False Beginner in Spanish

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elAmericanoTranquilo
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Re: False Beginner in Spanish

Postby elAmericanoTranquilo » Sat Feb 04, 2023 6:27 pm

Le Baron wrote:I'm a bit late now you're already leaving tomorrow! However, when you're done with Pimsleur/Assimil, have a look at aioLinguaSpanish. It's subject matter might annoy some people, but they use a form of Spanish (Castilian) which is very current, with vocabulary and ways of speaking that are current rather than formal. You;ve rocketed through Pimsleur/Assimil so you might even find that the audio feels slow(ish), but give it a whirl. Their interest is in listening/speaking for students who have already completed the basis of a language.

It's free. https://aiopop.com/
Thanks! Yes, I've been working through this material as well! (I mentioned it only very briefly in my log). I've listened to all of the dialogues a few times now and the first ten many times. I still need to go back through and read the transcriptions and translations to help fill in my understanding. I don't mind the provocative subject matter - it kind of makes it interesting and helps keep me tuned in. Thanks for letting me know that the dialect is current - I will double down on this material and binge it on the plane :)
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elAmericanoTranquilo
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Re: False Beginner in Spanish

Postby elAmericanoTranquilo » Mon Apr 24, 2023 12:29 am

Wow, about 10 weeks since my last update! I had a great time in Spain, including lots of opportunities to practice speaking with teachers, shop owners, and a few locals during language exchanges. It was challenging and a bit humbling - I knew going in that my speaking level was lagging behind my reading level, but that knowledge didn't make the experience any easier! I did have some good streaks though, during some of the language exchanges, where I strung together sentences well enough to be understood.

Study-wise, I focused most of my efforts there on learning how and when to use the 3 past tenses. That part was coming together for me by the end of the trip, but like everything, I still make mistakes, especially when speaking on the fly. Now that I'm back home I've resumed my self study, tweaking my program a bit. I dropped the Speakly app because it seemed to be sloppy about the differences between the 3 past tenses. I also dropped Assimil for now at least, since I made a full pass through all of the lessons. I do think the Assimil book has lots of nuggets e.g. coloquial expressions, so I may revisit it at some point.

One surprise for me was that I found that re-doing Pimsleur lessons (starting again from level 3) was really interesting and helpful. For example, now that I've studied preterite vs imperfect in more depth, the Pimsleur lessons on that make more sense, which helps it to be stickier for me.

The other big change to my program is that I've started FSI (actually a hybrid of FSI / Platiquemos / Dicendi). I was worried that I might find it boring but luckily, I seem to like it so far. As with Pimsleur, I like doing FSI while I'm walking around outside. I think I might fall asleep if I try to do it at home :)

Pimsleur Castilian Spanish
* Re-doing lessons 61-150 (currently on lesson 138), one lesson per day
* I also try to do the Quick Match and Voice Coach exercises in the App from the previous day's lesson

FSI / Platiquemos / Dicendi
* Lesson 5/55
* Doing 1 lesson per day, moving to next lesson on day 4
* After each lesson, I listen to just the dialog portion of the subsequent lesson
* I read through the lessons on the Platiquemos PDF and use the Dicendi app for translation help or for extra reps on the drills
* I'm using the audio from FSI from the Internet Archive, which I found to be decent quality (the Barron's version on CD that I found at my library had noticeable background hiss)
* So far I'm only using the drills from FSI / Dicendi and not using any of the drills from Platiquemos. This is because I like the faster pace of speech in the FSI dialogues and I read here that the FSI version has more drills than Platiquemos.
* However, at the end of each FSI lesson I also do the "Conversation Stimulus" from Platiquemos, as it provides some extra practice (translation from English, following prompts in Spanish, plus slight variations on the FSI dialogues). I sometimes also listen to the first part of Platiquemos for a lesson when I'm previewing the dialogue for the next lesson, since the translations and slow speed of Platiquemos can help make things easier to understand during the initial listen.

Conjugation Practice
* 10-20 minutes each day on https://linguno.com, taking conjugation quizzes covering a mix of 10 different tenses and moods.
* I really want to do more of this, along with (re-)studying conjugation tables for the present and preterite tenses, so that I know them cold.

Learning Spanish Like Crazy
I went through about 10 of the Intermediate lessons while I was in Spain. It's a nice supplement to Pimsleur so I may come back to it.

Grammar Books
* I re-read the Eric Vogt book on Spanish past tenses and it definitely helped my understanding. I should really find time to go through the exercises.
* I also picked up his book on the subjunctive and did a quick read through - it gives me a mental roadmap of what I need to learn. Right now I'm still just scratching the surface of using the subjunctive, but I'm enjoying it.
* In a bookstore in Spain I took a look at "Gramática de uso del Español. A1-A2" and I confirmed that it is page by page identical to "McGraw-Hill Education Beginning Spanish Grammar," except that the latter has instructions and explanations in English (and is a little less expensive). I bought the McGraw-Hill book and want to start working through it; the format seems to lend itself naturally to a "one lesson per day" habit.

Consuming Content - Listening and Reading
* I finished 4 books in my 10 pack of graded readers by Paco Ardit. The A2 books are a little more fun to read.

* I've switched my "household chores" audio over to "Beyond the Basics," which has 20 dialogues and an accompanying book with English translation and grammar explanations and exercises. I haven't been doing the exercises but I'm on dialog 9 and I'm enjoying them. I listen to each one for 3 days or so, then read the translation and explanation, then re-listen for a few days and start on the next dialog.

Consuming Content - Video
* I still really like Español Sí - it's such a unique combination of intermediate level grammar lessons and conversation examples through the ongoing vignettes. I'm about 40% through the series but I feel like I could get lots more value from rewatching the older episodes, too. As I watch more episodes I think I'm benefiting from "the series effect" that people talk about, where things become easier to understand as you become accustomed to the speakers and to their vocabulary
* Finished "Last of Us" and now watching "Beef" and "Deseo Oscuro" For all of these shows I probably understand 40% of the dialog and 80% of the plot.

Consuming Content - Flashcards from Videos
* I still want to revisit this to see if I can find a workflow that will create usable cards without too much work.

Writing Practice
* I posted a few entries on Journaly and received some helpful corrections. I want to do more of this as a way to practice output.
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elAmericanoTranquilo
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Re: False Beginner in Spanish

Postby elAmericanoTranquilo » Mon Jun 19, 2023 7:26 am

Wow, I never thought I would say this, but I'm really enjoying FSI/Platiquemos! I have a daily routine of going on a long walk while I work through the lessons. The drilling and the speaking practice is really helping my confidence. It's the key part of my program now.

I also dabbled a bit in iTalki lessons - I need to put them on hold for logistical reasons, but I'm planning to get on a schedule of 1 lesson per week starting next month, working through the AULA 3 (B1) textbook with my instructor.

FSI / Platiquemos / Dicendi
* Lesson 21/55
* Doing 1 lesson per day, moving to next lesson on day 4 (occasionally I'll do a lesson 4 times instead of 3).
* After each lesson, I listen to just the dialog portion of the subsequent lesson, to start getting familiar with it. I'll also read through it in Dicendi afterwards.
* At the end of each FSI lesson I also do the "Conversation Stimulus" from Platiquemos. I find these very challenging, but in a good way! I also noticed that there is no audio of the conversations in the original FSI (or Dicendi) from level 17 onward, so the fact that Platiquemos has this audio is a big selling point for me.
* Sometimes on day 1 doing a new lesson, it feels like there's no way I'll get through it, but then on day 2 it's somehow a little easier and by day 3 it's really clicking for me. It's a very satisfying feeling.

Conjugation Practice
* 10-20 minutes each day on https://linguno.com, taking conjugation quizzes. Recently I've been drilling the 20 or so most common irregular verbs in the present and simple preterite.
* This has helped me a lot! By the time I got to the preterite drills in FSI, I was really prepared.

Pimsleur Castilian Spanish
* I finished a second run through of lessons 61-150 and then started again on lesson 61. I'm now on lesson 71 of this 3rd pass, though I'm only doing these a couple of times per week now, as a supplement to the core of FSI.

Grammar Books
* My new discovery is another one from the "Practice Makes Perfect" series - Spanish Conversation. It comes with 12 audio dialogs which are pretty good, but even better than that is the discussion in the book that breaks down key phrases and discusses multiple meanings and uses. This is really helpful and interesting to me at my current level.

iTalki Lessons
* I took 2 hours of lessons last month. I will resume the lessons next month, taking 1 lesson per week, working through the AULA 3 (B1) textbook with my instructor.

Consuming Content - Listening and Reading
* I stalled out lately on reading graded readers.
* I now have 3 collections of dialogues that I rotate through while doing household chores - AOI Lingua, Beyond the Basics, and Spanish Conversation. Lately I sometimes watch video during this time instead (see below).

Consuming Content - Video
* I think I found the perfect series for my current level - "Xena, Princess Warrior!" The dubbing is very good and the dialog has lots of repetition and dramatic pauses. I've watched 3 episodes so far, including rewatching the first 2 several times.
* I'm about halfway through the (72) episodes of Español Sí and I'm liking it more and more. Lately I've been rewatching earlier episodes and I understand so much more of dialog than I did the first time around.
* Finished watching "Beef", "Deseo Oscuro", and "Fake Profile." For all of these shows I probably understand 40% of the dialog and 80% of the plot.

Consuming Content - Intensive Study of Video
* I figured out a way to make flash cards from shows, but for some reason I don't find myself working through them. But I also discovered Language Reactor, and I like the experience better than the flash cards. I'm now using Language Reactor for intensive study of the first episode of Xena.
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Le Baron
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Re: False Beginner in Spanish

Postby Le Baron » Mon Jun 19, 2023 2:56 pm

Blimey, you're more organised than I am right now.
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MorkTheFiddle
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Re: False Beginner in Spanish

Postby MorkTheFiddle » Tue Jun 20, 2023 7:53 am

You have found a splendid set of sources and practices for yourself. Other learners could profit from taking note. I'll add that Language Reactor is a new one for me.
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Re: False Beginner in Spanish

Postby SlowLearner » Thu Aug 10, 2023 5:25 pm

Howdy, I'm hoping you can give me some advice based on what I've completed so far and where I should go from here (as in which resources have really helped you, and maybe which order I should do them in). I've never learned a foreign language before.

So far I have completed all five levels of Pimsleur and I'm up to about 800 words in Anki (Spanish to English).

My Spanish has slowed to a crawl and I'm only doing about ten minutes of Anki per day now. I want to study for about an hour per day. So I'm wondering how you think I should split up my time and what you might do differently if you had to do it again.

I recently started doing a bit of Platiquemos (that's how I found your log), do you think I should continue with this alone, do it in conjunction with other things? which things? or put Platiquemos on hold for now as there's a better order to do it?

Thanks to a bit of creativity I've managed to get my hands on these - FSI basic course, Rocket Spanish, Platiquemos, Pimsleur, Learning Spanish Like Crazy all 3 levels, FSI Programmatic Spanish, Assimil Spanish with Ease.

Thanks in advance for any advice!
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elAmericanoTranquilo
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Re: False Beginner in Spanish

Postby elAmericanoTranquilo » Tue Nov 14, 2023 8:30 pm

SlowLearner wrote:Howdy, I'm hoping you can give me some advice based on what I've completed so far and where I should go from here (as in which resources have really helped you, and maybe which order I should do them in). I've never learned a foreign language before.

So far I have completed all five levels of Pimsleur and I'm up to about 800 words in Anki (Spanish to English).

My Spanish has slowed to a crawl and I'm only doing about ten minutes of Anki per day now. I want to study for about an hour per day. So I'm wondering how you think I should split up my time and what you might do differently if you had to do it again.

I recently started doing a bit of Platiquemos (that's how I found your log), do you think I should continue with this alone, do it in conjunction with other things? which things? or put Platiquemos on hold for now as there's a better order to do it?

Thanks to a bit of creativity I've managed to get my hands on these - FSI basic course, Rocket Spanish, Platiquemos, Pimsleur, Learning Spanish Like Crazy all 3 levels, FSI Programmatic Spanish, Assimil Spanish with Ease.

Thanks in advance for any advice!
Hi SlowLearner! Please accept my apologies for not seeing this earlier. I'm actually about to post another update on my own progress here. My key takeaway is that FSI/Platiquemos turned out to be the perfect next step for me after completing Pimsluer. I also like Learning Spanish Like Crazy (starting with the intermediate course if you've finished Pimsleur already). A big factor is of course whether you find the particular material compelling enough to stick with it and spend time on it every day. Oh yeah, if you haven't found it yet, another really good and complementary course is Language Transfer Complete Spanish.
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elAmericanoTranquilo
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Re: False Beginner in Spanish

Postby elAmericanoTranquilo » Wed Nov 15, 2023 7:53 pm

Sometimes I read other language logs that don’t have any updates for months or even a year or more, and then I wonder if the person lost interest in the language they were studying and gave up? I hope nobody got that impression about me, since I haven’t posted here in almost 5 months :shock: My Spanish studies are very much alive and well, and I have some big updates!

First, I finished the FSI Basic Course! It took me about 7 months to work through all 55 lessons :D

My other big news is that my wife and I were approved for our visas to move to Spain early next year! I know I have a long way to go in my studies to achieve fluency but I’m happy with my progress this year because I think I will already have a good foundation to build on once we are in Spain.

A few weeks ago I took the quick tests at https://deleahora.com at the suggestion of my iTalki teacher and these were my scores:
A2 - 95%
B1 - 76%
B2 - 54%

Notably, most of my challenges in B1 and B2 were related to vocabulary.

Besides doing FSI every day, I’ve been doing daily conjugation practice on Linguno, watching Español Sí for 30 minutes a day while doing chores, and taking weekly 1 hour lessons with a teacher on iTalki. I also watch an hour of TV in Spanish with subtitles most days.

FSI / Platiquemos / Dicendi
I took the approach recommended by some here on the forum to do each lesson 3 times, though I did some 4 times if they were giving me trouble. And then when I got to lesson 47 I noticed the lessons got much longer and I was only able to do half a lesson per day. And one caveat is that I didn’t do all of the extra readings that are in lessons 45-55. I may revisit them later, we’ll see.

FSI got to be a bit of grind at the end, but overall I enjoyed the course and it helped me tremendously in terms of my ability to conjugate and string phrases together. Doing the lessons while I was on long walks really helped me to focus and stick with the program. There are some great drills in there that I plan to revisit, and I also plan to revisit the whole course in some form after I’ve had a break from it ;)

Conjugation Practice
* 10-20 minutes each day on https://linguno.com, taking conjugation quizzes. My core drill is one that requires conjugation in the present and simple preterite. I started with 20 or so irregular verbs, and then lately I started adding in new verbs as I learn them. Since linguno exercises include example sentences, I’m hoping this also helps me commit new verbs to memory.
* There are two other drills that I find very useful in linguno. One makes you conjugate and also choose whether to use the preterite or the imperfect tense. The other makes you conjugate and also choose whether to use the indicative or subjuntivo. I want to add these 2 drills to my daily routine, e.g. maybe I can do 1 drill after breakfast, 1 after lunch, and 1 after dinner.

Pimsleur Castilian Spanish
* After previously completing all 150 lessons and re-doing some of them, I just started again on lesson 61, after I finished FSI. So far I’m much faster to respond than I was previously, so I think it’s good practice for fluency

Learning Spanish Like Crazy
* I previously did lessons 31-45 but not very rigorously. After FSI, I restarted from lesson 31. Similar to redoing Pimsleur, I think it’s good practice for fluency.

iTalki Lessons
* I’ve now completed 19 1-hour lessons, all with the same instructor, who is very kind and patient. I worked my way all the way through the AULA 3 (B1) textbook that she provided, doing about 40% of the homework. It was interesting, and a good way to force me to get regular reading and writing practice through the homework assignments. The live lessons are fun but also quite humbling, as they force me to confront my limitations as a speaker. Right now this 1 hour a week is the only chance I get to speak Spanish with a person, so there is some extra difficulty due to lack of regular practice. Once I am in Spain I should be able to have more opportunities to practice speaking.

Consuming Content - Reading
One thing that I would like to do more of now is read. I noticed reading is easier for me now, e.g. I can follow some articles on El País and I’m currently reading a translation of Charlie and the Chocolate Factory. Part of the challenge seems to be getting myself to spend significant time reading every day. I always read a little before going to sleep but sometimes I don’t last very long :)

I also subscribe to a bunch of newsletters from El País and sometimes I read few paragraphs from one, but I rarely stick with it to make through a whole article.

I want to get more serious about reading because, now that I have a better gramatical foundation, my two biggest challenges seem to be developing fluency when speaking and growing my vocabulary. I think my limited vocabulary is now holding back my listening progress. I haven’t been one to enjoy flashcards in the past but I’m again considering somehow incorporating them into my routine in a lightweight way, like maybe making a separate deck for each book that I’m reading. But I’m not sure exactly if/how I will find a way to incorporate flashcards that is interesting enough for me to stick with it.

Consuming Content - Listening
* I now have 3 collections of dialogues that I rotate through while doing household chores - AOI Lingua, Beyond the Basics, and Spanish Conversation. Lately I sometimes watch video during this time instead (see below).

Consuming Content - Video
* I think I found the perfect series for my current level - "Xena, Princess Warrior!" The dubbing is very good and the dialog has lots of repetition and dramatic pauses. I've watched about 12 episodes so far, including rewatching some of them 4 or 5 times.
* I'm about 80% through the (72) episodes of Español Sí and I'm really enjoying it. Lately this is what I watch/listen to while doing household chores. I watch each episode 3 times, in 10-15 minute bites. It’s an interesting mix of grammar instruction and interesting dialog / drama. Highly recommended.
* Finished watching “Black Sails” dubbed into Spanish. Who knew pirate language would be so challenging to understand? Maybe because they have their own lingo, but also I think because the show involves a lot of plotting and thus contains a lot of reported speech. Good practice, though, and I kind of want to watch it again.
* Now I’m back to watching Dueños del paraíso (episode 22 of 65). It’s a little easier for me to understand than it was when I first tried it about 10 months ago.

Consuming Content - Intensive Study of Video
* I like using Language Reactor for this, but I haven’t been able to make it into a daily habit. Intensive study of video seems to wear me out after about 10 minutes, though I really like the concept.
Last edited by elAmericanoTranquilo on Wed Dec 06, 2023 7:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
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MorkTheFiddle
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Re: False Beginner in Spanish

Postby MorkTheFiddle » Fri Nov 17, 2023 3:22 am

This is an uplifting account, elAmericanoTranquilo, and you've done so much. Congratulations and keep it up!
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Many things which are false are transmitted from book to book, and gain credit in the world. -- attributed to Samuel Johnson

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elAmericanoTranquilo
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Re: False Beginner in Spanish

Postby elAmericanoTranquilo » Fri Nov 17, 2023 5:40 pm

MorkTheFiddle wrote:This is an uplifting account, elAmericanoTranquilo, and you've done so much. Congratulations and keep it up!
Thank you, Mork, I appreciate the encouragement! Also, big thanks to everyone on this forum. It's been a fantastic resource as I've pieced together my study plan!
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