aaleks's log
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Re: aaleks's log
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Last edited by aaleks on Mon Feb 28, 2022 4:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: aaleks's log
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Last edited by aaleks on Mon Feb 28, 2022 4:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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- Le Baron
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Re: aaleks's log
I'm not a huge grammar fan myself, but I know its value. I wouldn't send anyone to a grammar book if it just caused them to seize-up, but I also have the view that not everything is plain sailing and if something is worth working for, I'll work for it. Grammar is often uncomfortable rather than strictly difficult; but it's so useful for not wasting time re-inventing the wheel. I don't have to puzzle-out e.g. the Spanish subjunctive, because someone else has already done it and if I take the trouble to read it I'll save myself a lot of bother in trial-and-error.
I think it's possible to make it to using a language without studying a complete grammar, because when you start actively using the language and get a feel for it some of those 'rules' reveal themselves and then you can either check them for confirmation, or not. The flip side of this is constantly reaching gaps in grammar knowledge, which is a tiresome impediment. When learning grammar I try to get the working gist of all the structures you come up against the most. It makes sense, because it fills-in the biggest holes and you can skip over the small ones or fill them more easily later on.
In sum, everyone learns grammar, but either explicitly or implicitly or a bit of both. I'm of the last type, but if I see there is an obvious gap I'm going the explicit route. Life's too short to wait for inspired intuition.
I think it's possible to make it to using a language without studying a complete grammar, because when you start actively using the language and get a feel for it some of those 'rules' reveal themselves and then you can either check them for confirmation, or not. The flip side of this is constantly reaching gaps in grammar knowledge, which is a tiresome impediment. When learning grammar I try to get the working gist of all the structures you come up against the most. It makes sense, because it fills-in the biggest holes and you can skip over the small ones or fill them more easily later on.
In sum, everyone learns grammar, but either explicitly or implicitly or a bit of both. I'm of the last type, but if I see there is an obvious gap I'm going the explicit route. Life's too short to wait for inspired intuition.
5 x
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Re: aaleks's log
del.
Last edited by aaleks on Mon Feb 28, 2022 4:04 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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- iguanamon
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Re: aaleks's log
Learning grammar, explicitly, and learning grammar from the real world are not mutually exclusive. I like to get as much exposure as I can from the real world, before I delve deeply into grammar to build-up my foundation. The explicit grammar doesn't make as much sense to me before I have had much exposure. After reading, listening, trying to speak and write, that's when explicit grammar study is most useful to me. Then, it becomes "Oh! That's why they do it that way!".
8 x
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Re: aaleks's log
del.
Last edited by aaleks on Mon Feb 28, 2022 4:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: aaleks's log
aaleks;
How do you make sense of something which is being spoken to you if you have not even touched upon a single grammar book in your target language? With reading you can see words written right in front of your eyes; you can translate the whole sentences with an online translator and deduce meaning that way. How to deal with speaking; How are you going to express yourself if you are not sure how things are expressed in the present tense, past tense, or how to formulate questions?
With your input-based/immersion approach one may take 2-3 years to make sense of the language and start outputting?
I am not saying that your approach is bad; Hypothetically speaking, your approach is the right one. I wonder if one has to work and live in their target language country, would they have to wait for 2-3 years for accumulating lots of input before they get to speak?
How do you make sense of something which is being spoken to you if you have not even touched upon a single grammar book in your target language? With reading you can see words written right in front of your eyes; you can translate the whole sentences with an online translator and deduce meaning that way. How to deal with speaking; How are you going to express yourself if you are not sure how things are expressed in the present tense, past tense, or how to formulate questions?
With your input-based/immersion approach one may take 2-3 years to make sense of the language and start outputting?
I am not saying that your approach is bad; Hypothetically speaking, your approach is the right one. I wonder if one has to work and live in their target language country, would they have to wait for 2-3 years for accumulating lots of input before they get to speak?
0 x
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- Green Belt
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Re: aaleks's log
After reading, listening, trying to speak and write, that's when explicit grammar study is most useful to me.
How do you approach it? Do you read about a given grammar topic and then do some grammar drills just to see if you have nailed it down?
Also, do you move on with the next grammar topic? or do you come back to the previous grammar topic again to see if it is still fresh in your head?
Thanks
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Re: aaleks's log
del.
Last edited by aaleks on Mon Feb 28, 2022 4:06 pm, edited 2 times in total.
4 x
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Re: aaleks's log
del.
Last edited by aaleks on Mon Feb 28, 2022 4:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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