Xmmm's Log ...

[Xmmm]

Italian

La coscienza di zeno. I think this is a subtle and comic work, and as such a poor choice for listening with < 90% comprehension. I'll finish it, but will have to come back around to it again in another six months or year.

Mani pulite. Still boring, but easy to read so I'm sticking with it. I realized that the super-challenge algorithm counts each book as being worth at least 2 films, and only counts the language you are most productive in, so if I want to win, I should just be reading Mani pulite and Hitler: A Biography [Italian Edition] multiple times. I have an Aldo Moro book too that's about 500 pages, but otherwise Italian non-fiction is surprisingly hard to find if I don't want to read diet books, etc.

Russian

Невский is a pretty good show (youtube). It's not earth-shatteringly original, but it is a realistic cop should with very few ridiculous, totally implausible scenes. It is also shot in a city, which is a nice change. A lot of Russian shows are shot in the middle of nowhere (cheaper I suppose) and have people running in and out of shacks in forests.

When I started up martial arts seven years ago, I called the school and spoke to an instructor and said "I don't think I'm in good enough shape even for the beginner class." And he said "you don't get in in shape before you come to class. You come to class and get in shape." And he was right.

So for Russian ... I stopped doing Italki a couple years ago after 50 hours because my grammar was horrible and I didn't want to fossilize, etc. as people are so often warned on this board. And, my heart was in the right place. But the actual outcome is that my speaking ability has regressed, and I doubt if my grammar has improved much. My stockpile of set phrases from TV has certainly improved, but it was probably a net negative to quit the speaking practice. So I'm trying out two tutors this week.

Turkish

I tried to start Denizler Altında Yirmi Bin Fersah, the version for 10 year olds, and ... I need more vocab.

[DaveAgain]

Italian

La coscienza di zeno. I think this is a subtle and comic work, and as such a poor choice for listening with < 90% comprehension. I'll finish it, but will have to come back around to it again in another six months or year.

Mani pulite. Still boring, but easy to read so I'm sticking with it. I realized that the super-challenge algorithm counts each book as being worth at least 2 films, and only counts the language you are most productive in, so if I want to win, I should just be reading Mani pulite and Hitler: A Biography [Italian Edition] multiple times. I have an Aldo Moro book too that's about 500 pages, but otherwise Italian non-fiction is surprisingly hard to find if I don't want to read diet books, etc.

I bought a copy of Alberto Angela's "the reach of Rome" as a gift for someone (not heard back if they liked it yet! ) and I've bookmarked, but not yet got around to buying/reading Alessandro Barbero's "Le jour des Barbares: adrinople 9 aout 378"

[Xmmm]

Italian

La coscienza di zeno. I think this is a subtle and comic work, and as such a poor choice for listening with < 90% comprehension. I'll finish it, but will have to come back around to it again in another six months or year.

Mani pulite. Still boring, but easy to read so I'm sticking with it. I realized that the super-challenge algorithm counts each book as being worth at least 2 films, and only counts the language you are most productive in, so if I want to win, I should just be reading Mani pulite and Hitler: A Biography [Italian Edition] multiple times. I have an Aldo Moro book too that's about 500 pages, but otherwise Italian non-fiction is surprisingly hard to find if I don't want to read diet books, etc.

I bought a copy of Alberto Angela's "the reach of Rome" as a gift for someone (not heard back if they liked it yet! ) and I've bookmarked, but not yet got around to buying/reading Alessandro Barbero's "Le jour des Barbares: adrinople 9 aout 378"

Those sound like good tips. I'll try 9 agosto 378 il giorno dei barbari first. Thanks!

But first, I have to finish the book I picked up yesterday to avoid having to read Mani pulite. Quasi colpevole di Paolo Pinna Parpaglia. Highly rated on amazon.it -- but I'm not sure why. Maybe it gets better. Paint-by-numbers supermarket trash right now, although the writing skill is above average. It's an easy read so I will persevere to rack up some pages for the SC.

[Xmmm]

Italian

9 agosto 378 il giorno dei barbari ended up being a great little book and an easy read. I picked up Il divano di istanbul by the same author. Thanks again, DaveAgain.

I listened to Sostiene pereira for the third time and decided that I do like it. The book is missing a couple things, and otherwise it could have been a modern classic, but oh well -- it's definitely better than Quasi colpevole or Il vampiro di venezia.

Italki in Italian is going well. I've done more than 30 hours now. Today I came with a really authentic Italian phrase, complete with embedded curse word -- it was so legitimate that my tutor burst out laughing. I have to credit the low-life characters of Suburra for the base phrase, which I modified for my situation. But it literally flew out without me consciously constructing it -- really a high point for me. I really felt Italian (and when it comes to cursing, I think Italians are second to none. Russian doesn't even begin to compare and English must be in last place for such a sweepstakes).

Russian

I'm continuing with Невский. It's low key, but I like it.

I had Italki sessions with two different tutors and they went great. I did some speaking back in 2016 and had stopped for two years. I was afraid I'd be back to square one. But all my TV viewing saved me. Whatever I lost over time in active vocabulary, I more than made up for with improved comprehension and the ability to spit out various conversational utterances. I'm going to try to get back in the groove and do two hours a week of Russian conversation going forward.

Turkish

I'm still struggling to do with one language what Expugnator does so easily with all his languages ... do 15 minutes here, 20 minutes there and make real progress. I know somewhere between 1000 and 1500 words cold and could ace a test on those. But it's not enough to launch into my usual strategy of watching TV zombie-style, and Turkish doesn't have an abundance of dumbed-down learning materials so that I can go halfway through one and then pick up something else when I'm bored.

I think Italian was close enough to English that I could be a slacker and still make progress (and besides I was still giving Italian more than an hour a day). With Russian, I had enough real passion and commitment to just keep banging my head against the wall until it gave way, and there was a very long period of time where I was doing three hours a day whether I was picking anything up or not. But with Turkish -- it's more of a whim. I seriously don't have time to devote myself to it. It has to survive on bits and scraps of free time.

I have this lovely book called "The Delights of Learning Turkish", which is really well crafted and contains over 3000 vocabulary words, but I can't seem to finish it. And I have FSI but can't seem to finish that either. And I have Glossika!

The best thing for me would be to ban myself from TV and commit to finishing some course, any course. But I just have zero discipline.

[Xmmm]

I made the mistake of dabbling in Irish 4 years ago. I thought I'd escaped, but there are some dark forces pulling me back towards it. I'm hanging by a thread at the moment ...

I keep telling myself:

German is more practical
Georgian is more exotic
Esperanto has more speakers
At least 100 languages on Italki have cheaper and better qualified tutors.

To be clear

I am not Irish
I'm not married to an Irish person
I don't know any Irish people
Irish TV is worse than Italian TV
All great Irish literature in the last 100 years, as far as I know, is written in English.

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[galaxyrocker]

I made the mistake of dabbling in Irish 4 years ago. I thought I'd escaped, but there are some dark forces pulling me back towards it. I'm hanging by a thread at the moment ...

It does that to you....It's like a drug you can't ever forget.

All great Irish literature in the last 100 years, as far as I know, is written in English.

That's where I'll say you're wrong. There's some really good novels, biographies and shortstories written in Irish. In fact, one of the most prominent just got its first English translation last year. There's a lot of works in Irish, most just are ignored since so few speak it.

Edit: Cré na Cille being perhaps the best-known one, and the one that just got translated.

[Expugnator]

- Georgian is more exotic
- It's easier than Russian
- Entirely phonemic alphabet
- You can watch your favorite series dubbed
- Ebooks are among the cheapest worldwide

[Xmmm]

Sometimes cognitive dissonance resolves itself in strange ways. I was feeling the pull of Irish, and trying to counterbalance the pull with something (slightly) more logical like Georgian, and I was feeling bad that my aimless dilettante efforts in Turkish were getting me nowhere.

So I decided to blow everything up. Turkish, Irish, and Georgian are now going to have to compete Survivor style to see who wins a permanent place in my collection. Thanks again to galaxyrocker for valued input, and to Expugnator for his inspiring example of how to do more with less -- hopefully I can clone what he does to a degree.


Italian

I finished Il divano di istanbul. Another short, light history. Lepanto is next.

My wife hears bits and snippets of my Italki sessions. She says my Russian sounds much more impressive than my Italian. I don't know what to make of that, since I know that my Russian is total crap -- and I thought my Italian was better. But maybe not.


Russian

I read and then went back and listened to герой нашего времени, the Red Kalinka version (B1/B2). It's just a little bit easy for me, but I'm so tired of banging my head against the wall wrestling with stuff above my level that it's like a vacation ...

I have two Russian tutors now. In some ways, my Russian is much better than two years ago. I get the cases right much more often (maybe half the time instead of zero). What's killing me at the moment is active vocabulary. Very simple words I've known for years flee when I have need of them. Both of my tutors expressed surprise and relief that I can converse badly on a wide variety of subjects, though.


-------------------- Crash and Burn Line ----------------------------------------------------

Turkish

Flashcards: 2400
Glossika: 5390 reps

I've completed an extremely quick pass through The Delights of Learning Turkish. Mostly to harvest vocabulary, because I've never been able to find a decent Turkish frequency list. The next phase is to continue with Glossika while working through all the exercises in Delights.

Irish

Flashcards: 186
Glossika: 248 reps

I'm on Buntús Cainte Book 1, Ceacht 5. The first 20 lessons or so are technically a review for me (although I've forgotten everything). It's amazing to listen to the people that did the recordings back in 1967, and then listen to the tutors available on Italki ... almost doesn't sound like Irish these days. I do feel a bit like John Steed in the old Avengers TV show, who insists on wearing dandified clothes that are 30 years out of date. When a woman points out to him that his clothes are not in vogue, he says "my dear, I don't follow the fashions. I set them." So, yes I will be aiming for a high standard retro accent and actually worrying about my accent for the first time. It's a pity I'm not very musical. But since there's almost no one to talk to, I guess it all works out anyway.

Georgian

Flashcards: 13
Glossika: 160 reps

I actually have some ties to Georgia. Not only does the country and its citizens pop up in Russian history and literature all the time, but I had the misfortune to invest in a Georgian oil and gas venture about 15 years ago. Supposedly the oil Soviet wells were only half drained and the old Soviet equipment was perfectly serviceable. Oh, well.

I'm trying to start with the alphabet for now. I'm part way through the Peace Corps "course" (all 28 pages of it). I have Beginner's Georgian lined up right behind it, and "Book2" which is some kind of phrase book.

[Teango]

I guess that makes today TGI Friday for you? Seriously though....Turkish, Georgian, and Irish...what a sublime combination!

[Expugnator]

That's great news! Feel free to contact me for any doubts about choice of resources. Georgian still isn't very rich in terms of resources but it actually got way better ever since I started in 2012.

With Russian, Turkish and Georgian you get coverage of a fascinating area of the Globe. I'll get to Turkish eventually (currently only doing Clozemaster on it).