Japanese and Mandarin in 50 years, with a lot of detours.

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David27
Green Belt
Posts: 279
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 8:52 pm
Languages: English (N)
French, Spanish (advanced)
Russian, Portuguese, Italian, German (proficient)
Mandarin, Japanese, Dutch (low-intermediate)
Latin, Polish: (beginner)
Abandoned languages (for now) :( Greek, Czech, Bengali, Arabic, Norwegian
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Re: Japanese and Mandarin in 50 years, with a lot of detours.

Postby David27 » Wed Dec 01, 2021 3:25 am

Quick update, since I just wrote not too long ago, I'll focus more on goals to close out the year rather on what I have been doing. In December I want to make a good final push of at least 12 hours in Japanese and Mandarin study each. I also haven't been reading any literature at all in several weeks, I will have a week off over Christmas so will finish La Peste. In November I got HBOmax (just to watch Dune, which I enjoyed), but since I have a one month subscription now, I took advantage and watched 5 studio Ghibli films in order to get an idea of what they're about since it's such a cultural icon of Japan... and I think I have a good grasp of now, and also watched Umberto D which I thought was very good, and I would also like to watch Divorzio all'italiana, since it was on my list of movies to watch and happens to be available on there.

November Hours:
Japanese: 10 hours, 15 minutes
Mandarin: 9 hours, 40 minutes
Russian: 7 hours, 25 minutes
Spanish: 7 hours, 0 minutes
German: 3 hours, 15 minutes
French: 1 hour, 30 minutes
Italian: 1 hour, 20 minutes
Latin: 1 hour, 5 minutes
Dutch: 50 minutes
Arabic: 15 minutes
Portuguese: 5 minutes

Running 2021 total:
Mandarin: 97 hours, 50 minutes
Japanese: 96 hours, 10 minutes
Spanish: 95 hours, 50 minutes
Russian: 67 hours, 25 minutes
German: 49 hours, 5 minutes
French: 23 hours, 55 minutes
Latin: 15 hours, 50 minutes
Italian: 15 hours, 25 minutes
Dutch: 13 hours, 15 minutes
Portuguese: 7 hours, 55 minutes
Arabic: 1 hour, 15 minutes
4 x

David27
Green Belt
Posts: 279
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 8:52 pm
Languages: English (N)
French, Spanish (advanced)
Russian, Portuguese, Italian, German (proficient)
Mandarin, Japanese, Dutch (low-intermediate)
Latin, Polish: (beginner)
Abandoned languages (for now) :( Greek, Czech, Bengali, Arabic, Norwegian
x 987

Re: Japanese and Mandarin in 50 years, with a lot of detours.

Postby David27 » Sun Jan 16, 2022 3:48 am

In December, I finished reading La Peste by Albert Camus. Overall, I would say the book was okay, not among my favorites, but I don't regret reading it. I particularly liked part 1: the reaction and actions of the citizens of Oran to the first signs of the plague, and then I liked reading the end section, how life picks back up again and how the characters react/adjust. The middle did get long for me in his philosophical style of writing. A bit too much philosophical monologs on life, death, and religion. I prefer l'étranger, so my recommendation would be start with that, then move on to La Peste depending on how much you enjoyed l'étranger.

I didn't have a lot of time for language learning in December unfortunately, so instead of studying regularly I just finished reading La Peste as planned, but I also did have time for some Russian reading (I read Vladimir Putin's essay on Russian-Ukranian historical relationship piece that he published over the summer and also spent time listening to and reading more Russian and Ukranian news).

In the next section I'll discuss what I did in 2021 and plans for 2022, first with books read then by language group.

Books read: Since my daughter was born there were long periods when she was very young when she was sleeping on me and I was in a rocking chair, and my commute was long for several months, so I listened to several audiobooks, which saved my books "read" category for this year. 2 books in Spanish, 2 books in Russian, 1 book in French.

East Asian: In 2020, I did 30 minutes daily of Mandarin and Japanese, and this really helped me. In 2021, I missed a lot more days, and the days I studied it was usually 20 minutes. I did completely finish Genki book 1 and review as planned and moved onto Genki II, on page 100/348. So goal to finish this. I also finished I think all the benefits japanesepod101 can help and ended my subscription, now I just listen to podcasts in 100% Japanese (albeit material aimed at foreigners) such as Nihongo con Teppei and Yuyu no nihongo podcast.

Mandarin: I like the material on LingQ, but I always have trouble working consistently on a computer based platform. Too many distractions and I just don't learn as well with the screen in front of me... which is weird because I work all day at a computer no problem, but maybe that's part of why when relaxing and working with languages, I want to be away from the screen. So I didn't meet the LingQ goal... And actually when on LingQ I often use it for Dutch or Latin which I own less materials for. For materials, I haven't used as much popupchinese (too much English), and started watching peppa pig in Mandarin, and different youtube channels (Mandarin Click, Learn Chinese essentials, Yimin Chinese, Mandarin corner, etc) that are just in Mandarin. For the DeFrancis book, I took a break for awhile, but picking it back up, currently on page 133. I also would like to get and read some simple Chinese books.

So overall goal, average 20 minutes/day, 120 hours for each language.

Romance: Success in breaking Spanish into an everyday language in 2021. I have been buying different children's books and reading several of them daily with my daughter, also just using more Spanish at all opportunities. I also completed 2 books in Spanish, 1 book in French as planned. So goals met. In 2022, I want to just continue my Spanish (no reading goals, since I'm always reading children's books now in Spanish), 1 book in French, but I want to push my Italian reading up this year, especially as I learn more Latin, I want to brush the cobwebs off my Italian and improve that. I have a copy of Lord of the Rings in Italian, so I want to read through that in English and Italian so I can see how I like the translation (and because I like JRR Tolkein's original work and just want to re-read it in English as well). No specific or hard plans for Latin or Portuguese this year, just doing whatever I feel like/come across.

Russian: I was planning to perhaps de-emphasize Russian a bit this year and goal of 1 book and >25 hours... but I ended up with 75 hours and 2 audiobooks, I just can't stay away. Similar goal for next year, 1 book, but I will likely keep Russian towards the front of my rotation as usual, listening to podcasts, news, and reading in Russian in 2022. Last year I stayed firm away from other Slavic languages... we'll see if another one tempts me in 2022.

Germanic:
EasyGerman podcasts is single handedly improving my German quite a bit (at least my listening comprehension). I wanted to read my dual-language collection of stories of Kafka and Rilke, but I started it on January 1st this year. Kafka is a tough read for me, so I really do need the dual-language (even in English I find a lot of his stories difficult with run on sentences and hidden meanings or multiple possible (as I see it) interpretations). I haven't planned on buying any new books until I make some serious progress on the books on my bookshelf, but I may buy a Harry Potter in Dutch just so I have something that I can read and understand without worrying about understanding the story to practice my Dutch and build up my vocabulary. We'll see if this happens or not later this year. For now, my hands are full with what I'm doing in January.

Other: I worked on the Arabic alphabet and a bit from my Assimil Arabic course reading through lesson 1 and trying to write it out to get good at the alphabet. I'm still not great at it with not that much done in 2021, no plans really for 2022 except when it strikes my fancy.

December Hours:
Japanese: 5 Hours, 20 minutes
Mandarin: 4 hours, 55 minutes
Spanish: 8 hours, 0 minutes
Russian: 8 hours, 10 minutes
German: 3 hours, 15 minutes
French: 4 hours, 45 minutes
Italian: 3 hours, 10 minutes
Latin: 2 hours, 5 minutes
Dutch: 55 minutes
Arabic: 25 minutes
Portuguese: 20 minutes

Final 2021 total:
Spanish: 103 hours, 50 minutes
Mandarin: 102 hours, 45 minutes
Japanese: 101 hours, 30 minutes
Russian: 75 hours, 35 minutes
German: 52 hours, 5 minutes
French: 28 hours, 40 minutes
Italian: 18 hours, 35 minutes
Latin 17 hours, 55 minutes
Dutch: 14 hours, 10 minutes
Portuguese: 8 hours, 15 minutes
Arabic: 1 hour, 40 minutes

2022 Total: 525 Hours, 0 minutes.
2021 Total: 600 Hours, 15 minutes
10 x

David27
Green Belt
Posts: 279
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 8:52 pm
Languages: English (N)
French, Spanish (advanced)
Russian, Portuguese, Italian, German (proficient)
Mandarin, Japanese, Dutch (low-intermediate)
Latin, Polish: (beginner)
Abandoned languages (for now) :( Greek, Czech, Bengali, Arabic, Norwegian
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Re: Japanese and Mandarin in 50 years, with a lot of detours.

Postby David27 » Tue Feb 01, 2022 2:48 am

January Update Ein deutscher Monat

I spent much more time on German, mainly because I stuck to my New Year's resolution to read more, and completed the short stories by Kafka in my dual-language Meistererzählungen von Kafka und Rilke. Thank goodness it was dual-language, because for me understanding Kafka is even difficult in the English translation. The subject matter, and his style of meandering run-on sentences gave me some trouble (plus the German is above my level, though that is good for my study). I moderately enjoyed the writings though, the stories were short enough that I could puzzle them out, without the extra mühe boring me or burning me out. I also started watching Das boot tv series on Hulu, which was okay... but reminded me of how much I enjoyed watching the original 1980s movie, so then I started watching that in chunks instead.

I should probably work more on writing and speaking German, but of the languages I speak, I find the least opportunities to use German, so I don't feel driven to push my output, but rather to just continue to enjoy media/books in the language. I enjoy speaking the language, but just do so by either reading aloud or sometimes speaking to myself (I'm not weird, I promise).

Outside of that, I'm happy that I hit my goals in Mandarin and Japanese, new year's is a good time to refocus, and get consistency back into my study.

For February, I plan to continue the momentum in German, and work on reading the Rilke stories and finish Das Boot (after finishing the movie off, maybe I'll return to the TV show).

January Hours:
German: 11 hours, 30 minutes
Japanese: 10 hours, 35 minutes
Mandarin: 10 hours, 30 minutes
Spanish: 7 hours, 0 minutes
Russian: 5 hours, 20 minutes
Italian: 2 hours, 0 minutes
Dutch: 1 hour, 50 minutes
French: 1 hour, 30 minutes
Latin: 35 minutes
Portuguese: 15 minutes
6 x

StringerBell
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Languages: English (n)
Italian
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Re: Japanese and Mandarin in 50 years, with a lot of detours.

Postby StringerBell » Tue Feb 01, 2022 4:06 am

David27 wrote:I have a copy of Lord of the Rings in Italian, so I want to read through that in English and Italian so I can see how I like the translation (and because I like JRR Tolkein's original work and just want to re-read it in English as well).


Which translation do you have? My husband and several of his friends are LOTTR fans and read it in Italian. What I know from them is that the original translation (done by a woman whose name I don't remember) was considered excellent. She didn't translate it literally but she did it in such a way as to evoke the same kind of feelings in Italian. She was a huge fan and met Tolkein in person. A few years ago her contract with the publishing company expired and instead of notifying her they hired a new guy to retranslate it. His version is considered to be absolute garbage and to add insult to injury there was some drama when he decided to trash talk the original translator online because he was convinced that he was so much better. The original translated version by the woman I mentioned was removed from the market so they are CRAZY expensive in Italy (like $1,000) because that's the one everyone wants, no one wants his version, which neither preserves the original intent/feel of the story nor is a literal translation. So if you managed to get the original translation, you're in luck! And if you have the new translation...at least you know what you've got.
4 x
Season 4 Lucifer Italian transcripts I created: https://learnanylanguage.fandom.com/wik ... ranscripts

David27
Green Belt
Posts: 279
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 8:52 pm
Languages: English (N)
French, Spanish (advanced)
Russian, Portuguese, Italian, German (proficient)
Mandarin, Japanese, Dutch (low-intermediate)
Latin, Polish: (beginner)
Abandoned languages (for now) :( Greek, Czech, Bengali, Arabic, Norwegian
x 987

Re: Japanese and Mandarin in 50 years, with a lot of detours.

Postby David27 » Tue Feb 01, 2022 1:28 pm

StringerBell wrote:
David27 wrote:I have a copy of Lord of the Rings in Italian, so I want to read through that in English and Italian so I can see how I like the translation (and because I like JRR Tolkein's original work and just want to re-read it in English as well).


Which translation do you have? My husband and several of his friends are LOTTR fans and read it in Italian. What I know from them is that the original translation (done by a woman whose name I don't remember) was considered excellent. She didn't translate it literally but she did it in such a way as to evoke the same kind of feelings in Italian. She was a huge fan and met Tolkein in person. A few years ago her contract with the publishing company expired and instead of notifying her they hired a new guy to retranslate it. His version is considered to be absolute garbage and to add insult to injury there was some drama when he decided to trash talk the original translator online because he was convinced that he was so much better. The original translated version by the woman I mentioned was removed from the market so they are CRAZY expensive in Italy (like $1,000) because that's the one everyone wants, no one wants his version, which neither preserves the original intent/feel of the story nor is a literal translation. So if you managed to get the original translation, you're in luck! And if you have the new translation...at least you know what you've got.


Wow fascinating. I just checked, it is by Vitoria Alliata, looks like the original translation. It’s an old copy of all 3 books in one, I picked it up at a cute used bookstore/coffee shop in the Hudson valley here in New York a several years ago for $15 dollars, seemed like a great deal even without knowing anything else. So far I’ve only read intro section (mostly focused on German reading last month). If it’s really worth that much I’m worried about damaging it with my reading! If anyone wants to shell out 1000 dollars for it… I’d be willing to sell for that price lol
3 x

StringerBell
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Languages: English (n)
Italian
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Re: Japanese and Mandarin in 50 years, with a lot of detours.

Postby StringerBell » Tue Feb 01, 2022 1:57 pm

It's great news that you've got the original translation! I don't know if the craziness over wanting her translated versions has died down by now or if it only applies to certain editions. So I think you should definitely read it and enjoy it. If you ever get to a point where you don't want it on your bookshelf anymore, definitely check out what price that editiion in that condition is going for in Italy before getting rid of it.
4 x
Season 4 Lucifer Italian transcripts I created: https://learnanylanguage.fandom.com/wik ... ranscripts

David27
Green Belt
Posts: 279
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 8:52 pm
Languages: English (N)
French, Spanish (advanced)
Russian, Portuguese, Italian, German (proficient)
Mandarin, Japanese, Dutch (low-intermediate)
Latin, Polish: (beginner)
Abandoned languages (for now) :( Greek, Czech, Bengali, Arabic, Norwegian
x 987

Re: Japanese and Mandarin in 50 years, with a lot of detours.

Postby David27 » Sat Feb 12, 2022 4:26 am

I had a -30 minute visit completely conducted in Russian this week with a Belorussian gentleman. It all went smoothly, there were only 3 words I needed to verify, “kidney/почка”, “adrenal/надпочечная” and “appointment/прием”. I had heard them before, but on the spot blanked. My nurse had an interpreter on the line anyway, so they got to just listen in and fill in for me with those words (which saved me the time of having to look up). I understand forgetting kidney and adrenal, not words I encounter often, but appointment should be easy… I could have used свидание or встреча. But it was for blood work, so those words didn’t seem to fit, and the interpreter was able to fill in with приём. Overall I’m pleased with how smooth and relatively easy it was. Though again, the longer I speak Russian, the more I feel my accent worsening.
7 x

David27
Green Belt
Posts: 279
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 8:52 pm
Languages: English (N)
French, Spanish (advanced)
Russian, Portuguese, Italian, German (proficient)
Mandarin, Japanese, Dutch (low-intermediate)
Latin, Polish: (beginner)
Abandoned languages (for now) :( Greek, Czech, Bengali, Arabic, Norwegian
x 987

Re: Japanese and Mandarin in 50 years, with a lot of detours.

Postby David27 » Mon Mar 07, 2022 3:22 am

After January ended, so ended (most of) my German reading. I still continued following EasyGerman podcast though. My focus in February was just keeping up in Japanese and Mandarin due to being busier at work.

When Russia invaded Ukraine, I was pretty shocked. I follow Russian media and news pretty closely, I didn't think they would actually launch a full-scale invasion, which I guess is pretty naïve given the troop buildup and intelligence reports... but even reading Putin's essays and watching his speech and listening to their state propaganda from time to time... all this killing and destruction just doesn't make any sense. I also started listening to Ukrainian sources, mostly in Russian but occasionally in Ukrainian, and can't understand the Ukrainian so I went ahead and the last 3 days in February and read a lot about Ukrainian (in English) to get a better idea about the language, and did ~5 minutes a day on LingQ, which now I've continued a bit into March (though not consistently, as still my main goal is Mandarin/Japanese improvement). I don't plan on learning to speak Ukrainian, but I hope to familiarize myself to be able to understand it a bit, as I was inspired by the Ukrainian people's and president Zelensky's strength and will under this brutal attack. My Grandmother was Ukrainian and spoke Ukrainian, but she and my Great-Aunt passed away when I was in high school, and they were the last speakers in their family. That was a large part of why I wanted to learn Russian. Ukrainian seemed like an impossible option, not offered at University, limited resources, etc. But now I really want to understand it better. The whole situation there is just very depressing.

From a linguistic standpoint, I am struck by the similarity with Polish. Apparently Ukrainian has more lexical similarities with Polish than Russian, though I assume grammatically more in common with Russian as they are both Eastern Slavic languages? I am not deep enough into the language to tell for certain yet, but polymathy's youtube video on the languages also showed this similarity in vocabulary with Polish. Polish is the only one of my "abandoned" languages that I had made some real progress in before setting it aside, so I still remember quite a bit of my A1 vocabulary, and looking at Ukrainian made me simultaneously want to look at the same texts at LingQ mini-stories, to see how the text is side by side in Ukrainian and Polish. So I don't know how long I'll keep this side project up, but for now I plan on continuing if I can. I'm always spreading myself too thin.

February Hours:
Japanese: 9 hours, 25 minutes
Mandarin: 8 hours, 0 minutes
Russian: 6 hours, 55 minutes
Spanish: 4 hours, 40 minutes
German: 4 hours, 15 minutes
Italian: 1 hour, 55 minutes
Latin: 1 hour, 5 minutes
Polish: 15 minutes
Ukrainian:15 minutes
French: 15 minutes
Portuguese: 10 minutes
Dutch: 5 minutes

2022 running total
Japanese: 20 hours, 0 minutes
Mandarin: 18 hours, 30 minutes
German: 16 hours, 0 minutes
Russian: 12 hours, 15 minutes
Spanish: 11 hours, 40 minutes
Italian: 3 hours, 55 minutes
Dutch: 1 hour, 55 minutes
French: 1 hour, 45 minutes
Latin: 1 hour, 40 minutes
Portuguese: 25 minutes
Polish: 15 minutes
Ukrainian: 15 minutes
9 x

David27
Green Belt
Posts: 279
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 8:52 pm
Languages: English (N)
French, Spanish (advanced)
Russian, Portuguese, Italian, German (proficient)
Mandarin, Japanese, Dutch (low-intermediate)
Latin, Polish: (beginner)
Abandoned languages (for now) :( Greek, Czech, Bengali, Arabic, Norwegian
x 987

Re: Japanese and Mandarin in 50 years, with a lot of detours.

Postby David27 » Sun May 01, 2022 9:49 am

March-April Hours
I fell a bit behind in the last 2 months, more so in April than March. I only had one weekend off work in April and on call most evenings meant less time to relax and open a language book, so more of my study was spent on listening while driving or walking the dog. I’ve transitioned to podcasts geared towards learners but 100% in Japanese or Mandarin such as Nihongo con Teppei and YuYu Nihongo podcast and Chinese with Da Peng. For Russian I’ve stopped reading any news outlets, but still listen to Russian with Max from time to time, I’ve also rewatched a few movies such as Брат and Кавказский пленник with Сергей Бодров that I like. Кавказский пленник is particularly interesting because it was filmed in a Chechen village and they also have bits in Chechen.

For Ukrainian/Polish, I’m still doing bits and plan to continue. I’m feeling good with my Russian ‘anchor’ and ok branching out in the Slavic family. This is my third time starting Polish, let’s see how far I get this time around.

Plans for May: I have to give 3 lectures, but 2 are already written and I gave a version of it last year, the last one I’m writing from scratch so that will be a project outside of my typical duties. However I already have an outline, so hopefully it doesn’t take me too long to prep. I’m also starting out with a week of vacation (first vacation of the year), so in addition to rest and sleep, I’m planning on putting in some textbook studying for Mandarin/Japanese, and I’m taking my short stories by Kafka/Rilke. I’ve read all of the stories by Kafka in January, so this month I plan on reading the Rilke section.

March-April hours
Japanese: 19 hours, 5 minutes
Mandarin: 18 hours, 45 minutes
Spanish: 11 hours, 40 minutes
Russian: 10 hours, 15 minutes
Italian: 7 hours, 45 minutes
German: 6 hours, 15 minutes
Ukrainian: 2 hours, 15 minutes
Latin: 2 hours, 10 minutes
Dutch: 1 hour, 45 minutes
Polish: 1 hour, 25 minutes
French: 1 hour, 0 minutes
Portuguese: 50 minutes

2022 running total
Japanese: 39 hours, 5 minutes
Mandarin: 37 hours, 15 minutes
Spanish: 23 hours, 20 minutes
Russian: 22 hours, 30 minutes
German: 22 hours, 15 minutes
Italian: 11 hours, 40 minutes
Latin: 3 hours, 50 minutes
Dutch: 3 hours, 45 minutes
French: 2 hours, 45 minutes
Ukrainian: 2 hours, 30 minutes
Polish: 1 hour, 40 minutes
Portuguese: 1 hour, 15 minutes
4 x

David27
Green Belt
Posts: 279
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 8:52 pm
Languages: English (N)
French, Spanish (advanced)
Russian, Portuguese, Italian, German (proficient)
Mandarin, Japanese, Dutch (low-intermediate)
Latin, Polish: (beginner)
Abandoned languages (for now) :( Greek, Czech, Bengali, Arabic, Norwegian
x 987

Re: Japanese and Mandarin in 50 years, with a lot of detours.

Postby David27 » Wed Jun 01, 2022 3:01 am

May Update:

In the last 2 weeks, I met a Ukrainian man and a Polish woman, both spoke English very well, but I still tried a few words in Ukrainian, which got a positive reaction, but he could tell I couldn't actually speak Ukrainian, we did move on to Russian after that for a bit. As for Polish, I got a bit further than my Ukrainian, but still it was a struggle to just get out basic phrases! It goes to show my puny efforts in this doesn't produce large dividends (not that I had high expectations here). These experiences are useful though, as I had been very tempted and looking into materials for Albanian, given that I live near a large Albanian community. Living near isn't enough of a motivation though, as I still don't run into Albanians too frequently (I estimate once every other month to every 3 months). Given that I would likely not put serious effort/time into it, not worth further distracting myself, despite my interest. Përshëndetje may be just as far as I ever get.

For Russian, I started watching the TV comedy show with Volodymyr Zelenskiy. It's... not great (to my taste), kind of typical for Post-Soviet Russian language sitcom humor, but it's interesting just because he's in it... and plays the president of Ukraine in it. The show is available on Netflix in the US "Слуга народу". Speaking of Netflix. Last night I started watching Entrevias, a Spanish show on Netflix, which so far seems good.

No real updates for Mandarin/Japanese, just putting in a bit more time in the last month, still feeling like I am progressing, albeit slowly. The progress is encouraging though. At points in the past I thought I would never be able to get to a B2 level in these languages, now, I can definitely envision it, so there is hope.

May Hours:
Mandarin: 12 hours, 25 minutes
Japanese: 12 hours, 15 minutes
Spanish: 6 hours, 30 minutes
Russian: 6 hours, 25 minutes
Italian: 2 hours, 55 minutes
German: 2 hours, 45 minutes
French: 1 hour, 50 minutes (I get France24 on my TV now in French, so I have been watching a bit of that)
Latin: 1 hour, 25 minutes
Ukrainian: 1 hour, 10 minutes
Polish: 1 hour
Dutch: 40 minutes
Portuguese: 30 minutes

2022 running total
Japanese: 51 hours, 20 minutes
Mandarin: 49 hours, 40 minutes
Spanish: 29 hours, 50 minutes
Russian: 28 hours, 55 minutes
German: 25 hours, 0 minutes
Italian: 14 hours, 35 minutes
Latin: 5 hours, 15 minutes
French: 4 hours, 35 minutes
Dutch: 4 hours, 25 minutes
Ukrainian: 3 hours, 40 minutes
Polish: 2 hours, 40 minutes
Portuguese: 1 hour, 45 minutes
5 x


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