Amanda's Log: Spanish and Ancient Greek

[philomath]

Spanish

I've been studying Spanish more consistently this week. I no longer feel too burnt out to practice speaking, because I gave myself permission to talk about whatever I want. So I've been talking to myself in Spanish whenever I get the chance (i.e., whenever the house is empty), usually about my language studies or my plans for the day. This adds up to around 10 minutes/day of speaking practice. Ideally I would speak about more complex topics too, but I don't want to make myself do too much, or else I'll get burnt out again. In the meantime, maybe this simple speaking practice will boost my confidence when talking.

Lately I've been very conflicted about my method for learning new words. Part of the problem is that I feel the need to keep a record of all of the words I learn. (Or almost all of them, because I'm sure I passively pick up some words through listening and reading.) This means I must keep vocab lists in my notebook. Each page in my notebook has a Spanish side and an English side. Sometimes I just add words and their translations, but often I copy down a whole sentence. Last month I quit using Anki and started reviewing vocab words by covering the Spanish side in my notebook and trying to recall it based on the English side. However, I quickly got bored of this, so now I'm using Anki again, with mostly cloze deletion cards. I think I'm wasting time keeping both a vocab notebook and making Anki flashcards. What's the point of keeping a vocab notebook if I'm not going to review it? Is it a waste of time to make Anki flashcards? I feel reluctant to give up either method. I think I need to find a new way to review what I write in my vocab notebook, even if I just read through it occasionally. It would be nice to go through the notebook sometimes and try to write a paragraph or two using some of the words. I think that would be a nice way to reinforce what I've learned. Regarding Anki... it doesn't seem to take up too much time, yet. I only spend around 5 or 10 minutes/day adding new cards, and 15 minutes or so reviewing them.

Well, that was a very long rant about vocabulary acquisition. Anyway, based on some of the advice I've read on this forum, I think I should stop worrying about it and just do more listening and reading practice. In a couple of weeks I'll be starting a new job, and I think I can get quite a lot of reading done during the commute (40 minutes in each direction). That is, if the train isn't too crowded to read comfortably, which it sometimes is. I also want to do more writing practice. I've been doing more writing than usual, and I really feel like my ability to write complex sentences has improved. For example, the other day I posted this sentence on iTalki:

¿Tienes tiempo libre para que almorcemos?
No sé, puede que tenga una cita a las dos. Necesito averiguar si se ha cancelado o no.

I think this sentence shows a great improvement in my writing. A couple of months ago, I would not have felt as comfortable using the subjunctive. And the "se ha cancelado" passive construction is something I picked up from reading El tiempo entre costuras.

As my schedule gets busier this summer, I think it's important to study Spanish in little chunks whenever I can, rather than doing a longer study session at night. Scattering Spanish throughout the days seems to encourage me to think in Spanish more often. When I don't know how to "think" something, I write down my best guess in my phone and post it on iTalki for corrections. I just need to do this more often!

Ancient Greek

Ancient Greek is going well so far. On Monday I added all of the vocab from Lessons 5 and 6 into Anki. On Tuesday I learned the grammar in Lesson 5 and kept reviewing my Anki cards. By Wednesday I had gone through the Lesson 5 vocab enough that I felt ready to do the translation exercises at the end of the lesson. I should've started Lesson 6 yesterday to stay on schedule, but I got distracted by Spanish instead. I'm not too disappointed in myself though, because it's good that I felt so motivated to study Spanish! I'm going away this weekend, so I'm not sure when I'll be able to do Lessons 6 and 7.

I'm not finding Ancient Greek very difficult so far. It's a lot like Latin, except there are slightly different uses of the genitive, dative, and accusative, and there isn't any ablative case. It takes me a while to do the translation exercises at the end of each chapter, but I'm enjoying them. My love for languages originally started as a love for Latin, and even though I've moved away from dead languages and toward living languages, I still find that I love memorizing noun declensions and the like.

Wow, this was a long post! Next time I'll make an effort to post more frequently and write shorter updates.

[philomath]

So... I've signed up for a Mandarin class. I wasn't planning to begin Mandarin (again) until next July, but there's a club at my university that offers free language classes, and I thought it would be a fun opportunity to meet some fellow language lovers in real life. I would've joined the Spanish class instead, but the intermediate level isn't offered this summer.

The class meets for 1.5 hours every week, and it's taught by a student who is a native speaker. The first class is tomorrow, but I'll have to miss it because I haven't moved back to Boston yet. (Right now I'm in New York, three hours away by train.) I tried to learn Mandarin for a few months, and I still remember some basic phrases: 我叫 Amanda。我是美国人。我二十一岁。我有一个妹妹。So hopefully missing the first class isn't a big deal.

[philomath]

A little bit about my history of learning Mandarin:
1. I began learning it around 3 years ago and spent a decent amount of time learning the pronunciation: first learning about the IPA, next repeating syllables from this pinyin chart, and then working on tone pairs. I also did some listening practice, but of course couldn't understand a single word.

2. The first resource I tried was Mango Languages. At the time, I had just finished reading Fluent Forever, and I was determined to try the flashcard method described in the book. As a result, I spent way too much time making Anki flashcards instead of actually learning Mandarin. Also, I was primarily interested in learning how to read and write Mandarin, so I spent a lot of time learning how to write all of the characters in each lesson. I quickly got bored of Mango Languages and bought Living Language Essential Chinese. Then I tried a subscription to ChineseClass101. I also did some listening practice by watching the children's show Peppa Pig in Mandarin. I couldn't understand much, except in the intro to each episode where Peppa introduces herself and her family members.

3. In the end, after one or two years of very scattered studying, I decided to take a break and focus on Spanish. Looking back on it, I should've picked one or two resources to stick with, and I shouldn't have been so obsessed with making perfect flashcards. Also, I think I should've focused on speaking first and then gradually started learning how to read and write the most common characters.

Here's my general plan for learning Mandarin:
1. First, I'm going to review the pronunciation a little bit. I will read this pronunciation guide and practice repeating sounds from here and here.

2. Next, I'm going to start Pimsleur. I'll do each lesson once (or twice or thrice, if needed), and make flashcards for the vocabulary in each lesson. Normal flashcards, not following the Fluent Forever method, which didn't work for me at all. I'm not going to memorize any characters at this point, but I think I will include them on the front of my flashcards, along with the pinyin.

3. Then I'll need some kind of resource to learn about the grammar. I think I'll use the Integrated Chinese textbooks, though I'm not sure what level I'll be at after finishing Pimsleur. Maybe a different resource would be better. Meanwhile, I'm going to memorize the radicals and then start learning the most common characters.

This plan definitely needs some fixing. For example, when should I start doing listening practice? I have no idea. Starting it sooner rather than later seems to be a good idea, but I won't be able to understand anything.

Well anyway, I've realized that I'm doing way too much this summer. Once I start my new job next week, I'm going to have a lot less free time. If only Spanish, Ancient Greek, and Mandarin were my biggest projects, but... I'm also learning how to program with Python, studying for the GRE, and working on the first draft of a novel. Basically I'm a fool for trying to do all of these things at once. We'll see what happens... despite all of these dreams to learn Ancient Greek and Mandarin, I might have to wait until I finish one of my other projects.

[PaleoPaul]

Spanish

Lately I've been very conflicted about my method for learning new words. Part of the problem is that I feel the need to keep a record of all of the words I learn. (Or almost all of them, because I'm sure I passively pick up some words through listening and reading.) This means I must keep vocab lists in my notebook. Each page in my notebook has a Spanish side and an English side. Sometimes I just add words and their translations, but often I copy down a whole sentence. Last month I quit using Anki and started reviewing vocab words by covering the Spanish side in my notebook and trying to recall it based on the English side. However, I quickly got bored of this, so now I'm using Anki again, with mostly cloze deletion cards. I think I'm wasting time keeping both a vocab notebook and making Anki flashcards. What's the point of keeping a vocab notebook if I'm not going to review it? Is it a waste of time to make Anki flashcards? I feel reluctant to give up either method. I think I need to find a new way to review what I write in my vocab notebook, even if I just read through it occasionally. It would be nice to go through the notebook sometimes and try to write a paragraph or two using some of the words. I think that would be a nice way to reinforce what I've learned. Regarding Anki... it doesn't seem to take up too much time, yet. I only spend around 5 or 10 minutes/day adding new cards, and 15 minutes or so reviewing them.

I am like you on this. I think there is some value to actually writing the words in a vocab notebook, and I like having tangible evidence of my increasing vocabulary. But I also like using technology to learn those words. Here's what I do. I have a vocab notebook. I also have an Excel spreadsheet of all the words in my notebook. I really started using this as a way to make sure I had not already written the word down in my lists. But then I discovered that you can create a Memrise course of your own and by using the Bulk Add option I can easily add my 50 words per week in about 5 seconds (once I have entered them in Excel). So now, when I am reading and come across a word I don't immediately know, I look it up in my phone dictionary, screenshot the page and then the next day I will check my spreadsheet to see if I already have it. If not, I enter it into the notebook and the spreadsheet. Takes about 5 seconds per word. Then once a week I cut and paste the word list for that week into Memrise.

[philomath]

Here's what I do. I have a vocab notebook. I also have an Excel spreadsheet of all the words in my notebook. I really started using this as a way to make sure I had not already written the word down in my lists. But then I discovered that you can create a Memrise course of your own and by using the Bulk Add option I can easily add my 50 words per week in about 5 seconds (once I have entered them in Excel). So now, when I am reading and come across a word I don't immediately know, I look it up in my phone dictionary, screenshot the page and then the next day I will check my spreadsheet to see if I already have it. If not, I enter it into the notebook and the spreadsheet. Takes about 5 seconds per word. Then once a week I cut and paste the word list for that week into Memrise.

Hmm, that's an intriguing method! I'm a big fan of Excel spreadsheets and love making them for other areas of my life: budgets, lists of recipes I like to cook... I should try keeping a spreadsheet for vocabulary like you suggest. I'll have to think about how I would add it to my routine though, because I don't want to spend too much time on vocab by keeping a notebook, a spreadsheet, and trying to make flashcards all at the same time.

[PaleoPaul]

Yes, it does sound like a lot but it's not too bad. I like keeping the spreadsheet list because it also gives me practice in typing with a Spanish keyboard!

[philomath]

Disappeared from the forum for a bit while I got used to my new internship and new schedule. I haven't completely stopped studying Spanish; in fact, I've been doing a lot more reading lately. I read El tiempo entre costuras on my commute to work, and I read El País articles during my lunch break. I'm actually enjoying reading the news in Spanish. I like to read whatever article from El País catches my attention, and then read some more articles on the same topic. For example, one day I read about recent HIV research and another day I read about the healthcare system in China. I feel like I'm learning more vocabulary by reading more. Sometimes I write down words in my notebook, and my plan is to review them and make cloze deletion cards in Anki for the ones I can't remember. At the same time, I'm fine with forgetting words that I won't need to use (at least not yet). What I think would really help me learn new words is trying to use them in conversation or in writing.

One thing I've been thinking about lately is the importance of establishing habits. I now have a habit of reading in Spanish, but I think my Spanish would improve a lot if I started a habit of speaking and writing in Spanish a little bit every day. I just need to think of where in my schedule to put these new habits. Maybe I can try speaking to myself in Spanish while I get ready for work in the morning. Writing is trickier because I usually write a couple of paragraphs during each session, and that takes time.

[jeff_lindqvist]

This plan definitely needs some fixing. For example, when should I start doing listening practice? I have no idea. Starting it sooner rather than later seems to be a good idea, but I won't be able to understand anything.

I came to think of LeoSmith's excellent thread LIE to a polyglot, and while looking for that, I found Cainntear's advice in a recent thread about French.

[philomath]

Spanish
July Review
- 3 hours 20 minutes of listening practice. Entirely La casa de papel, if I recall correctly. I finished Season 1 and I’m excited to start Season 2!
- 1 hour 20 minutes of speaking practice. I only practiced speaking to myself rather than speaking to an iTalki tutor. Not included in the 1 hr 20 min are the four Pimsleur lessons I did.
- Didn’t do any formal grammar study. Oh well... I feel like I have a good grasp on the grammar at this point, although there are some small things I should review.
- Learned 91 new words. I think this is a much more reasonable amount (for me, at least) than trying to learn hundreds of words. I learned them either from looking them up when I couldn’t say something during speaking practice, or from encountering them in my reading. Some of these words I put into Anki, and others I wrote in my notebook and tried to review or use them once in a while.
- Read 134 pages. This month I managed to develop somewhat of a reading habit in Spanish. I read El tiempo entre costuras during my commute and El País articles during my lunch break.
- Wrote 473 words. I bought a new notebook specifically for writing in Spanish, but I haven’t written much in it yet. It’s hard to find the motivation and the time in my schedule to write.

August Goals
This month I really want to develop some speaking and writing habits. I’ve made some more specific goals, however, because I’ve found that goals really help me stay motivated.

- Do 5 hours of listening practice.
- Do 2 hours 30 minutes of speaking practice.
- Do 10 Pimsleur lessons.
- Do 1 hour 30 minutes of grammar study (mostly reviewing the conjugations and some other topics).
- Learn 150 new words.
- Read 150 pages.
- Write 1,500 words.

Ancient Greek and Chinese
Last month I barely did any Ancient Greek: I learned the vocab from Lessons 5 and 6 and that’s it. I never started Chinese because I got too busy with my internship. So... Ancient Greek and Chinese are temporarily on hold. I think I should focus on Spanish and the other projects that I’m working on (programming, volunteer work, writing, etc.). Oh well.

[philomath]

I’ve gotten a bit distracted from learning Spanish lately. Last month I barely used Spanish at all, so this month I’d like to get back into some kind of routine. Right now, my only plan is that I’m not going to set any specific goals for myself, because I don’t want to get burnt out again, and that I’m going to return to using one Spanish notebook instead of having two, with one specifically for writing.