AlOlaf's Log (Danish/German/Norwegian)

[AlOlaf]

Hvad var det så jeg tænkte på
Da jeg var i min mor
Og svævede lunt i stille ro
Og kendte ikke et ord?

Fuldstændig tom kunne jeg have været
Med ingen tanker eller
Måske jeg vidste jeg var der
Trods blanke hjerneceller

Mit billede af et himmelsk sted
Tror jeg er bare et minde
Om den varme mørke sikkerhed
Jeg havde dengang derinde

[AlOlaf]

Sidste uge fik jeg et meget usædvanligt brev. Brevet kom fra Prag, Tjekkiet, og blev skrevet af en tjekkisk mand, som jeg ikke kendte. I brevet stod navnet af en amerikansk jagerpilot, der ifølge manden lykkedes det at skade en tysk jager af typen Me 109 over et eller andet sted i Tjekkoslovakiet om 7. juli 1944. Manden spurgte, om jeg havde oplysninger om denne kamp. Han sagde, han havde fundet mit navn og min adresse på internettet, og at han havde grund til at tro, at jeg var en slægtning til denne pilot.

Det havde han ret i. Jeg genkendte navnet. Piloten var min far. Min første tanke: Hvorfor ville en tjekker interessere sig for noget, som min far gjorde for næsten 74 år siden? Jeg var mistænksom. For det første var det uhyggeligt, at et vildfremmed menneske på den anden side af jorden kunne efterspore mig ved hjælp af internettet. For det andet kunne han måske være medlem af en tjekkisk bande, der på en eller anden måde ville prøve at afpresse mig. For det tredje var det muligt, at piloten af Me-109 var blevet hårdt kvæstet eller slået ihjel af min far, og at den her tjekker var en slægtning til ham, der ville have hævn.

Men sådan var det ikke. Jeg søgte på internettet efter tjekkerens navn, og straks fandt det. Jeg så, at han havde oprettet en website til ære for de amerikanske piloter, som kæmpede mod tyskerne for at befri Tjekkoslovakiet under Anden Verdenskrig. På websiten var der billeder af amerikanske piloter fra krigstiden og artikler, der anerkendte deres bedrifter. Der var endda billeder af piloternes sammenkomster efter krigen.

Mandens e-mail adresse stod i brevet, så jeg sendte ham en besked. Vi har siden udvekslet mange e-mails. Det viste sig, at han vidste meget om slaget, der fandt sted i luften over Tjekkoslovakiet om 7. juli 1944. Min fars eskadron var ved at eskortere B-17 bombefly, da de traf en del tyske jagere. Tjekkeren gav mig præcise oplysninger om min fars indsats, hvilket betyder meget for mig, fordi jeg vidste ingenting om det. Min far talte nemlig aldrig om, hvad han gjorde under krigen. Til gengæld sendte jeg dokumenter og billeder af min far til tjekkeren. Han sagde, at han havde i sinde at skabe et museum eller måske skrive en bog for at udtrykke påskønnelse for, hvad de amerikanske piloter havde gjort for ham og sine landsmænd.

Han var også i kontakt med familierne af flere af de andre piloter i min fars gamle eskadron. En af de amerikanske jagerpiloter havde blevet meldt savnet under slaget om 7. juli. Han formodedes at være død, men resterne af flyet blev aldrig fundet. For ikke længe siden besluttede sig denne tjekker og sine tjekkiske venner for at gøre noget ved det. De ledte efter og fandt stedet, hvor denne pilots P-51 Mustang havde styrtet ned. De gravede op stumper af maskinen og tog billeder af dem, så pilotens familie kunne endelig vide, hvad der var sket med ham. Derefter lavede tjekkerne et mindesmærke bestående af et amerikansk flag, et billede af piloten og en motordel fra flyet, som de havde slebet skinnende blank.

Det er svært at tro, at der findes mennesker, som viser en sådan stor taknemmelighed over for fremmede, de aldrig har mødet. Jeg kan simpelthen ikke vide, hvordan det er for disse tjekkere, fordi mit hjemland aldrig er blevet besat.

[AlOlaf]

I just saw a video of the most Danish-sounding native English speaker I've ever heard. You can see it here.

It got two thumbs down for some reason. I'd be very interested to hear a native Dane's opinion.

The guy is described as as having a particularly good ear for languages. He's had a Danish girlfriend for nine years, lived in Denmark for four years and attended a Danish language school for over a year. If these are the prerequisites for attaining this kind of proficiency, then my goal of someday achieving something similar is totally unrealistic. Maybe I need to re-think what I'm doing.

[jeff_lindqvist]

Wow, that guy could have fooled me any day.

[AlOlaf]

After an honest and objective re-think of my mission to achieve a near-native Danish pronunciation, I've come to the conclusion that the fact I have no extraordinary ear for languages, no Danish girlfriend, no long-term Danish residency and no Danish language school experience means my endeavor is likely an act of folly, if not a completely delusional, Don Quixotesqe break with reality. Clearly, I'm not going to let something like that stop me.

[Iversen]

I just saw a video of the most Danish-sounding native English speaker I've ever heard. You can see it here.

There are a few small things that a native Dane might notice, like a slightly flatter-than-average /a/ in "fra" and the final /d/ in New Zealand, which never ever is pronounced. I also noticed the lacking "til" after "hovedårsagen" ... but frankly, who cares? There is already a span of variation between native speakers, and the things I noticed in his pronunciation and syntax are not more aberrant than the things native Danes permit themselves to do all the time. It is just that we can recognize many of the variations used by native Danes (and some of those found among first- or second generation immigrants too), so we aren't really surprised to hear them, whereas variations heard from a learner from abroad are seen as errors. Which is silly, given how good this man's Danish actually is.

I have long ago heard some of your recordings (at HTLAL, I think) and my reaction already back then was that you wouldn't have problems speaking like that in Denmark. The real problem is to understand Danes who speak among themselves, and here the obvious solution is to ask us to speak more clearly until you have adapted to our normal way of speaking. So don't let things like the undeserved thumbs down to that video stop you from continuing your Danish studies. Danish is not impossible.

[AlOlaf]

Thank you, Iversen, for the most welcome shot in the arm (and for the many others you've given me over the years). Yes, you're right, my biggest problem lies in understanding the language the way it's spoken among Danes. Through watching films and videos, I've noticed a slow and gradual improvement in my listening comprehension, but that won't keep me from getting stumped by locals telling jokes at the sausage stand. Or by the counter guy at the 7-11. The only way to develop a truly adequate comprehension would be to hear spoken Danish all the time, and I'm just not in the position to make that happen.

For pronunciation, on the other hand, I have all the tools I need. Lisbet Thorborg's books clearly detail how to make the sounds, and the accompanying cds offer the opportunity to hear and practice them. When I want to see how I'm doing, I book a lesson on Italki. I know full well I'm never going to sound like a Dane, but I feel compelled to try to get as close as I can. It'd be noble to say I was doing it out of respect for the country, its people and its culture, but that's not really the case. I'm doing it on account of a powerful, mindless compulsion, whose source is a mystery to me. Whenever I hear a Dane speak, I just think it would be the coolest thing in the world if I could talk like that.

[PeterMollenburg]

After an honest and objective re-think of my mission to achieve a near-native Danish pronunciation, I've come to the conclusion that the fact I have no extraordinary ear for languages, no Danish girlfriend, no long-term Danish residency and no Danish language school experience means my endeavor is likely an act of folly, if not a completely delusional, Don Quixotesqe break with reality. Clearly, I'm not going to let something like that stop me.

I don't think it is impossible, not at all. In fact if you become exasperated with the undertaking, aim for longer is a suggestion... Expect that this is going to take you 10,000 hours, and commit to it potentially taking your lifetime, or a good deal of it. This way disappointment is unlikely, smell the roses along the way and feel free to keep Danish as a daily commitment while other languages may come and go in your life as you so please. Just some out loud thoughts there, not necessarily a road map - perception may help is all.

Thank you, Iversen, for the most welcome shot in the arm (and for the many others you've given me over the years). Yes, you're right, my biggest problem lies in understanding the language the way it's spoken among Danes. Through watching films and videos, I've noticed a slow and gradual improvement in my listening comprehension, but that won't keep me from getting stumped by locals telling jokes at the sausage stand. Or by the counter guy at the 7-11. The only way to develop a truly adequate comprehension would be to hear spoken Danish all the time, and I'm just not in the position to make that happen.

For pronunciation, on the other hand, I have all the tools I need. Lisbet Thorborg's books clearly detail how to make the sounds, and the accompanying cds offer the opportunity to hear and practice them. When I want to see how I'm doing, I book a lesson on Italki. I know full well I'm never going to sound like a Dane, but I feel compelled to try to get as close as I can. It'd be noble to say I was doing it out of respect for the country, its people and its culture, but that's not really the case. I'm doing it on account of a powerful, mindless compulsion, whose source is a mystery to me. Whenever I hear a Dane speak, I just think it would be the coolest thing in the world if I could talk like that.

I can particularly see elements of my own personality and wants when it comes to learning languages in these last two sentences you have written. I too, when learning any language, want to blend in, become part of that culture, become one of them, not be an outsider, dream of being undetectable. Of course, I'm certain most French natives do indeed hear an accent when I speak, despite all my work, but it does not stop me from trying to improve, constantly. I don't think there's any harm in dreaming, and the more time you are willing to commit to your endeavor -provided your methods do provide results, however slow they appear to manifest- you will in the end, succeed in blending is as a native speaker would, or in the very least sound much more native than you would had you not endeavored to sound as such and put in the effort required.

You maye take the prize for the one who comes closest to sounding native minus a Danish girlfriend, minus living in Denmark and other such benefits, provided you keep on that path. Enjoy the journey, I admire your steadfast determination with Danish, a language I have no clue about. Keep up the good work AlOlaf!

[AlOlaf]

Many thanks for your highly uplifting post, PeterMollenburg! It's a validation to know you share my desire to blend in and be part of another culture. I experienced that feeling once with German, and it was absolutely exhilarating. Now all I want to do is experience the same thing with Danish. It's a bit of a paradox, really. I normally go to great lengths to avoid interacting with strangers, but get a foreign language involved and I'm falling all over myself trying to talk to them.

Expect that this is going to take you 10,000 hours, and commit to it potentially taking your lifetime, or a good deal of it.

This is a piece of advice I'm going to take.

...your steadfast determination...

Look who's talking.

[AlOlaf]

I've struggled for years to recognize and accurately reproduce the many vowel sounds of Danish. The long e in particular has always given me fits because it seems to exist in a tiny netherworld somewhere between English ɪə and eə. This means my ear wants to perceive it as one or the other of these two familiar, ingrained and extremely similar English sounds.

In an effort to nail down the long e, I've been slowing down recordings of individual words (and sometimes syllables) containing the sound, and shadowing and repeating them ad infinitum, but It's as if I can hear the vowel morphing back and forth from ɪə to eə. Occasionally I pronounce it correctly, but then it slips away again. You'd think that after five years I'd have this fundamental element of Danish phonology down, but I don't. It's really discouraging.

The other day, quite by accident, I discovered something that gave me hope. I'd made a cd of the 71 most difficult (for me) to pronounce words from the audio of a Danish video, each with one minute's worth of repeats and pauses. The recording was at normal speed and I'd made it with very tight pauses, because I intended to play it slowed down on my guitar trainer. On the initial playback, I realized I had recorded one of the words twice, so I edited out the duplicate and burned a replacement cd. Rather than throw away the flawed original, I decided for the hell of it to take it with me to play in the car, expecting the full-speed recording to overwhelm me. Surprisingly, this wasn't the case. I was hard pressed to repeat the words fast enough, which meant I was probably missing some nuances, but it was challenging and fun. I jabbered through the whole cd in the car, and it seemed like a refreshing departure from what I'd been doing, namely putting slowed-down recordings under an aural microscope.

When I got back home, where I could concentrate fully without the distractions of driving, I ran through the cd again at normal speed, but this time I decided to up the challenge factor and shadow each word as well as repeat it: shadow-repeat, shadow-repeat. Since there was virtually no space in between the words as I pronounced them, I began to perceive the individual repeats as one long, drawn-out word, a sort of sonic continuum. As I strained to duplicate the native speaker's pronunciation, I could hear my own simultaneously pronounced version gradually getting closer to the native speaker's, sort of like a guitar string being tuned to a pitch. Then, suddenly, I could tell they were in unison. Instead of hearing the jagged edges of my own inaccurate pronunciation superimposed over the native speaker's, it was just the native speaker's version I was hearing, only with what sounded like reverb or chorus on top of it. I continued to shadow and repeat, trying hard not to alter my mouth and tongue position, in hopes that some kind of neural connection between my ear and my mouth muscles was being formed. If I could establish such pathways, I reasoned, I'd be able to confidently, consistently and accurately reproduce elusive sounds like the Danish long e without the need for a reference.

Either I'm on to something here, or I've totally gone off the deep end, I'm not sure which.