Aokoye's Journey Through German (and other languages?)

[aokoye]

I'm at this weird stage, though perhaps phase is a better word for this, in my German knowledge where a lot of people who I interact with both out and about and in my living situation compliment me on my German and where my mistakes are constantly pointed out in my classes. When I tell people that I'm from the US they're somewhat shocked at how good my German is, my host family tells me things like, "you German really is good", and I get thanked by people at the mensa for asking them about things in German. Most recently I asked if they had the MensaCups where we were or if I could only buy them in the mensa cafes. I think part of the reason I got a "ich danke Ihnen" was because she didn't realize that what I was asking for was actually called a MensaCup and/or she didn't realize that they did have them where we were. There was another woman working there who knew what I was talking about and showed the person I was asking where to look. That said, they are seriously inundated with people who have serious issues communicating with them.

I went yarn shopping this morning and had a nice chat with the woman working at the yarn store at the time. She showed me around the store, we talked about what I knit, and we talked about what yarns are hard to find in the US and which are hard to find in Germany. For the record - Madelinetosh is apparently hard to get in Germany and Wollmeise is ridiculously hard to get in the US. I went specifically for the Wollmeise. I was also easily able to negotiate my "credit card" (it's not a credit card in the US but in Europe it's treated as such which is logical) not working.

So yeah - I can do a lot of things, and I'm also so exceedingly aware that I'm not at all where I want to be. It's a weird situation to be in. It's both good and bad I think. It is useful to know that I have a ways to go in order to get to where I want to be and have specific mistakes pointed out on a regular basis (in the context of a language course). It's also nice to know that I've been able to successfully negotiate every situation I've been in over the past nearly 4 weeks in German. The only thing that wasn't totally or 99% in German was the first, "so I missed my flight and it's your fault not mine" - though in totally different significantly more polite words. Even then I negotiated most if not all of figuring my way around train stuff by myself. I also wasn't originally planning on doing hotel stuff in English because of the amount of money involved but I successfully did so while stressed, in the beginning stages of jet lag, and with sheer lack of sleep.

What's hard is that while I know I tend to underestimate my abilities in just about every aspect of my life, I'm not sure if I'm actually underestimating my German abilities or if I'm actually just being realistic. Needless to say - it's an interesting phase to be in. I know this will more or less entirely go away when I get back to the US but if I'm able to do my masters in Germany it'll come right back. I suspect eventually, if I do manage to live here permanently or at least long term, I will get to the point where I'm not constantly underestimating or seriously questioning my German abilities - perhaps after I finish a MA where the teaching language is German

[Elenia]

I think your German is probably much better than my Swedish, but I certainly know what you're talking about. I know part of my problem is nerves, but a lot of it is also just lack of vocabulary and imprecision that I really want to get rid of. But I think you're definitely moving in the right direction so you just need to keep on going.

Speaking of knitting, what do you knit? I mostly knit socks. I tend to buy all my yarn online, as shopping for it in bricks and mortar stores usually either meant prohibitively expensive, poor quality, or poor range.

[aokoye]

I think your German is probably much better than my Swedish, but I certainly know what you're talking about. I know part of my problem is nerves, but a lot of it is also just lack of vocabulary and imprecision that I really want to get rid of. But I think you're definitely moving in the right direction so you just need to keep on going.

Speaking of knitting, what do you knit? I mostly knit socks. I tend to buy all my yarn online, as shopping for it in bricks and mortar stores usually either meant prohibitively expensive, poor quality, or poor range.

The only reason my German is potentially better than your Swedish is because I'm constantly forced to use it at a really high level. I apparently am immune to the, "oh you're clearly not a native speaker of my L1 and you might even be a native English speaker - I will speak English with you." I am almost never in situations where people switch to English. That was also true in Vienna (though my German was much worse than it is now) and even true in Paris people put up with my piss poor French. It's happened twice and they quickly switched back to German when I didn't switch to English. The owner of the dönner kebab place near my house here greets me in English but the rest of the time it's all German all the time.

For me it's not an issue of nerves but rather grammar that isn't as solid as I think it should be and to a smaller extent vocabulary. Once my course is finished I'm probably going to spent a bunch of time going through Sag Besser. That is perhaps the one issue of taking this class - I don't have time to focus on exactly what I want to focus on. It's a fairly small con given what I've gotten out of the course though.

I mainly knit socks as well. Sometimes I knit cardigans, but mainly socks. About once a year I knit a hat as well. I'm very lucky in that there are a ton of yarn stores in Portland that have a really good range of yarns. I can generally get whatever I need in Portland, yarn wise, as long as it's available in the US. Yarns for weaving are much harder to come by, but I rarely weave so that's not an issue.

[Elenia]

The only reason my German is potentially better than your Swedish is because I'm constantly forced to use it at a really high level. I apparently am immune to the, "oh you're clearly not a native speaker of my L1 and you might even be a native English speaker - I will speak English with you." I am almost never in situations where people switch to English. That was also true in Vienna (though my German was much worse than it is now) and even true in Paris people put up with my piss poor French. It's happened twice and they quickly switched back to German when I didn't switch to English. The owner of the dönner kebab place near my house here greets me in English but the rest of the time it's all German all the time.

For me it's not an issue of nerves but rather grammar that isn't as solid as I think it should be and to a smaller extent vocabulary. Once my course is finished I'm probably going to spent a bunch of time going through Sag Besser. That is perhaps the one issue of taking this class - I don't have time to focus on exactly what I want to focus on. It's a fairly small con given what I've gotten out of the course though.

I mainly knit socks as well. Sometimes I knit cardigans, but mainly socks. About once a year I knit a hat as well. I'm very lucky in that there are a ton of yarn stores in Portland that have a really good range of yarns. I can generally get whatever I need in Portland, yarn wise, as long as it's available in the US. Yarns for weaving are much harder to come by, but I rarely weave so that's not an issue.

Yep, being able to use it at a high level certainly helps, I'm sure. I think you also have a more solid base then me, although you feel you have grammar gaps. There is a lot more grammar to learn with German, that's for sure! I only have one or two persistent problems with Swedish grammar because much of it is so similar to English. It's good to hear that people don't switch with you! I've only had someone switch with me once here, and that was such a short transaction that I didn't really notice until afterwards. I like to think it speaks well of us, that conversation is not a strain on the listener. (And I think when people find out you're an anglophone they're even happier because you're breaking that monolingual anglophone stereotype!)

It's also really great to hear about your course. Is it with FUBiS? I was looking into their courses a few years ago, but wasn't able to fund it at the time, and then moved my attention elsewhere. I had originally wanted to do a Masters in Germany, but found easier options elsewhere. But German is still one of my loves, so it would be nice to maybe one day put the money down on it. It seems like a really worthy expense - and you struck gold with your classmates!

I've never knitted anything bigger than a cardigan. I have a dress pattern I want to try out, but I can't even get the tension right! Do you use patterns or do you make up your own? (Feel free to leave replying for when you have time, by the way!)

[aokoye]

Yep, being able to use it at a high level certainly helps, I'm sure. I think you also have a more solid base then me, although you feel you have grammar gaps. There is a lot more grammar to learn with German, that's for sure! I only have one or two persistent problems with Swedish grammar because much of it is so similar to English. It's good to hear that people don't switch with you! I've only had someone switch with me once here, and that was such a short transaction that I didn't really notice until afterwards. I like to think it speaks well of us, that conversation is not a strain on the listener. (And I think when people find out you're an anglophone they're even happier because you're breaking that monolingual anglophone stereotype!)

It's also really great to hear about your course. Is it with FUBiS? I was looking into their courses a few years ago, but wasn't able to fund it at the time, and then moved my attention elsewhere. I had originally wanted to do a Masters in Germany, but found easier options elsewhere. But German is still one of my loves, so it would be nice to maybe one day put the money down on it. It seems like a really worthy expense - and you struck gold with your classmates!

I've never knitted anything bigger than a cardigan. I have a dress pattern I want to try out, but I can't even get the tension right! Do you use patterns or do you make up your own? (Feel free to leave replying for when you have time, by the way!)

Yeah German grammar...there's just so much of it. I think you're probably on to something with breaking the monolingual anglophone stereotype. Perhaps it's a, "finally someone who doesn't expect me to just speak English!" It's kind of hilarious watching my host mother stop people who we're talking to who offer to switch to English. Their assumption seems to be, "well he's probably American so I'll switch into English" and she does a swift, "No he can understand German! Keep going." People rarely offer to switch when I'm having a 1:1 conversation but I think it's because I'm actually talking to them where as I'm much quieter if it's more than 1:1. That and if we're in a loud area I just physically can't hear what's being said very well.

My course is with FUBiS yes! I'm really happy I chose them. Honestly, because I wanted credit at my school in the US I didn't have much of a choice. My uni has a partnership with Universität Tübingen but as of last year their program only went up to B2 (I think this year it's up to C1 but it could be a different program) and I've heard fairly bad things about the summer program from at least three people. The semester and year long exchange is apparently fantastic and very robust (you can enroll as an exchange student at any of the universities in Baden-Württemberg) but for various reasons I'm not able to do it.
The semester program at FU Berlin, FUBEST, also sounds really amazing. They have a new GermanPLUS program that everyone in my class was invited to apply for. I definitely can't do it next Spring or the Fall of 2018 for a number of reasons (here's to hoping I'm doing an MA instead in the Fall), it sounds amazing.

The only thing larger than a cardigan that I've knitted was Lizard Ridge but it's a super easy pattern. The main hurdle is the cost of Noro. It doesn't really look good to me in anything other than Noro Kureyon or Spring Garden which is a shame given how much that yarn costs. That said that Kureyon holds up super well, at least in the form of a blanket. I also got really good at seaming. I mainly use patterns when I'm knitting but I have designed my own cardigan once. At some point I'm actually going to reknit and publish it, but I have been saying that for 8 years now so we'll see if that happens.

[aokoye]

Recent events in the US make me wish I could just stay in Germany. That said, a. there's much I need to do in Portland to even be able to apply to grad school here and b. the idea of finding a new therapist right this second (or even within the next six months) is terrifying (it's a thing we'll probably start working on come May assuming grad school becomes more imminent).

In better news. I successfully ordered take out over the phone this afternoon. I hate doing that in English and even more in German. That said, that the reward is tasty food is lovely.

I'm also reminded that my reading has gotten better by leaps and bounds. three months ago I was lamenting my ability to read in German. Today I spent the almost the entire morning and all early afternoon researching multilingualism in schools in German. I think two of the sources I've read/am reading today were in English. The rest were in German. I am also getting, necessarily, very good at skimming. It's convenient that I know a lot about the subject.

I mentioned this in another thread earlier today, but I think I'm going to try to re-add Dutch to the languages I'm studying in the late Fall. I like the language in general, depending on what exactly I study in grad school I might end up reading Dutch sources, and the similarities to English grammar makes me pleased. I have an A1-A2 book right now and am probably going to buy an A2-B2 later, towards the end of my time in Europe (or perhaps sometime this week if I go to Dussmann Kaufhaus. It's easier to get Op naar de eindstreep here than it is in the US.

[MamaPata]

Recent events in the US make me wish I could just stay in Germany. That said, a. there's much I need to do in Portland to even be able to apply to grad school here and b. the idea of finding a new therapist right this second (or even within the next six months) is terrifying (it's a thing we'll probably start working on come May assuming grad school becomes more imminent).

In better news. I successfully ordered take out over the phone this afternoon. I hate doing that in English and even more in German. That said, that the reward is tasty food is lovely.

All of the sympathy - good luck with whatever you end up doing!

Impressive on ordering food. I find ordering food and talking on the phone incredibly difficult separately, so I am duly very impressed by you doing both!

[aokoye]

Recent events in the US make me wish I could just stay in Germany. That said, a. there's much I need to do in Portland to even be able to apply to grad school here and b. the idea of finding a new therapist right this second (or even within the next six months) is terrifying (it's a thing we'll probably start working on come May assuming grad school becomes more imminent).

In better news. I successfully ordered take out over the phone this afternoon. I hate doing that in English and even more in German. That said, that the reward is tasty food is lovely.

All of the sympathy - good luck with whatever you end up doing!

Impressive on ordering food. I find ordering food and talking on the phone incredibly difficult separately, so I am duly very impressed by you doing both!

Thanks! It was definitely one of those "ok you need to do this it's good practice" mixed with with the idea that I didn't actually want to sit around and wait for take out at the restaurant when I could order it and walk over while it's being made.

[aokoye]

Oh the stress that is getting lots of corrections on your paper and not knowing said number of corrections if that is normal. I think it would be less of a big deal if I didn't have a lot of mental health issues at play coloring how I view myself.

That said my teacher and I chatted briefly about testdaf this morning during our break and she thinks I'll pass it. Now I'm on my way to Dussmann for some retail therapy.

Edit - strike that, no retail therapy because my bank account isn't terribly pleased with the world but I am editing my paper in a rather pleasant environment surrounded by books. The only thing that would make this better is food and/or coffee. I think in getting a schwarma from one of the kebab places up the street from where I live. While I'm not a fan of the bread (it's just plain pita), the chicken is astounding. Plus it gives me an excuse to spend time walking outside for a while.

[aokoye]

Intensive German class: done! I take the train to Brno in a little under 9 hours (why am I not asleep?!). I've packed more or less everything I can at the moment as my host mother is allowing me to keep some stuff here for when I come back in Sept.

I think the class overall went really well. As Elenia said in a PM, I've definitely made the most of my immersion experience. This was the only week where my classmates and I spoke a shocking amount of English with each other out of class and during breaks. I think we all were beginning to crack under the pressure of four weeks of 9-3pm classes. Plus two of us were in homestays and thus speaking German when we got home and I think we all relied only on German when out and about. The main thing I haven't been doing in German is listening to the news - NPR and BBC. I'm ok with that honestly, especially given what's been going on in the US especially. That said, unsurprisingly, I think most if not all of my skills have gotten better, especially speaking and reading.

Today I presented the short (5 page) paper that I wrote about two different multilingual school programs in Europe. I got good feedback from my teacher which makes me feel confident about at least some of the speaking part of TELC.

I'm still a little disgruntled about the fact that I've not really put any effort into learning really basic Czech. That said I have to keep reminding myself that I've had absolutely no time to do so. That and I will be in the Czech Republic for less than a week. I suspect what will happen is I'll do my usual, "tell me how to count, say please and thank you, and ask for things", when my friend picks me up from the train station. That and there will proably be a lot of me slipping into German.