Languages and Life: Gary's log (Italian, Spanish, German, Japanese, bits of French)

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garyb
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Re: Languages and Life: Gary's log (Italian, Spanish, bits of French, and now German!)

Postby garyb » Wed Mar 03, 2021 2:14 pm

Work and other things have been busy but I'm just about keeping up with German. Duolingo (web version) seems to have become my main resource, which isn't ideal but it's hard to find time to fit in Spektrum and it does feel like I could do with focusing on the A1 stuff for now. I think Duo is fine as a maintenance/slow-progress thing for times like this when I'm too busy to work harder.

I finished Oktoberfest a little while ago, and on the subject of unrealistic and full of clichés, I've now mostly watched Dogs of Berlin. Again it's quite fun; it's supposed to be "gritty" although is too hard to take seriously to really feel it, but it's still quite a gripping story that holds my attention.

I have done a bit more input and Kwiziq in Spanish, and I've tried to write a couple of times and the words have flowed out more easily than before so I guess that's progress! I'm also having another slight French-rediscovery phrase and have watched a couple of films and listened to some episodes of Grand bien vous fasse.
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Re: Languages and Life: Gary's log (Italian, Spanish, bits of French, and now German!)

Postby chove » Wed Mar 03, 2021 3:44 pm

garyb wrote:Work and other things have been busy but I'm just about keeping up with German. Duolingo (web version) seems to have become my main resource, which isn't ideal but it's hard to find time to fit in Spektrum and it does feel like I could do with focusing on the A1 stuff for now. I think Duo is fine as a maintenance/slow-progress thing for times like this when I'm too busy to work harder.


I get really into Duolingo for a while and then go off it. I do like that it makes you practice by typing things in, but some days it just seems like a lot of effort to get through very little material. I use the desktop version, I couldn't get on with the app at all.
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garyb
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Re: Languages and Life: Gary's log (Italian, Spanish, bits of French, and now German!)

Postby garyb » Wed Mar 17, 2021 12:49 pm

I'm still just barely moving along with German. I'm not keeping up a Duo streak but I am using it more days than not, although I'm starting to really see chove's point: it gets tedious for the little you get out of it.

I am starting to understand native input a little better so I've been leaning towards more of that. I finished Dogs of Berlin and have started Biohackers. It's again fun although a bit larger than life; it's just seeming that German series are generally best if not taken too seriously. It's unsurprisingly a lot easier to understand and I can follow quite a lot with just German subtitles. I also watched Lola rennt a few days ago, which was fantastically 90s and a fantastic film in general and I'll probably watch it again soon.

Otherwise I've just been very busy with work-related things, and on the "languages and life" subject I'm starting to accept that it isn't really a bad thing that I have phases of being much more interested in certain things than others. Sometimes I want to focus on languages, sometimes music is all that matters, and sometimes like now I want to finally make a proper effort in my career. I know that people always say that it's better to spend a short time every day on something than longer but more infrequent blocks of time, but trying to impose a schedule on myself and do, say, half an hour of German then half an hour of guitar then half an hour of studying algorithms each day just feels like fighting against my nature when I happen to have much more motivation for one thing than the others.

If I feel that kind of motivation, it's probably a sign and I should indulge it and pour myself into it for a while rather than trying too hard to "find a balance" and do everything in half-measures, and things do tend to balance out in the longer term anyway. Sure, there have been times in my life when in hindsight my priorities were all "wrong", like focusing far too much on social life and using languages as a means to meet and try to fit in with people for some of my twenties, but I learned from it so it wasn't exactly wasted time. Similarly I might realise in a few years that spending too much of my 30s thinking about my work wasn't right for me and wish I had spent more of that time and energy on other things and on just enjoying the moment, but I'll be better off for having tried it and found out. If I start to not feel any ambition or motivation for anything, beyond a reasonable amount of time where I'm just a little burnt out and need to take it easy for a bit, then it's probably time to worry. But as long as I'm feeling a drive to work towards something then it's all good even if other interests are being neglected or put on hold.

I'm sure I wrote a similar post a couple of years ago, but it seems like I need to keep coming back to the same realisations.

Anyway my motivation for German and for my other interests is still somewhat there and I'm doing the minimum to keep them up, and they can even feel like a way to "relax" and have a change after focusing on work.

I'm still getting some Spanish input too. I recently gave Bitter Dasies on Netflix a try, but discovered that it's actually mostly in Galician rather than Spanish (which is pretty cool, just not what I'm after right now!) and I don't really fancy yet another series from Spain about a missing teenager, I've seen quite enough of these by now.
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garyb
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Re: Languages and Life: Gary's log (Italian, Spanish, bits of French, and now German!)

Postby garyb » Sat Mar 27, 2021 1:55 pm

I've not done much proper German study recently but I've consumed a few Netflix series...

Biohackers: I can just echo what I said in my last post - very fun and watchable if not taken too seriously, and I'm happy to see that there'll be another series.

How to sell drugs online (fast). I rejected this in the past due to lack of German subtitles, but now that my listening compehension is a little better (i.e. slightly above zero) I thought I'd still get something out of it. It's a show about Germans who all text and email each other in English... That does take away from the credibility of the whole thing, a bit like with the newer Wallander episodes that are set in Sweden and the newspapers are in Swedish yet everyone is speaking English. I guess they just did that to make it appeal more to an international audience and avoid the awkwardness of having to subtitle the text, but my more sceptical side wonders if it is a sign of things to come with English dominance, especially since judging by this series and Biohackers it seems normal for young German speakers to insert English words (complete with accent!) everywhere when speaking, or even an attempt to influence young people to talk and act a certain way (which I did wonder about with Elite before I gave up on that trash). Despite that whole tangent I did enjoy it, it was silly but good fun and I liked how the technology parts were fairly realistic and well-researched. The effects of certain drugs, perhaps a bit less so...

I've watched the first two episodes of Criminal: Germany. Quite a change in pace after those other series, and the language is of a much higher register so it's a bit less useful to me right now but might be a good one to come back to in time. It's quite clever with some nice plot twists. The France and Spain versions are probably also worth a watch.

I have cracked open Spektrum a couple of times, and mostly found myself revising exercises that I had done before and forgotten. It just highlights that this kind of course really needs consistency and I might be better off just going "all or nothing" and putting it aside until I have more time and motivation for it.
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garyb
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Re: Languages and Life: Gary's log (Italian, Spanish, bits of French, and now German!)

Postby garyb » Mon Apr 26, 2021 10:50 am

My Spanish revival has continued. I've watched a bit more TV, in particular a Mexican telenovela Quién mató a Sara. It was fairly clichéd, and the opposite of what I said about realistic technology parts in my last post, but quite engaging and it was nice to have a change from Spain. I also started reading La sombra del viento, a book that I attempted a year or two ago but gave up on after a while because it was just a bit too difficult and I wasn't really taking in the story. This time round it's feeling easier, although I'm still depending quite heavily on the Kindle dictionary since some of the language is not exactly everyday, and I'm actually getting into it.

I even met up with someone for a language exchange last week, and I'd say I was speaking pretty well! The conversation was a bit small-talkish, nothing too deep or specific, but it was still a good hour or so of Spanish and they were quite patient with me when I did struggle or have to think for a few moments. I felt quite mentally tired at the end, which was quite common in Italian when I was at that intermediate stage.

I hadn't spoken Spanish, even to myself, for over a year; in that time I've only done listening (a decent amount of TV, films, and podcasts, but far from "massive"), occasional writing, a handful of Kwiziq quizzes, and a few books. This does seem to be more good evidence that speaking can be improved without actually practising speaking, at least once you already have a good base. I can't say how much of the progress has been due to input and how much due to more "active" activities like writing and tests, but time-wise it has mostly been input.

I spoke some Italian at the weekend too and that also went pretty well, I think just because I was fairly relaxed.

Now I just need to hope that it's similar for a language at beginner level, since I've done almost no proper German study for weeks and only managed a little listening (currently watching Altes Geld, an Austrian black comedy, which is fun if not exactly gripping). To be honest I'm not so optimistic, but at least it's better than nothing and it should keep some of the little knowledge I have alive until I find the time to work on it properly again.
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garyb
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Re: Languages and Life: Gary's log (Italian, Spanish, bits of French, and now German!)

Postby garyb » Sun Jun 20, 2021 1:30 pm

Mostly more of the same...

In Spanish I'm still reading La sombra del viento. It's pretty long, or at least feels it, but not in a bad way since it's a story I can really get absorbed in. It's still a bit on the challenging side but I'm getting through some pages with no or little dictionary use. TV-wise, another series of Quién mató a Sara came out and I devoured it pretty quickly. I had fairly low expectations based on my previous experiences with Spanish second seasons, but it pleasantly surprised me: the plot twists are pretty wild and there's a lot of jumping around time periods but the writers somehow managed to keep it all cohesive and enjoyable. I suppose the Mexicans are the masters of that stuff.

Following that I decided to try another Mexican series on Netflix, Falsa identidad, but it's feeling just a bit too telenovela-y. It's a strange mix of genres, at times full-on melodrama yet at times I'd almost go as far as calling it gritty; there's just something a bit off about the overall tone of it, like it's mixing serious subjects like drug trafficking and domestic violence with over-the-top characters, cheesy romance elements, and over-dramatic background music that seem to trivialise any points it might be trying to make. I watched a few episodes before mostly losing interest. I am keen to watch some more Mexican and Latin American stuff though.

My life's getting back into a steadier routine after some craziness earlier this year and that's given me some time to get back into German a bit. I've been doing Duolingo most days for a couple of weeks, which has been a sort of a test to see if I can consistently manage at least a little bit of work: if I can continue this way for another week or two I'll think about getting back into proper study. I've watched a couple of things based on the "posh girl gets involved with terrorists" trope which were enjoyable enough (Und morgen die ganze Welt and Wir sind die Welle) and a silly comedy, Berlin, Berlin. Feels like I'm already starting to scrape the bottom of the barrel of what's available on Netflix.

I've spoken some Italian but the Italian friend I usually see has gone back to Italy for the summer so I don't think I'll be using it much for a few months. I have watched a few films though, including the rest of the Maltese series. I suppose it's a good opportunity to put Italian in maintenance mode for now and work on my other languages.
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Re: Languages and Life: Gary's log (Italian, Spanish, bits of French, and now German!)

Postby gsbod » Sun Jun 20, 2021 1:47 pm

I've also recently watched Quién mató a Sara and in some ways it actually reminded me of Dark, even though there's no scifi element, with the convoluted plotlines running on multiple timelines, all of the characters being compromised in some way, and even the style of the soundtrack was similar. Some of the violence was a bit much for me, but I still ended up watching most of season 2 over 1 weekend.

I had no idea they'd made a film for Berlin, Berlin. Years ago I started watching the TV series (at the time it was freely available on YouTube, but it looks like that's now long gone and Netflix have now licensed the whole lot). I found the first season was silly but enjoyable but it all went downhill from there.

Have you looked at the German language stuff on All4 yet?
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garyb
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Re: Languages and Life: Gary's log (Italian, Spanish, bits of French, and now German!)

Postby garyb » Mon Jun 21, 2021 6:56 pm

gsbod wrote:Have you looked at the German language stuff on All4 yet?

I had never even considered All4 before but I've just checked it out and it looks like an excellent recommendation, thanks! It has quite a few German series, and also lots in Italian and French. I've just started watching The Same Sky on there. Pity that there aren't any subtitle options other than hard-coded English subs but that's not really a big deal for me and it forces me to pay attention and hear the German.
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garyb
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Re: Languages and Life: Gary's log (Italian, Spanish, bits of French, and now German!)

Postby garyb » Mon Jun 28, 2021 4:24 pm

I can only say thanks again for the All4 rec! I really enjoyed The Same Sky: it was a good story with some nice subplots, despite an abrupt ending. It's unclear whether that was deliberate or a second series was planned but never made. I liked watching something about East and West Germany during the Cold War since it's a situation I only had superficial knowledge of; it's a fictional series so I didn't exactly take it as a history lesson, although the reviews I've read say that it's quite an accurate and non-exaggerated portrayal.

On the same theme, I've started Deutschland 83 and am similarly enjoying it. The language in both shows is definitely above my level but I am making an effort to listen to the German and all input is valuable. It is nice when I understand full sentences and even correctly predict them when the English subtitle shows before the line is spoken.

As for All4, it's decidedly not as slick a user experience as something like Netflix but it does the job. There are some intelligence-insulting TV adverts - something I had barely seen for years and they've not got any better - but it seems to depend on the platform (I never see ads when watching on a browser, only on Chromecast) and the show (the breaks in The Same Sky had several minutes of ads while for 83 there are very few). It does the job and it's worth it for the amount of content - at least for someone like me who likes crime series. Somebody not into that genre might not find much foreign-language content of interest.

More generally, I've had more motivation than ever for German in the last few weeks. With my other languages I had a burning motivation right from the start, but with German it's really taken a while between false starts, negative feelings brought up by the language and culture (nothing against them at all; just the usual regrets about not taking the job in Berlin when I had the chance!), lack of immediate practical use for it, waning interest in languages in general, and the sharp initial learning curve. But I figured that sooner or later I'd either get properly into it or just lose interest entirely, and fortunately the former appears to be happening now and it's great. Especially since I'm still at the very early stages in the language and motivation is what I need to break out of the beginner stage. Let's just hope it lasts and life doesn't get in the way again.

I suppose I'm just at a different stage of my life now, but I'm happy that languages still have their place in it. I don't want to repeat too many things I've already written here in the last few years, but when I look back to when I was learning my romance languages in my twenties it's pretty clear that my initially healthy motivations like intellectual curiosity and desire to communicate with the people around me and discover their cultures did become quite unhealthy and ego-driven which led to all sorts of negative consequences. Now it's nice just learning something for the sake of it rather than out of wanting to prove something to myself and others or to be someone I'm not, and for the moment I'm quite fine with not knowing when or even if I'll actually use my German with people.

Back to the practical side, I decided that I was in a bit over my head with Spektrum A2 and I still don't have a very good grasp on some very fundamental stuff so I've taken a step back and started working through A1, although at a fairly fast pace without spending too long on the absolute basics. It does seem to overlap a bit with A2, for example they both have sections near the start on job roles and verbs for typical work tasks, but I guess it's good to cover things thouroughly and thorough is certainly a word I'd use to describe these books. For now my approach is essentially to attack the bases of the language from every angle (textbook work, input, Duolingo, learner podcasts and videos) until they eventually stick from enough repetition and practice. It's not exactly a very scientific or "smart" method, but it seems like the only way.
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Re: Languages and Life: Gary's log (Italian, Spanish, bits of French, and now German!)

Postby DaveAgain » Mon Jun 28, 2021 4:57 pm

garyb wrote:I can only say thanks again for the All4 rec! I really enjoyed The Same Sky: it was a good story with some nice subplots, despite an abrupt ending. It's unclear whether that was deliberate or a second series was planned but never made.
The lack of resolution in the last episode was super annoying! I think you're right, they were anticipating a 2nd series that didn't happen.
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