Japanese and Mandarin in 50 years, with a lot of detours.

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David27
Green Belt
Posts: 279
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 8:52 pm
Languages: English (N)
French, Spanish (advanced)
Russian, Portuguese, Italian, German (proficient)
Mandarin, Japanese, Dutch (low-intermediate)
Latin, Polish: (beginner)
Abandoned languages (for now) :( Greek, Czech, Bengali, Arabic, Norwegian
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Re: Japanese and Mandarin in 50 years, with a lot of detours.

Postby David27 » Sat Apr 01, 2023 2:19 am

March update

I finished book one of the Fellowship of the Ring in Italian, that is to say, Frodo and company have made it to Rivendell. I also listened to some Italian podcasts and took advantage of a few opportunities I had to speak small bits of Italian this past month. I'm happy with my Italian boost for the first three months of the year, next I'm going to put Italian on hold for a bit, and go back to Russian focus. One of my good Russian-speaking friends is getting married in early June, and I have a bachelor party with them in May, so I want to be fresh on my Russian, which means listening to Russian music, podcasts, and reading a book in Russian for the next few months (I haven't decided which book yet, I'll make a final decision tomorrow when I start, I have a small collection that I want to read). So I'll do 2-3 months of Russian as my third focus (along with Mandarin and Japanese), then maybe I'll go back to Italian, as I've really been enjoying spending time with the language... as of now the other language I've been wanting to dive more into reading again is Portuguese.

No meaningful updates on Mandarin and Japanese, just the continued mostly podcasts daily, with a bit of book learning sprinkled in. I haven't been reading my Graded-readers in the past month, mainly because when I sit down in the evening, I was reading Il Signore degli Anelli as noted above.

Spanish also has very present recently in my life, and reading more "Winny de Puh", my book of Spanish children's rhymes/songs and Spanish fairy tales. Outside of home I'm using it regularly at work. It's easy to get into the mode of just using it and not improving, so I'm trying to make more of an effort learn new vocabulary, work on my accent, be more conscientious of mistakes I make, etc.

March Hours
Mandarin: 11 hours, 10 minutes
Japanese: 11 hours, 0 minutes
Spanish: 10 hours, 40 minutes
Italian: 7 hours, 5 minutes
German: 3 hours, 50 minutes
Russian: 1 hour, 40 minutes
Dutch: 1 hour, 15 minutes
Portuguese: 40 minutes
Polish: 35 minutes
Latin: 35 minutes
French: 35 minutes
Ukrainian: 10 minutes

2023 hours
Japanese: 31 hours, 10 minutes
Mandarin: 31 hours, 0 minutes
Italian: 22 hours, 55 minutes
Spanish: 20 hours, 45 minutes
German: 9 hours, 40 minutes
Russian: 7 hours, 15 minutes
French: 4 hours, 5 minutes
Dutch: 3 hours, 0 minutes
Polish: 2 hours, 35 minutes
Ukrainian: 2 hours, 20 minutes
Portuguese: 2 hours, 15 minutes
Latin: 2 hours, 5 minutes
7 x

David27
Green Belt
Posts: 279
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 8:52 pm
Languages: English (N)
French, Spanish (advanced)
Russian, Portuguese, Italian, German (proficient)
Mandarin, Japanese, Dutch (low-intermediate)
Latin, Polish: (beginner)
Abandoned languages (for now) :( Greek, Czech, Bengali, Arabic, Norwegian
x 987

Re: Japanese and Mandarin in 50 years, with a lot of detours.

Postby David27 » Sun Apr 16, 2023 6:58 pm

Last week was interesting for me at work from a linguistic perspective. I met a Yemeni Arabic, Fulani speaker and a Mandinka speaker and needed to use interpreters for all. I couldn’t get a Yemeni interpreter, so used MSA which posed only very minor issues and clarification needed. For Fulani, it was very interesting that when numbers were used it was all French, but those were the only French loan words that I picked up. Greetings were Arabic loan. There are so many clustered languages in West Africa that I know so little about, but that are spoken the community where I live and work. The most frequent I see are Fulani, mandinka, Igbo or Akan, but with the later 2 the speakers generally speak English well as well, whereas with Fulani and Mandinka that isn’t the case.
6 x

David27
Green Belt
Posts: 279
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 8:52 pm
Languages: English (N)
French, Spanish (advanced)
Russian, Portuguese, Italian, German (proficient)
Mandarin, Japanese, Dutch (low-intermediate)
Latin, Polish: (beginner)
Abandoned languages (for now) :( Greek, Czech, Bengali, Arabic, Norwegian
x 987

Re: Japanese and Mandarin in 50 years, with a lot of detours.

Postby David27 » Thu Jun 01, 2023 2:55 am

April-May Hours:

I was busy at the turn of the month, then I got so late for an update I decided to just combine April and May. About two weeks ago I went to a Polish festival here, and was hugely impressed with how many people were speaking Polish at the festival (I thought most people would have Polish heritage, but speak English, but I would say the majority of people (over 200 I'd estimate) were speaking Polish. They had a Polish rock band, Polish food tents, a Polish Saturday school tent as well and Polish historical society tent. It was interesting, as I didn't realize there was a vibrant Polish community in the area. I usually don't meet Polish people or overhear Polish in my daily life.

For Japanese, there are a lot of Japanese speakers who live near me, but generally I am too shy/embarrassed to try to speak any Japanese. However I did start a conversation the other week with a gentleman who came to look at where I'm currently living (my lease is ending soon and I'm moving). I got through about 2 sentences with him before he switched to English asking where I learned Japanese lol, so overall not a roaring success. Yesterday at the park a couple was speaking in Japanese by me and I understood 100% as it wasn't too complex language, but again, I felt weird interrupting and eavesdropping, and most of my experience speaking Japanese here is similar to the one I described, where I say something and just get a surprised reaction and question in English of how I learned Japanese. Since I'm in the US, it doesn't bother me, but makes it not worth trying to practice. When I move, I doubt I will live by so many Japanese speakers again, so I really should make the best of this situation, but it's hard to get past that social discomfort, particularly when I'm not terribly confident in my level. Perhaps when I'm better and could converse more freely about more diverse/interesting range of topics I'll interact more.

Ukrainian and Polish had both fallen off in April. As I started doing more activities in Russian and begin reading Dostoyevsky's The Idiot (slow going for me, 54 pages in so far but I am enjoying the process of reading it) and watching some Russian movies, I actually found that I want to do less of other Slavic languages, to be able to focus on my Russian a bit more. In May that was counteracted by motivation at the Polish festival.

Speaking of overhearing another language. I was walking with my dog through the town square, and there is a restaurant with outdoor seating, and I passed by 2 couples speaking in French, and their French was so beautiful and elegant. I don't always get that reaction to French, but it is a beautiful language to my ears when it is spoken well.

For June, my primary goal is to continue my Japanese/Chinese at current goal. I am very busy with a lot going on, but I have a good routine where budgeting that 40 minutes is just part of my day, and I feel incomplete without it. As far as secondary, I'm tempted to go back to Italian, and continue reading part two of the Fellowship of the Ring in Italian, but I'm liking my Russian reading, and will continue with that for now. Outside of that, we'll see where wanderlust takes me.

April-May combined hours
Japanese: 21 hours, 5 minutes
Mandarin: 20 hours, 20 minutes
Russian: 13 hours, 35 minutes
Spanish: 11 hours, 25 minutes
Italian: 2 hours, 15 minutes
French: 2 hours, 0 minutes
Latin: 1 hour, 50 minutes
German: 1 hour, 30 minutes
Dutch: 1 hour, 25 minutes
Portuguese: 1 hour, 0 minutes
Polish: 50 minutes
Ukrainian: 20 minutes

2023 hours
Japanese: 52 hours, 15 minutes
Mandarin: 51 hours, 20 minutes
Spanish: 32 hours, 10 minutes
Italian: 25 hours, 10 minutes
Russian: 20 hours, 50 minutes
German: 11 hours, 10 minutes
French: 6 hours, 5 minutes
Dutch: 4 hours, 25 minutes
Latin: 3 hours, 55 minutes
Polish: 3 hours, 25 minutes
Portuguese: 3 hours, 15 minutes
Ukrainian: 2 hours, 40 minutes
6 x

David27
Green Belt
Posts: 279
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 8:52 pm
Languages: English (N)
French, Spanish (advanced)
Russian, Portuguese, Italian, German (proficient)
Mandarin, Japanese, Dutch (low-intermediate)
Latin, Polish: (beginner)
Abandoned languages (for now) :( Greek, Czech, Bengali, Arabic, Norwegian
x 987

Re: Japanese and Mandarin in 50 years, with a lot of detours.

Postby David27 » Thu Jun 15, 2023 1:51 pm

Для меня, это русский месяц. Я читаю Идиот, смотрю старый советский фильм Война и Мир, и в прошлые выходные был на русском свадьбе. Было весело. Хотел изучать и Польский чтобы изучать еще один славянский язык, но не успел
3 x

David27
Green Belt
Posts: 279
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 8:52 pm
Languages: English (N)
French, Spanish (advanced)
Russian, Portuguese, Italian, German (proficient)
Mandarin, Japanese, Dutch (low-intermediate)
Latin, Polish: (beginner)
Abandoned languages (for now) :( Greek, Czech, Bengali, Arabic, Norwegian
x 987

Re: Japanese and Mandarin in 50 years, with a lot of detours.

Postby David27 » Sat Jul 01, 2023 2:36 am

June review:

For starters, I am off work on family leave, taking care of my second child since my wife returned to work (I have 2 months off). I thought I wouldn’t have much extra time to study, but waking up and pacing with the baby in the middle of the night gives me a lot of time for podcasts, and the baby likes when I speak to him and repeat in different languages that I read from a book, so I’ve been pretty productive. Outside of that, I was in a Russian wedding, and for that a mutual friend who now is living and working in Prague came back to attend, so I also spent time with them on a separate day. To get into Russian, I watched War and Peace, and read more of The Idiot (now up to page 154). My friend invited us to go to Prague next year, which is very tempting, but even if I go, I don’t think I could add Czech.. I probably won’t be able ti resist, but I know it won’t be a successful endeavor.

The trip could be feasible, but it will be difficult. My wife is family friends with an Italian family from Tuscany. Their daughter is getting married next year in Tuscany, and we were invited. Their whole family was here visiting the US, and went to my father-in-law’s birthday celebration. So I met them and got to speak a good bit of Italian. We could go from there to Prague prior to returning to the US, but that would be a lot of travel that I’m not sure we’re up for as a family. It may be better to just stay in Tuscany and then come back… I have awhile to think it over.

The other exciting update (exciting to me, unlikely exciting to anyone else) is I’ve gotten past my hesitance to use Japanese, and have struck up 3 conversations in Japanese in the last weeks. They are improving from just 2 sentences, to the other day a good few minutes of back and forth dialogue. The conversations are basic, mostly N5 and some N4 vocab but nothing beyond, however I started feeling good about myself. Of course, right when I started feeling good about myself I was humbled with a sentence that I misunderstood, was corrected and then didn’t understand the explanation, and then got switched to English lol. It’s definitely progress though. I also watched 3 episodes of polar bear cafe. The language is simple and I can generally follow it well without subtitles, so it’s a good source for comprehensible input. Other than that I’ve continued with YouTube and podcasts.

I didn’t increase my Chinese study time, but kept the same pace that I previously had been doing.

I officially dropped studying Ukrainian. With the increased Russian, I was having a difficult time getting the pronunciation and vocabulary to stick, as when I tried to work on it Russian would come to my brain. If I focused only on Ukrainian without Russian, and put more time into it, I’m sure I could get past this hurdle. Polish is separate enough for me not to have this interference problem.

My plan for next month is to keep reading The Idiot in Russian, maybe watch 1-2 more Russian movies, and continue pace with Japanese and Chinese. EasyGerman is also doing a book club reading Kindergeschichten by Peter Bichsel, so I’ll join their membership to participate in that. It is only 70 pages, so manageable and will be fun to hear their thoughts on the reading as well.

June Hours:
Chinese: 10 hours, 40 minutes
Japanese: 15 hours, 45 minutes
Russian: 14 hours, 10 minutes
Spanish: 4 hours, 45 minutes
Italian : 3 hours, 25 minutes
Portuguese: 1 hour, 0 minutes
French: 1 hour, 25 minutes
Latin: 1 hour, 20 minutes
German: 1 hour, 35 minutes
Dutch: 1 hour, 5 minutes
Polish: 1 hour, 5 minutes

2023 hours
Japanese: 68 hours, 0 minutes
Mandarin: 62 hours, 0 minutes
Spanish: 36 hours, 55 minutes
Russian: 35 hours, 0 minutes
Italian: 28 hours, 35 minutes
German: 12 hours, 45 minutes
French: 7 hours, 30 minutes
Dutch: 5 hours, 30 minutes
Latin: 5 hours, 15 minutes
Polish: 4 hours, 30 minutes
Portuguese: 4 hours, 15 minutes
Ukrainian: 2 hours, 40 minutes
7 x

David27
Green Belt
Posts: 279
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 8:52 pm
Languages: English (N)
French, Spanish (advanced)
Russian, Portuguese, Italian, German (proficient)
Mandarin, Japanese, Dutch (low-intermediate)
Latin, Polish: (beginner)
Abandoned languages (for now) :( Greek, Czech, Bengali, Arabic, Norwegian
x 987

Re: Japanese and Mandarin in 50 years, with a lot of detours.

Postby David27 » Tue Aug 15, 2023 2:23 am

Delayed July update:

July was another month that I was able to spare more time for my language learning. I continue reading Idiot in Russian and started reading Peter Bichsel's Kindergeschichten, which Easy German is reading as a book club. However I moved at the very beginning of August, so I had to pack my books and now almost midway through August I still haven't unpacked them and started re-reading (well Kindergeschichten is on my e-reader, but I hadn't taken that out either). I'm not worried about forgetting what I had read in the Idiot though, because I've seen the television series from ~2003 several times while studying Russian, and it's quite faithful to the plot so I know where I am. I've read ~175 pages and I've gotten through one day in the story (Nastasya Filippovna just had her party and went off with Rogozhin). I'll miss my old town, especially the parks as it was very diverse, particularly with a large Japanese community that I was just getting comfortable approaching people and speaking Japanese, but my new place is nice and I like the new neighborhood. I already met one Italian.

Speaking of Italian (I forget if I already mentioned this before), but a family friend is Italian, and getting married in Tuscany next June, so we are planning to visit for ~10 days for the wedding (I'm planning where to visit, I'm now thinking several days in Rome, Orvieto, Tuscany where the wedding is, then maybe an agroturismo on the way back to Rome to fly back?). I'll be going with the whole family and my wife's family, so with young kids, I won't be able to move around too much or pack too many activities into a day, and need to have kid-friendly activities throughout. I'll probably start diving more in depth into Italian and Latin later this year (I'm thinking starting arbitrarily in November), in order to brush up and take my Italian further than it ever has been, and be as comfortable as possible in the language while there. I would love to be able to catch a Serie A game, but unfortunately the season will already be wrapped up by June.

Spending more time on Italian and Latin will mean cutting down a bit on Japanese, Mandarin, German, and Slavic languages, which is a shame. I won't completely cut out Japanese and Chinese, but I won't be doing even 10 hours a month, just maintenance to keep my current level from regressing too much. For Slavic languages, I really am loving the sound of Polish and wish I were doing more, and Ukrainian I'm regretting letting go... but alas, there are only so many hours in a day, and I am limited on energy/brain power, especially after work and getting the kids to sleep.

June Hours:
Japanese: 13 hours, 55 minutes
Chinese: 12 hours, 25 minutes
Russian: 5 hours, 10 minutes
Spanish: 4 hours, 10 minutes
German: 4 hours, 5 minutes
Italian: 3 hours, 35 minutes
Portuguese: 1 hour, 35 minutes
French: 1 hour, 30 minutes
Latin: 1 hour, 15 minutes
Polish: 1 hour, 5 minutes
Dutch: 1 hour

2023 hours
Japanese: 81 hours, 55 minutes
Mandarin: 74 hours, 25 minutes
Spanish: 41 hours, 15 minutes
Russian: 40 hours, 10 minutes
Italian: 32 hours, 10 minutes
German: 16 hours, 50 minutes
French: 9 hours, 0 minutes
Dutch: 6 hours, 30 minutes
Latin: 6 hours, 30 minutes
Portuguese: 5 hours, 50 minutes
Polish: 5 hours, 35 minutes
Ukrainian: 2 hours, 40 minutes
6 x

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MorkTheFiddle
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Posts: 2109
Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2015 8:59 pm
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Languages: English (N). Read (only) French and Spanish. Studying Ancient Greek. Studying a bit of Latin. Once studied Old Norse. Dabbled in Catalan, Provençal and Italian.
Language Log: https://forum.language-learners.org/vie ... 11#p133911
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Re: Japanese and Mandarin in 50 years, with a lot of detours.

Postby MorkTheFiddle » Wed Aug 16, 2023 9:18 pm

Just a little note. Italy can be very hot in June, even in Tuscany. ;)
0 x
Many things which are false are transmitted from book to book, and gain credit in the world. -- attributed to Samuel Johnson

David27
Green Belt
Posts: 279
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 8:52 pm
Languages: English (N)
French, Spanish (advanced)
Russian, Portuguese, Italian, German (proficient)
Mandarin, Japanese, Dutch (low-intermediate)
Latin, Polish: (beginner)
Abandoned languages (for now) :( Greek, Czech, Bengali, Arabic, Norwegian
x 987

Re: Japanese and Mandarin in 50 years, with a lot of detours.

Postby David27 » Thu Aug 17, 2023 2:45 am

MorkTheFiddle wrote:Just a little note. Italy can be very hot in June, even in Tuscany. ;)


It’s the very end of May into beginning of June, so may turn out nice, and that’s when the wedding is… so whatever the weather is, that’s when we’ll be there lol
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MorkTheFiddle
Black Belt - 2nd Dan
Posts: 2109
Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2015 8:59 pm
Location: North Texas USA
Languages: English (N). Read (only) French and Spanish. Studying Ancient Greek. Studying a bit of Latin. Once studied Old Norse. Dabbled in Catalan, Provençal and Italian.
Language Log: https://forum.language-learners.org/vie ... 11#p133911
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Re: Japanese and Mandarin in 50 years, with a lot of detours.

Postby MorkTheFiddle » Thu Aug 17, 2023 9:11 pm

Enjoy! :)
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Many things which are false are transmitted from book to book, and gain credit in the world. -- attributed to Samuel Johnson

David27
Green Belt
Posts: 279
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 8:52 pm
Languages: English (N)
French, Spanish (advanced)
Russian, Portuguese, Italian, German (proficient)
Mandarin, Japanese, Dutch (low-intermediate)
Latin, Polish: (beginner)
Abandoned languages (for now) :( Greek, Czech, Bengali, Arabic, Norwegian
x 987

Re: Japanese and Mandarin in 50 years, with a lot of detours.

Postby David27 » Tue Aug 22, 2023 3:42 pm

Three weeks in my new home. Settling in but a lot of work to do, which will affect my language learning time, as well as it being teaching season for me so I need to revise my lecture based on previous feedback and run some small sessions, which is time consuming, plus a new project at work … all that to say this and next month my language study will be mostly listening during my commute or when walking the dog. EXCEPT I did meet an Italian neighbor and German neighbor, and got to have a chat in both languages with minimal switch to English, so that was fun and maybe as I meet up with them from time to time I’ll get some speaking practice in these languages. And while at work the language (besides English) that I typically use is Spanish, I did have an opportunity to use my French last week which went well, so I was pleased about that. So I’m sad to let my Chinese and Japanese study time fall off a bit… those are long term goals and I am in no rush so I can intensify again later, and just continue my podcasts/YouTube videos for them for now to maintain
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