Karen's Spanish learning journey

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klvik
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Re: Karen's Spanish learning journey

Postby klvik » Sun May 14, 2017 5:15 pm

blaurebell wrote:
klvik wrote:Due to a "shiny new toy" response, initially I was adding too many "unknown" terms per day which resulted in a week of overly long test sessions.


I actually don't use the test function at all, I just read! Words repeat, so the ones that are frequent and important will appear more often, usually in new forms, tenses and so on. You will end up remembering without effort just from typing in the dictionary definition for all these forms. There is really no need to remember every word you come across and the important ones will stick automatically. And the ones that don't appear very often are probably also not important enough to spend much effort on them!

5000 pages of intensive reading is indeed quite excessive, but I really found it a fantastic basis for French. I really have a pretty solid literary vocabulary now and enjoy reading in French a lot. It kinda happened by accident too, I just chose a long series and the story carried me along. With French it was Harry Potter and with Russian it's now David Eddings' Belgariad Saga. If I want to know what happens next, I have to keep reading, so it really helps to use page turners. Besides, I find the statistics motivating too!


I completely agree about the statistics. I really like seeing the number of known terms increase. :D

I don't know how long I will keep up with the test function, but for right now, at least, it is helpful. The vocabulary testing forces me to read some sentences several times which provides an opportunity for me to reflect on the grammar and the phrasing. I expect that I will continue using the test function for this first book and maybe a second, as long as I feel that I am still benefiting from all that sentence review. If I continue with LWT after two books, I would probably drop the test function. In the meantime, I am continuing with extensive reading on my Kindle (with almost no word lookup). If I weren't reading extensively at the same time, I think the exceedingly slow pace of LWT w/ vocab testing would drive me crazy.
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klvik
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Re: Karen's Spanish learning journey

Postby klvik » Sun Jun 04, 2017 9:44 pm

I am slowly chipping away at El Codigo Da Vinci using LWT (30% of the book read, ~7000 known terms, ~9000 total terms). I consider my LWT reading to be supplemental to my regular reading so I'm in no hurry to finish the book. As long as I find my slow and methodical LWT reading to be helpful and enjoyable I will continue it. If I start to find it tedious, I will change what I am doing. Right now I am finding my intensive approach very useful for improving my reading precision (I like Blaurebelle's terminology, so I'm adopting it), vocabulary acquisition and awareness of word order. It is also triggering an urge to resume grammar study (FSI here I come! Only 5 units to finish!).

I've been neglecting my listening a bit over the past few weeks :( . Primarily because I have been spending more time reading (LWT and Kindle) but also because I haven't found a show that has captured my interest. I'm slowly working my way through Las Chicas de Cable. It isn't bad, but I don't find it binge-worthy. I may have to concentrate on audiobooks for a while until I find something that catches my interest. I have listened to the first 5 hours of the Codigo Da Vinci audiobook and found it enjoyable (despite intensively reading those chapters just prior to listening). I also was pleased to discover that I was clearly remembering the new vocabulary. My retention of the new words is not robust enough to cope with lapses of attention or other distractions, but as long as I'm paying attention I feel though I am "hearing" every word and processing the content without resorting to "filling in the blanks". The narrator of the audiobook has a beautiful, deep voice and I enjoy listening to him - except when he reads the dialog of female characters. Unfortunately, he manages to make the female characters sound whiny and stupid. It does not help that the main female character is French - so whiny and stupid with bad (to my ear) French accent. I definitely enjoy his voice much more when he is not reading dialog. Luckily, it is not a dialog heavy novel.
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Re: Karen's Spanish learning journey

Postby jeff_lindqvist » Mon Jun 05, 2017 9:56 pm

I've also listened to that audiobook, and Ángeles y Demonios (which I think has the same narrator). I read each book in Swedish translation while listening to the Spanish audio, then I did another round of Spanish audio+Spanish text. I find both books great for improving listening comprehension and reading skills.
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klvik
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Re: Karen's Spanish learning journey

Postby klvik » Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:23 am

I have never been avid watcher of television and in the past I have happily gone years at a time without watching a television show. So, I have been surprised by how much I have enjoyed all the hours of television in Spanish I've watched over the past couple of years. The first show that I watched in Spanish was a telenovela on RTVE - picked solely for the fact that it had subtitles in Spanish. It was not a good story and if it had been in English I wouldn't have been able to finish the first episode. As I watched this show, I can remember asking myself how I could possibly enjoy this drivel. One of the first signs that my listening comprehension was improving was my growing dissatisfaction with that show and my fussiness about which programs I watch has been increasing in parallel with my improving listening comprehension. A few weeks ago I was feeling at a loss about which show I should start next when Kunsttyv started a log about Spanish-language cinema (I highly recommend following it; https://forum.language-learners.org/vie ... =15&t=5961). Thanks to him, I have started to explore classic Spanish films from the 50s, 60s and 70s. So far I have watched two of his recommendation Bienvenido, Mister Marshall (1953) and Criá Cuervos (1976) and both films were excellent.

One of the side effects of my using Learning with Texts is that my eagerness to study grammar has returned. So, after a 3 month break I have returned to the FSI Basic Course. Before this recent break from grammar study I was working concurrently with FSI and Gramática de Uso del Español B1-B2, but I am limiting myself to one grammar course right now. Hopefully I can pace myself better than I normally do so that I can finish FSI before another grammar burnout strikes. I run hot-and-cold with grammar study. I will enjoy it immensely for a while and then boredom strikes and I can't bear the thought of opening a grammar book or a course. Luckily, my enthusiasm returns after a break.
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klvik
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Re: Karen's Spanish learning journey

Postby klvik » Wed Aug 30, 2017 6:36 pm

It has been more than 2 months since my last update. :shock: I have been consistently working on my Spanish during the summer but have not been in the mood to write about it. Now that summer is drawing to an end it is time for me to get back into the habit of updating my language log.

Since my last update I have continued reading intensively (LWT) and extensively. I do most of my reading on my Kindle and only read a few pages in LWT each day. By limiting the amount that I read in LWT I have been able to continue using the vocabulary review feature (which I find useful for vocabulary retention and grammatical awareness) without becoming overwhelmed with reviews. I started with LWT 4 months ago and since then 20% of the total pages I have read have been with this program. When I am reading on my Kindle I don't bother to look up many words and if a word is not in the pop-up dictionary, oh well. This two-pronged approach to reading is working well for me right now, so I will continue with it for the foreseeable future.

The accomplishment that I am most pleased to report is that after a very long time and many stops and starts, I have made it all the way through the FSI Spanish Basic course. :D I don't remember when I started the course, but it was at least a year and a half ago. As I was painfully working my way through FSI Spanish I often questioned whether I was using the course in an effective manner and, in hindsight, I am convinced that I wasn't. I think that, for me, FSI would be more effective in 'automating' Spanish grammar if I were to take my time with it, incorporate reviews of previously completed units and focus more on achieving fluidity, speed and good intonation in my answers.
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klvik
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Re: Karen's Spanish learning journey

Postby klvik » Sat Nov 04, 2017 8:10 pm

The end of the superchallenge is approaching quickly and I'm on track to finish my double superchallenge on time. During the past few weeks I've been tempted to retake the Dialang (https://dialangweb.lancaster.ac.uk/) and DLI (http://oda.dliflc.edu/) online assessment to see how much my listening has improved. I took the tests a little over a year ago and placed B1 (Dialang) and 2 (DLI) for listening. Since taking that test I have logged 233 hours of listening for the superchallenge (my total time spent listening to Spanish is higher than that but I only log TV shows, movies and audiobooks), 7600 pages read (including 600 pages read intensively with LWT) and several Subs2SRS Anki decks. My subjective assessment is that my listening comprehension has improved tremendously. My brain continues to increase the speed with which it processes Spanish and my vocabulary is growing by leaps and bounds. However, I think it is extremely easy to overestimate listening comprehension when do a self-assessment. I hope that I will score a B2/2+ when I retake the Dialang and DLI tests - I would be pleased if a double superchallenge was sufficient for me to 'level up' my listening.

I am almost finished reading El Silencio de la Ciuda Blanca, by Eva Sáenz de Urturi. I don't remember who recommended this book, but whoever you are, Thanks! This detective story takes place in the Basque country and deals with ritualistic serial killings that resume after a gap of 20 years. The protagonists are engaging and the book contains sufficient snippets of Spanish history and culture to keep me happy. I plan to read more novels by this author.
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klvik
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Re: Karen's Spanish learning journey

Postby klvik » Mon Dec 11, 2017 12:17 am

My double superchallenge is finished! My subjective assessment is that both my listening comprehension and reading ability has improved substantially during the challenge, but consuming that much content in a year and a half (I started the challenge a little late) is bound to make an impact. I plan to take the Dialang and DLI online assessments when I have the time. In the meantime, here are some numbers and random thoughts.

The numbers-

Listening component: 20% audiobooks, 4% documentaries, 9% movies and 67% television series. I used subtitles for 32% of my total logged listening minutes (almost all from the beginning of the challenge).

Reading. Almost all of my reading was done on a Kindle using a popup dictionary; only ~600 pages were read using LWT. First 5000 pages were all young adult books. Second 5000 pages consisted primarily of 'light' reading material interspersed with slightly more weighty books.

Random thoughts-

I suspect that, for me, extensive listening/watching activities work best when coupled with a small amount of intensive listening (Subs2SRS Anki decks, repeated listening of podcasts with transcripts, ect..). I don't think I pick up much new material while watching television shows or movies but watching them helps me to consolidate what I have learned with other activities. I don't believe that either extensive or intensive listening would be sufficient on their own for me to progress at a reasonable rate but work well when done together.

I will stop reading a book in English if I don't like the author's prose or if the story doesn't interest me, but I have never stopped reading a book in English because I'm embarrassed for one of the characters or because the subject matter is too upsetting. I read quickly in English and I just blow through those uncomfortable moments in the book. However, I can't do that in Spanish because I read too slowly. I got 1/3 of the way through El cuaderno de Maya (Allende) last spring before I had to stop because I was mortified by what the main character was about to do. I would like to finish the book but I've been waiting for my reading speed to improve a bit more before I go back to it.
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klvik
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Re: Karen's Spanish learning journey

Postby klvik » Sat Dec 30, 2017 10:41 pm

I really should write a summary of my Spanish learning during 2017 and my plans/goals for the upcoming year, but I'm feeling lazy. So, in the spirit of holiday gift giving I will limit myself to mentioning some online treasures that I've recently found. Enjoy and Happy New Year!

Treasure #1 is Diana Uribe from Colombia: part journalist, part anthropologist, part story teller, part historian. Her broadcasts are like listening to a wise friend who always has something interesting to stay. You can find her broadcasts on Ivoox and her website http://www.lacasadelahistoria.com/.

Treasure #2 is Cartas sobre la mesa by RT en español. I enjoy racional discussions between people of opposing views but unfortunately, the current fashion among the talking heads in the US is simultaneous monologues with each side trying to win points by talking over the other. Blah. The moderator of this show does a wonderful job of picking interesting topics and mantaining a respectful environment among the speakers. Available on youtube and at https://actualidad.rt.com/programas/cartas-mesa.

Treasure #3. The Khan Academy en Español. The Khan Academy is a non-profit organization that develops free online educational content. They have content (in English) for children, high school students, university students and adult learners. I've looked at some of their biology content previously and was impressed. Well, they now have some (limited) content in other languages. https://es.khanacademy.org/
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klvik
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Re: Karen's Spanish learning journey

Postby klvik » Sat Jan 13, 2018 5:32 pm

It's my first post of the New Year which means it's time for the requisite statement of goals.

Reading
I read 7377 pages in Spanish during 2017; 55% of those pages were young adult literature. Overall, I'm satisfied with my progress in reading. When I read books for young adults or 'light' books for adults, I don't need to look up many words anymore and my reading speed is no longer painfully slow. However, my reading speed is much slower with more serious literature and sometimes this interferes with my enjoyment of the book. I don't think I need to change what I'm doing I'll read whatever strikes my fancy and just strive to read as much as possible in 2018.

Listening
I think that I am a solid B2 (or at least a low B2) in listening now, but I have not taken a test to confirm this. Clear, formal speech doesn't present any problems - except for unknown vocabulary, of course. I still find very informal or slang-filled speech much more difficult. In 2008 I will try to maintain the volume of listening while diversifying the content and season the mix with a good dose of intensive listening.

Writing
I don't have a sufficient sample size to assess my writing in Spanish. I signed up for the writing portion of the Output Challenge last year and only managed to write 5,000 words during the entire year. I will try to write more this year than I did last year, but I'm not going to set a specific goal.

Talking
It's difficult to gauge my progress with spoken Spanish. Throughout 2017 I only had one Skype practice partner, so, although I spoke Spanish almost every week it only added up to 23 hours of conversational practice. I feel as if I have improved a lot but I can't say how much of my "improvement " results from familiarity with this practice partner. One of my goals for this year is to find a second practice partner. Ideally, I would like to double the number of hours I spent talking in Spanish with a person.
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Re: Karen's Spanish learning journey

Postby James29 » Sat Jan 13, 2018 10:35 pm

klvik wrote:It's my first post of the New Year which means it's time for the requisite statement of goals.

Reading
I read 7377 pages in Spanish during 2017; 55% of those pages were young adult literature. Overall, I'm satisfied with my progress in reading. When I read books for young adults or 'light' books for adults, I don't need to look up many words anymore and my reading speed is no longer painfully slow. However, my reading speed is much slower with more serious literature and sometimes this interferes with my enjoyment of the book. I don't think I need to change what I'm doing I'll read whatever strikes my fancy and just strive to read as much as possible in 2018.

Listening
I think that I am a solid B2 (or at least a low B2) in listening now, but I have not taken a test to confirm this. Clear, formal speech doesn't present any problems - except for unknown vocabulary, of course. I still find very informal or slang-filled speech much more difficult. In 2008 I will try to maintain the volume of listening while diversifying the content and season the mix with a good dose of intensive listening.

Writing
I don't have a sufficient sample size to assess my writing in Spanish. I signed up for the writing portion of the Output Challenge last year and only managed to write 5,000 words during the entire year. I will try to write more this year than I did last year, but I'm not going to set a specific goal.

Talking
It's difficult to gauge my progress with spoken Spanish. Throughout 2017 I only had one Skype practice partner, so, although I spoke Spanish almost every week it only added up to 23 hours of conversational practice. I feel as if I have improved a lot but I can't say how much of my "improvement " results from familiarity with this practice partner. One of my goals for this year is to find a second practice partner. Ideally, I would like to double the number of hours I spent talking in Spanish with a person.


This is great! That many books in one year is going to do so much for you. For what it is worth, I ended up finding that reading really dragged along my understanding quite well (the more I read the more audio/TV I would understand) and watching TV really dragged along my speaking (when I started watching tons of TV my speaking got really good - without practicing speaking).
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