for some of you who would like to take a closer look at anything that is within the log's scope... the more input I get, the more output I think I will be able to produce.

Another possible reason for yourselves posting some more replies: While I am less than half of a geek (I used to be half of one in the past, and a very long time ago, I even was a complete one), I still am above zero. So one possible reason for giving me some input also could be to have the opportunity of asking someone who is "less than half of a geek but above zero" any communication-related questions that are within the log's scope.

I fully acknowledge the fact that there are many things related to communication that I still need to take a closer look at, but the same also could apply (and it even does apply) to those with a, for example, very "mainstream" background and perception. There also are many (other) things that people like, for example, but certainly and in no way limited to, myself, could tell you about some (other) aspects of communication.

[SGP]

This log is in "no more output without input" mode now.

Amazing. Usually not caring too much about certain numbers, but this thread now has more than 1000 views even. Because this has become my favorite number one language topic, this does have some significance to me. Just wanted to let you know that this thread from now on is in "no output without input" mode. Because the First New Communication Bigger Picture Milestone already had been reached at the time I wrote the previous post. I simply was still pondering upon "when exactly should I publicly announce that milestone being reached and change this log to "no more output without input" mode".

As for myself, I could continue using a Pen and Paper Diary from now on, or not using one at all. But I like to give back more than what I take. This also could be related to myself having done it the other way sometimes in the past, and to one or more personal reasons.

Input can be made by replying to any post.

Or by mentioning new patterns of behavior and so on.

Or by asking me (a person with neurodiversity, and this is entirely different from a mental illness or anything) any question on how people with neurodiversity could perceive certain situations related to communication.

[EDIT: And as for those of you who are persons with neurodiversity themselves: Yes, I didn't finish learning about communication yet. However, I am very grateful for currently experiencing a major metamorphosis. So, for the purpose of informing you of it only, there already are some or even many cases where I can be one of those who are something like a bridge between those with our background and those who have got a different one. You also can ask any question related to what I just described.]

So this means that without input, I am not continuing it at all. (This isn't related to being mean or anything, instead, it is because of what I explained above). And whenever there is input, I agree to reply to it and to all possible follow-ups. But whenever the input is gone, I am also, again, ceasing to post anything in this thread until there is some more.

[SGP]

This log is in "no more output without input" mode, nothing has changed.
But that still doesn't prevent me from pointing out something I just realized.

There could be a possible contradiction between something I said in the previous post, and what I said in the one before.

Instead of simply editing them "hoping that nobody already realized that there could be a possible contradiction", I decide to write a new post (this one) pointing out why there is no such contradiction. That way is much more beloved to me, aiming for the maximum degree of transparency.

Pre-previous post, additional emphasis added:

And I also already mentioned that I intend to continue writing as if I would know with the utmost certainty that nobody ever will reply. I did so and I still do it that way for the sake of the writing flow.

Previous post, additional emphasis added:

Just wanted to let you know that this thread from now on is in "no output without input" mode. Because the First New Communication Bigger Picture Milestone already had been reached at the time I wrote the previous post. I simply was still pondering upon "when exactly should I publicly announce that milestone being reached and change this log to "no more output without input" mode".

This is because even if the First New Communication Bigger Picture Milestone already had been reached at the time I wrote the pre-previous post, I myself didn't realize that the new information I got and the new impressions, practice effects etc. are significant enough to really be counted as the First New Milestone. I only found out that this really is the case after some additional thinking, pondering and reflecting.

And as for "I simply was still pondering upon...", this also doesn't mean that I already realized at the time of the pre-previous post that the First New Milestone already has been reached. Instead, "I simply was still pondering upon..." in this case can be read as "There was a simple and non-complex thing that still needed to be done, and this was to ponder upon when exactly I should announce the First New Communication Bigger Picture Milestone being reached". So it doesn't mean, either, that this action (even thinking of when to switch the log to "no output without input" mode) already started when I wrote the pre-previous post.

Having said that, any question of you all about anything I wrote in this log, including this very post, does count as new input. Even if it only would be done for the sake of myself clarifying something that I possibly could have expressed in a way that is a bit easier .

[SGP]

There has been some Directly Directed Towards SGP Input in another thread (the one about "the next lingua franca?"). And this also made me think of something else. Once again, I stick to the "no output without input" mode of this log like glue, not even thinking of reconsidering it. But a certain (human) fox made me realize that input also could come from other threads.

As long as nobody is having an issue with myself quoting things being said in other threads rather than this one only, I think I would even want to do it that way, in addition to any possible Directly in This Thread Input. When doing so, I do need to quote the post's original links for the sole purpose of mentioning my source. Otherwise I could give some the impression of making things up. But still, we shouldn't forget that posts can be edited. In case they do, I expect that nobody blames me for anything .

Direct Reply Input Within This Thread still is very welcome, no matter if the user providing some input has got a connection with a specific mammal, a reptile, or anything else.

@all: if there is anything going on the forum that you would like me to analyze in order to cover it here, you could either quote it in this thread or PM me.

Sweetie, I am Dutch And I think you quite missed the latent humour in my post.

I said "you must be joking"

If you knew that, why did you take it seriously? You think I don't know what goes on here?

SGP should analyze this exchange.
It looks like "Hashimi" (is that edible?) does not understand that he was signalling the opposite of what he was trying to say. Or is he? That's the trouble with emoticons.

Source: https://forum.language-learners.org/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=9429&start=30#p122229

Now that fox (reineke) really made me laugh because of his Analysis Suggestion. I am very happy to tell you that it (myself laughing) didn't hurt my stomach, although it was rather close.

So first of all, I need to return to the previous posts that reineke is referring to.

After the climate change flood, the only country that has fought water all its life, the Netherlands, will be alive still. Thus Dutch is the language of the future.

Alternatively, the Greenlanders, who have been living in barren circumstances for centuries, will vie for power with us.

Source: https://forum.language-learners.org/vie ... 20#p121991

What I am going to do now is all about language-related analysis that also interconnects with communication, there is nothing more to it.

Provided that these characters we know as letters have a power of expression that isn't limited to their literal meanings only, there was some ambiguity in tarvos's statement. One could think that it is meant literally, and while I do not recall if I did so or not when reading it the first time, I also cannot outrule the possibility of having done so.

But when taking a closer look at something, things could turn out to be different. We need to keep in mind that the Dutch can tend to be very funny sometimes. Also, one couldn't be sure at all that tarvos was serious about that whole thing called "we are the only ones who have been fighting the flood for the whole lifetime of our all generations, so we will have a very special position after the climate change flood". Right now I realize that there even is more ambiguity, because tarvos also possibly was parodying those who say that something like a Climate Change Flood even will happen. In addition, we shouldn't jump into conclusions by saying that most likely, tarvos wasn't aware of the presence of several other countries that have a special connection to water or floods even.

Dutch? You must be joking!
Within six or seven generations it will disappear from certain urbanized areas. In the long run it will turn into a sociolect for the poor and may be the official SECOND language of the Netherlands!

This has already begun a long time ago. As you know, most of the higher education programs are taught in English (you can even study Dutch literature in English!) I see a trend that even bachelor programs will be taught completely in English in 50 years with some exceptions. I have never seen anyone using the Dutch version of any software (and many software are not even available in Dutch).

Source: https://forum.language-learners.org/vie ... 20#p121996

When I read Hashimi's post the first time a few or several days ago, I was certain that it simply was meant to be a reply to tarvos's post as if it would have been serious. Now, as I am analyzing it, I couldn't say at all that I am certain, for reasons similar to those I just explained above.

And now for a re-quote of their (up to now) final statements, the source already has been mentioned in this post above.

Sweetie, I am Dutch And I think you quite missed the latent humour in my post.

I said "you must be joking"

If you knew that, why did you take it seriously? You think I don't know what goes on here?

SGP should analyze this exchange.
It looks like "Hashimi" (is that edible?) does not understand that he was signalling the opposite of what he was trying to say. Or is he? That's the trouble with emoticons.

Unlike Hashimi's previous (i.e. "first" and longer-than-this-one) post, which at least the time I was reading it today didn't contain a smiley/didn't contain it any more (in case it would have been edited for rephrasing or something), that latter quote does contain one. So possibly Hashimi wanted to express the very same idea that also is conveyed through the smiley using words only while expecting that the message still will be understood.

And as for "latent humor", this means of course something different from "very clear and obvious". So that, too, is one of the Jigsaw Puzzle Pieces.

[tarvos]

The whole idea of the joke was that you could take it literally, and it would make sense, sort of, but everyone actually knows that that scenario is outrageous. It was not parodying climate change floods as much as cynically being aware that climate change exists, and the joke was fairly cynical in the sense that the Netherlands is one of the countries with an excellent flood protection system (we're considered world authorities on water management and flood protection, and for good reason; we're pretty much the country people call when their lands flood for help), but also that climate change is so imminent that there's an actual chance of flooding.

So there is ambiguity, but there's ambiguity there on purpose because a lot of people understood that it was a joke and that's why it got so many likes

[SGP]

The whole idea of the joke was that you could take it literally, and it would make sense, sort of, but everyone actually knows that that scenario is outrageous.

Now your motivation for writing these lines becomes even more clear to me.

And as for "everyone actually knows that that scenario is outrageous", if by "everyone" you mean "most people", then there wouldn't be much that I would be adding at this point.
But in case you were referring to really all of them, then I should just mention that I also witnessed countless examples of Ivory Tower Perspectives (a.k.a. "weltfremd") that are way, way beyond imagining some Very Non-Specified Nightmare-ish Scenarios.

It was not parodying climate change floods as much as cynically being aware that climate change exists, and the joke was fairly cynical in the sense that the Netherlands is one of the countries with an excellent flood protection system (we're considered world authorities on water management and flood protection, and for good reason; we're pretty much the country people call when their lands flood for help), but also that climate change is so imminent that there's an actual chance of flooding.

Flood protection system: Background information that only is available to some in the world, but many, many people don't know it.

So there is ambiguity, but there's ambiguity there on purpose because a lot of people understood that it was a joke and that's why it got so many likes

This is yet another real-world example of a joke that possibly many people would get, but some others wouldn't.

Disclaimer: BTW, Everything I Just Was Saying Is Neither Done For The Purpose Of Implying Anything Between The Lines That Is Not There, Nor For The Purpose of Selling My Theoretically Wonderful But Nevertheless Non-Existent Dried Mango Cookies That Taste Like Baobab Tree Fruits.

[tarvos]

It will never happen that everybody likes or understands your jokes. What can you do but shrug your shoulders and move along?

There's always a weirdo in every breed.

[SGP]

It will never happen that everybody likes or understands your jokes. What can you do but shrug your shoulders and move along?

Everything I said was being done for the sole purpose of analyzing communication, because that's this thread's topic .

There's always a weirdo in every breed.

A word like "weirdo" can mean so many things, and (real life example ahead) it wouldn't be wise at all if I would now simply be jumping into conclusions like "this word without no doubt is referring to the G letter in my nickname which has been explained in the signature".

[Serpent]

Hi! About the number of views, from what I understand it counts each visit - including your own visits, refreshing; including bots, people who aren't registered/logged in. I think it also counts each post, so if I scroll through a page with 10 posts, that's 10 views. (not 100% sure about this)
The forum software is called phpBB, I'm sure there's information online on what exactly counts.

[SGP]

Hi! About the number of views, from what I understand it counts each visit - including your own visits, refreshing; including bots, people who aren't registered/logged in. I think it also counts each post, so if I scroll through a page with 10 posts, that's 10 views. (not 100% sure about this)
The forum software is called phpBB, I'm sure there's information online on what exactly counts.

All of what you said about being counted applies, except there is one thing I really am not sure about. And this is "scrolling through 10 posts = 10 views". Can't negate it for sure either, but this is the first time I ever heard about something like this.