Rdearman 2016-24 You Can't Have Your Kate and Edith Too.

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Brun Ugle
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Re: Rdearman (FR, IT, ZH) 2016/17 - The way of the lazy fist.

Postby Brun Ugle » Wed Jun 28, 2017 6:02 pm

rdearman wrote:I was contemplating Brun Ugle's question about output, and getting it corrected. I could have my tutor do it, but I would prefer to not spend time going over that sort of thing at the moment, the tutor is more useful for speaking output right now than written output. I don't know if she'd be interested. I can also use Lang-8 since I signed up before the current restrictions, but I wasn't really too happy about the waiting around for corrections. Finally coming up with a lot of original content was a problem. So I wondered about doing translations and I think I've come up with a rather practical solution.

I have a couple of parallel texts in French/English and it occurred to me if I simply cover up the French, and translate the English myself, then I have a built in mechanism for checking my work because I already have a translation at hand. Of course I still need to do some additional output, and Lang-8 and my tutor will be a big help there, but to start with I can begin with targeting translation of a page of English and looking at the translation after to see how well I've done and how the professional did it.

It can't hurt, so might as well add that to my C1 mission. 8-)

I'm planning to do the same thing. It was one of the techniques I got from Ivan Kupka's lecture, "Way of the Peaceful Bookworm" at the Gathering. He suggests reading the French about ten times through while paying attention to different things (e.g. verbs, adjectives, nouns, conversational phrases, etc) each time. Then you translate it to English. (Here you could compare to the official translation.) Then wait a while in order to forget. Then translate your English version back to French and compare to the original.

I feel like translating to English yourself could be a useful step because it would force you to make sure you really understand the nuances of meaning in the French and also it allows you to translate it in a way that helps you find your way back to the original. A real translator would translate something so the English sounds good, but you could lean a little more towards a literal translation. I don't mean to the point of unnaturalness, but just where there are several ways of saying things you could choose the one that's closest to the original French.

I have a book of short stories in parallel text in Spanish and English that I'm going to use.
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rdearman
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Re: Rdearman (FR, IT, ZH) 2016/17 - The way of the lazy fist.

Postby rdearman » Thu Jun 29, 2017 6:06 pm

Today I took the pdf of the Basic Fantasy game and converted it to text and ran it through the AntConc program for corpus analysis in order to get subject specific words, and then I used Google to get the English translations, and generated a D&D specific word deck. I figured if I was going to play the game then I needed to know the words for sorcerer, monster, spell, fireball, etc. :ugeek: :lol: :geek:
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Re: Rdearman (FR, IT, ZH) 2016/17 - The way of the lazy fist.

Postby MamaPata » Thu Jun 29, 2017 9:12 pm

rdearman wrote:I figured if I was going to play the game then I needed to know the words for sorcerer, monster, spell, fireball, etc. :ugeek: :lol: :geek:


Which are??! Share with the class! :lol:
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Re: Rdearman (FR, IT, ZH) 2016/17 - The way of the lazy fist.

Postby Systematiker » Thu Jun 29, 2017 9:41 pm

MamaPata wrote:
rdearman wrote:I figured if I was going to play the game then I needed to know the words for sorcerer, monster, spell, fireball, etc. :ugeek: :lol: :geek:


Which are??! Share with the class! :lol:


Or even share the deck
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Re: Rdearman (FR, IT, ZH) 2016/17 - The way of the lazy fist.

Postby rdearman » Thu Jun 29, 2017 9:44 pm

MamaPata wrote:
rdearman wrote:I figured if I was going to play the game then I needed to know the words for sorcerer, monster, spell, fireball, etc. :ugeek: :lol: :geek:


Which are??! Share with the class! :lol:

Here is the spreadsheet with everything in it. https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B_Cnd ... kZ6YW9aR1k
Here is the anki deck: https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B_Cnd ... 2ZDVXl4WTg

Knock yourself out! :D
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Re: Rdearman (FR, IT, ZH) 2016/17 - The way of the lazy fist.

Postby rdearman » Fri Jun 30, 2017 8:18 pm

Well not doing too bad at the SC for French: 146 films 58 books but I'm not planning on doing much of the other languages, so I'll fail on those. :cry:

The plan seems to be going well at the moment. I've been listening to Podcasts if I don't do anything else, I'm reading extensively and I'm hammering the anki cards. I'm only doing 25 new cards per day, so shouldn't build up too quickly. I've watch some more series in French and my car is basically an English free zone. Mostly I listen to the Belgian radio station I can receive with the odd bit of Michel Thomas or a podcast. I'm working hard on FSI French.

I want to get back to the place where I was a couple of months ago when I was spontaneously thinking in French, but I think I'm going to have to do a lot more binge watching and reading before that happens again.
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Re: Rdearman (FR, IT, ZH) 2016/17 - The way of the lazy fist.

Postby rdearman » Sun Jul 02, 2017 5:57 pm

Finally went and put some money into my italki account, but I can't find any tutors/teachers I'm particularly drawn to. I've had one language exchange from the iTalki site, this was conducted in English with a bit of French thrown in. I can't really blame the guy, he has his English certification test this week so I was happy to help him, but didn't really do me much good. I have put in the cash, so I need to use it, but I'm not particularly good at making it on time to these lessons. I'm seriously considering taking zenmonkey up on his offer.

I'm reading in French again, and watching lots of TV. I've a bucket load of Anki cards which I'm working my way through. I have a large backlog of one deck because I put it on hold completely because of Italian, but I managed to get it under 999 revisions today. I've listened to about 1/2 dozen podcasts in French, none of them have really gotten me wanting to hear more, but some aren't so bad they can't be tolerated. I maintain exactly zero interest in politics, self-help, marketing, or news in general, so hard to find something interesting!

I've switched all my phones and devices to French except the ones at work. Google caught me by surprise after I switched over. I frequently just press the microphone icon and ask my question aloud and wait for Google to search the internet. But now it wants me to ask my question in French! Dooh! However, I've since discovered you can ask in English and Google will work it out. (Yes, I do try in French first though)

The D&D word list had a lot of English words show up (don't know why) but I use the swipe right gesture to disable cards, so it is easy enough to get rid of them.

I've also scoured the Internet for lists of essay questions. Found stuff like:
Prompt:
"The price of greatness is responsibility." - Winston Churchill
Assignment:
Do we expect too much from our public figures? Plan your response, and then write an essay...

These are the types of things I'm planning to use for output. I looked at translating the dual-language book I have, and those stories are really bloody hard! So I might need to thing of something else in the short term. Probably essay questions and lang-8. I'm also planning to try and find a pen-pal. I used to work for a French company, and I do have a lot of contacts who are French, so I'm thinking about writing to them on LinkedIn in French.
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Re: Rdearman (FR, IT, ZH) 2016/17 - The way of the lazy fist.

Postby DaveBee » Tue Jul 04, 2017 7:40 am

rdearman wrote:I've listened to about 1/2 dozen podcasts in French, none of them have really gotten me wanting to hear more, but some aren't so bad they can't be tolerated. I maintain exactly zero interest in politics, self-help, marketing, or news in general, so hard to find something interesting!
Arte have a series on the greek myths. I've converted some of those to audio files for listening.

http://sites.arte.tv/grands-mythes/fr

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... 4NoSL0qqVL
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Re: Rdearman (FR, IT, ZH) 2016/17 - The way of the lazy fist.

Postby rdearman » Tue Jul 04, 2017 9:08 am

DaveBee wrote:
rdearman wrote:I've listened to about 1/2 dozen podcasts in French, none of them have really gotten me wanting to hear more, but some aren't so bad they can't be tolerated. I maintain exactly zero interest in politics, self-help, marketing, or news in general, so hard to find something interesting!
Arte have a series on the greek myths. I've converted some of those to audio files for listening.

http://sites.arte.tv/grands-mythes/fr

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... 4NoSL0qqVL

Good Idea!
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Re: Rdearman (FR, IT, ZH) 2016/17 - The way of the lazy fist.

Postby rdearman » Sun Jul 09, 2017 1:31 pm

I know I haven't updated in awhile when I have to go 3-4 pages back to find my log! What have I been doing? The short answer is not enough, the long answer below.

I've been working on the study and creating mailing lists, working on the instructions, rewriting the instructions, and attempting to write instructions for subs2srs with screenshots. Working through Anki decks, grammar books, FSI French, watching films and listening to audio... oh, and I work full time. I'm thinking I should knock that last one on the head, it takes up far to much of my time! :lol:

I watched Pulp Fiction in French. This showed me a whole lot of new words. :shock: But I'm not going to bother to learn them, I have that particular bad habit in English, I don't need to swear like a sailor in other languages too. Still it was a interesting movie to watch when I know so much of the dialogue.

I drove about 4 hours north this week to meet with some collegues from one of our sister companies in France. I managed to get a few sentences in but mostly it was all done in English. We were doing a tour of a warehouse, so it was fun to eaves drop on the conversations they were having among themselves when walking around.

The no English rule in my car is still in force, which in reality means I mostly just drive in silence. I did about 28 hours in the car last week, I'm really sick of driving. I now default to the Belgium radio station I can get, but I've given up on the Michel Thomas, it just annoys me. On the drive up north I did relisten to "TinTin" but only the first 30 minutes, then I couldn't be bothered. I've listened to it far to many times for it to hold my attention. Working on a theme here, podcasts seem to have gone out the window too. There were a couple that were mildly interesting, one which everyone raved about "Captain Web" but was really p*ss*ng me off. One of the four presenters mike was really high, and he shouted everything he said, everyone else seemed to mumble or speak softly, so I kept cranking my sound up to listen and try to work out what was going on, then this guy would shout out something and blast my eardrums. In the end I gave up, I still have a couple of newer episodes to listen to, so I might try again and just see if it was a one-off screw up by the sound guy.

The other podcasts are political (and therefore boring for me) so I'll probably drop them. I really need to keep looking around, I'd prefer something with only one or two speakers where the sound levels aren't switching radically, and they talk about a topic which interests me. One of the political ones I could understand, it was a woman interviewing a man from Sengal, and another from South America. I understood the African fellow, and the Spanish speaker better than the French woman. I could tell the one guy had a very heavy Spanish accent to his French, but he spoke very clearly for me.

In my old car I used to be able to get 3-4 French radio stations too, but I don't know if it is just the antena in this car is crap, or they change the French stations to digital or something.

I've managed to whittle down my anki deck into something which can be done in about an hour a day. One of the old French deck had ~2000 cards to review, and I've pushed myself through so yesterday I ended the day with zero cards. It took a full 2 weeks to get it so I could end the day with nothing. Today I'm back to 600 cards for review, but that isn't a problem. The D&D deck is interesting, but the google translate is a bit poor, I know why and I know enough French to understand. But it is serving it's purpose, and it has actually helped me with some words in a YA fantasy novel I'm reading at the moment called La Quête d'Ewilan, so it all renforces each other.

Back in procrastination ville, I found a method of transfering laser printed images onto cloth, and so I've put covers on to the three books I made.

basicfantasywithcover.png


You can tell they are very homemade, but their fairly robust and would work well for playing a game or two. All three were done with slightly different methods, but still they came out ok, I'm alright with them. When we do the LLORG meetup in London I'm planning to give them away to anyone who wants one. So a little incentive for showing up and playing the game in French. BTW, this got me thinking of a really interesting twist on this book. I could do another set of books, but make the back cover longer by about 2-3 mm and then create a "box" on this where you keep your dice. The idea being that the book and the dice come as an assembly. Nice idea, and I have all the stuff, only thing missing is the time to implement. :(

FSI is going slowly, but I am still perservering. The problem is I'm not doing it daily or regularly enough. It is a bit of a pain for me but only from a logistical point of view. I have printed out the PDF, and I like to have the printout with me, while I drill. I also need some privacy, because otherwise I risk getting a lot of moaning from my family and "Can't you do that somewhere else? I'm trying to ..."

I've booked an extra lesson a week with my local French tutor, but I still haven't spent any of the money which I sunk into iTalki. It is easier with my local tutor, because she rocks up to my house, and I have to do it. But I don't seem to be able to bring myself to schedule a time to work with an iTalki person. This is all down to me and I'll take the plunge soon, but even the iTalki computer seems to have noticed because it keeps sending me notifications like "You have points but haven't booked in lessons, what about an Italian lesson with Alice who is online right now..."

Well, just re-read this post, and it reminded me of a quote: "No man is ever to busy to stop and tell you how busy he is." so, time to stop moaning and get back to it.
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