Luke's very confused Spanish Learning Log

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luke
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Re: Luke's very confused Spanish Learning Log

Postby luke » Sun Dec 26, 2021 10:06 pm

ozymandias wrote:
luke wrote:Fernanda del Carpio:
Estaba "reina de Madagascar"

Era (?) (not sure what you wanted to say here) la "reina de Madagascar" en el carnaval de Macondo, y hubo una matanza, en la cual Aureliano Segundo la conoció. Úrsula se ocupó de ella como si fuera su hija. Fernanda regresó a su aldea natal. Aureliano Segundo la estuvo buscando / buscó durante seis meses y la encontró. Después, la llevó a Macondo para ser su esposa.

Thank you again very much for your corrections. On "Era" versus "Estaba". Fernanda was dressed up as the "queen of Madagascar" for the carnaval (parade - not like in the USA, where a carnival is a bunch of rides and "silly games of skill"). But, her parents told her she was a "queen" and they were "immensely wealthy", but that wasn't exactly the case. I chose "estaba", meaning it was her attire, rather than she was royalty. Pienso que "estaba" es lo que quise decir.

You've got me wanting to look up when to use the indefinite article and when it's okay not to. That looks like one of the frequent mistakes I'm making. I'm away visiting family, so my grammar book is not as near as the bookshelf.
luke wrote:Entendimiento del texto
ozymandias wrote:COMPRENSIÓN del texto
Hay dos cosas, que son casi iguales, que me permitieron descifrar el texto y conjuntar (?) (''conjuntar'' doesn't fit here, but I don't know the original meaning you wanted to convey, so I can't give you an alternative)

In English, I would probably say "put together", like you could "put together" a puzzle. No veo un ejemplo de la palabra "puzzle" con "put together" a SpanishDict.com.
ozymandias wrote:Simplemente leyendo el libro por solo me ayudó mucho a comprenderlo. Es decir, sin audios, sin diccionarios, sin distracciones. No es simplemente más tiempo para descifrar las cosas, sino también la visualización de la estructura del texto.

Dos cosas que hice que me divertieron en los últimos días:
1) Leí el texto, leí el texto mientras escuché el audio en inglés. (Dos veces a través del mismo capítulo).
2) Escribí a mano un "plan de estudio" para Cien años de soledad mientras estaba desayunando.

Two things have I've enjoyed doing the last few days:
1) I read the RAE book extensively. I didn't mark unknown words, although if I got "lost", I did go back a bit and re-read to figure out what had just happened.
2) My "plan", once I get back "home", will be to go at the book sequentially, but carefully. I may use multiple modalities for the same chapter or part. E.G., read in Spanish and make notes about things that aren't clear or words that are mysterious. Possibly a few Anki cards for nouns that would be well supported by an image. On walks, may be listening ahead or listening behind my reading, but making notes of what's fuzzy so that I can come back to it. Will use the parallel text to support the RAE book and make corrections if I find them. May shadow some with con Kepa Amuchasetegui for parts that strike my fancy or seem particularly challenging. I'm thinking the best way to do this all is not necessarily to "figure everything out" this time though. Only to keep filling in details and coming up with "long shot" explanations of certain things.

García Márquez has this fascinating way of dropping in a tiny detail, between commas, about some other thread of the story. Those tiny details seem to me to be more than just a clever technique. I think they're integral to how the whole narrative fits together. (That's where I might have been thinking "conjuntar", if I'd been writing this in Spanish).
6 x
: 124 / 124 Cien años de soledad 20x
: 5479 / 5500 5500 pages - Reading
: 51 / 55 FSI Basic Spanish 3x
: 309 / 506 Camino a Macondo

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Re: Luke's very confused Spanish Learning Log

Postby BeaP » Mon Dec 27, 2021 12:58 pm

luke wrote: Así que, quien es el autor y el título de esta obra erudíta que acabó de llegar en su domicilio?

Katalin Kulin: Creación mítica en la obra de García Márquez. Ahora tengo muy poco tiempo para estudiar, pero después de Navidad voy a leer algunos capítulos, y si el libro parece interesante, te lo mando. La escritora era mi profesora en la universidad.
2 x

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Re: Luke's very confused Spanish Learning Log

Postby luke » Tue Dec 28, 2021 2:24 am

BeaP wrote:Katalin Kulin: Creación mítica en la obra de García Márquez. Ahora tengo muy poco tiempo para estudiar, pero después de Navidad voy a leer algunos capítulos, y si el libro parece interesante, te lo mando. La escritora era mi profesora en la universidad.

Muy interesante. ¿Ella fue tu profesora en la literatura española, u otro idioma?

Acabo de cumplir unidad 40 de FSI. Los ejercicios escritos llenaron tres páginas.

Finalmente, terminé las ilustraciones de unidad 47. Esas "presentaciones de patron" han sido más dificiles que había pensado. Unidad 47 tenía un largo ejercicio de más de cinco minutos sobre el imperfecto del subjuntivo. Los próximos entrenamientos no serán tan largos.

Con la respuesta de bella BeaP, empezé a pensar en otro enfoque con Cien años de soledad. Antes de escribir de ese, quisiera mencionar que esta noche leí once páginas en 36.6 minutos. Esto fue aproximadamente cien palabras al minuto. No muy rápido, pero fue una lectura cuidadosa. A propósito, un narrador que habla rapidamente puede decir doscientas palabras al minuto.

La obra tiene 20 capítulos. La narración de Kepa Amuchasetegui divida cada capítulo en 4-7 secciones. Si estudio la primera sección con cuidado, después podría leer o escuchar las otras de manera más relajada. La próxima vez a través del libro, podría estudiar la segunda sección con cuidado, y así sucesivamente.

Si creo solamente diez Anki tarjetas al día, es posible que no me cree una pesadilla de tarjetas.

Very rough translation
I'm interested in what course BeaP had with the author of Creación mítica en la obra de García Márquez.

I finished FSI unit 40 today. Writing the answers to the reading exercises filled 3 pages.

I also finished unit 47 Presentation of Pattern drills on the imperfect, present perfect, and past perfect subjunctives. One of the drills was over 5 minutes, which may seem easy, but with FSI, that's brutal. The Presentation of Pattern drills for units 48-55 are generally shorter. (2 minutes is more typical).

I have an idea how I can keep 100 Years of Solitude on the front burner without burning me out. If I use the Con Kepa Amuchasetegui chapter divisions, each chapter has about 4-7 sections. I can intensively study the first section of a chapter and maybe make a few Anki cards if that seems appropriate and do the rest of the chapter at breakneck speed or listen to it while I'm on a walk. The next time through the book, I can study the 2nd section intensively. This way, I hope not to develop a huge Anki backlog and keep deciphering and enjoying the book.

Tonight chapter 15 is carrying Meme to the convent, in a daze, with the narrator noticing and knowing all. Spellbinding.
3 x
: 124 / 124 Cien años de soledad 20x
: 5479 / 5500 5500 pages - Reading
: 51 / 55 FSI Basic Spanish 3x
: 309 / 506 Camino a Macondo

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Re: Luke's very confused Spanish Learning Log

Postby BeaP » Tue Dec 28, 2021 9:10 am

luke wrote:¿Ella fue tu profesora en la literatura española, u otro idioma?

La profesora me enseñaba literatura española de la Edad Media. Era muy graciosa. A nosotros tenía que hablar en húngaro, y le costaba mucho. Normalmente enseñaba los estudiantes de filología española, no de literatura general.
2 x

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Re: Luke's very confused Spanish Learning Log

Postby luke » Sun Jan 02, 2022 1:10 am

La vuelta
I ran out of gas listening to Spanish and drilling on the way back home. Maybe the speed trap put a damper on things.

But what did I do? Finished CD2 of Using Spanish (lessons 30-60). I'd listened to CD1 on the way up (1-30). I'd consolidated the 4 CDs to 2, because they fit on 2 and that's how I roll.

Only got a handful of drills marked as complete. About 6 or so. That's not much. I can sometimes do that in a 20 minute drive. I was preoccupied by unhappy thoughts.

I listened to some Hugo in 3 months, but have decided I'm better off removing that from my todo list.

I heard a good bit of classic rock that I'd not heard in a very long time.

During the stay, I read chapters 10-19, of Cien años de soledad, which surprised me in many ways. It wasn't on my todo list. That's over 200 pages. It helped get me even more interested in the story.

I read 1 1/2 of the 2 El Quijote Anaya readers, but Cien años kept luring me back.

I didn't add up how many Anki reviews were waiting for me. I did a tiny bit last night after I got back from the 14 hour drive. Over 1000 cards today - almost 3 hours per the Anki stats. Tomorrow I think I'll be caught up. The Anki sessions were split up and many. 30 minutes to 5 minutes or so.

New plans
I got to thinking about focus. Setting shorter term goals. Deciding how to approach "Gabo".

I'd listened to his autobiography at least once taking walks a couple months ago. I've decided Vivir para contarla is the next sensible target. It's in the first person. The first chapter is a great recounting of the impetus and background behind Cien años de soledad. My first "listening" those few months back was plagued with mind wandering, although a few parts stood out. I restarted the listening today. 2 walks. I logged about 2 hours into chapter 1. (The chapters are about 3 hours each).

But I'm liking this new approach. Hit the "rewind 15 seconds button" - often a few times - when I realize my mind has wandered away from thread of the narrative.

I walk slow, by the way. It's really about listening and moving and nature.

So, the "first person" part of the autobiography is good, from a "well rounded" perspective. Also, the background to writing, family, etc, is interesting, and the benefit of the Gabo idiolect.

Although reading is important and helpful, I'm just thinking about listening to the autobiography now. I can imagine going through the book or audiobook again down the road a little bit. My big thing is just to try to get as much from it this time as my capabilities and approach permits. So, the big change is the rewind button, and not so much depending on the multiple times though to gradually let the story seep into my consciousness.

It is January 1, 2022, and although I said I'd talk about short term goals, and limiting them to about 2-3 weeks, I am thinking this will be The Year of Gabo. He's got plenty of great stories, I like his style, and there's that "narrowness" of reading that I believe will continue to be helpful at this point.

Of course, I'm going to continue FSI. Taking advantage of some old CDs, I have for previews, reviews when I'm doing the daily bathing thing. There's the car ride to the place to walk, which generally gives me about 30-40 minutes of drills each day. Will also try to look at the book more and do some study at the desk, mainly to understand things. One nice part about FSI is the concision of the explanations. I've also found the readings, narratives, and dialogues helpful as well. Readings inform me a bit on US policy back in those days and give some insight into the training of FSI officers. I also find them complementary to understanding some of the backdrop for 100 Years of Solitude. Narratives are well crafted for pedagogy. Dialogues tell a fundamental story and become the basis for a lot of drills, etc.

Anki. Going to dial this down a bit in priority/time. It's helpful, especially the cards I've made myself.

As I recall, my first post after my long absence was How many tracks are too many? Seven months later, I'm realizing, if you think it's too many, you're right. :lol:

So, I see fewer progress bars in future signatures, but this is today's:
: 20 / 20 Cien años de soledad (8x)
: 40 / 55 FSI Basic Spanish
: 47 / 55 FSI Presentations of Pattern
: 4414 / 5000 Leyendo 5000 páginas desde junio 14, 2021

I want to write more too, maybe not here in Spanish, but maybe. Writing in general is my primary avenue for "meaningful output" right now.
7 x
: 124 / 124 Cien años de soledad 20x
: 5479 / 5500 5500 pages - Reading
: 51 / 55 FSI Basic Spanish 3x
: 309 / 506 Camino a Macondo

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Re: Luke's very confused Spanish Learning Log

Postby luke » Tue Jan 04, 2022 10:25 pm

Anoche no pude dormir y miré varios videos en youtube. Uno de los buenos fue una entrevista con Julio Cortázar. Me captaron los elogios del entrevistador acerca de la honestidad humana de Cortázar. El canal de YouTube es EDITRAMA. Hay muchas las entrevistas buenas. No se permiten vínculos de sitios remotos, y por eso, les doy el nombre del canal.

Otro canal tuvo éste podcast con Diego Ruzzarin y un joven creativo. Quizás fuera BeaP quien escribió que interacción de este typo, sin guion, es mejor y más realista que un monólogo:



Andando
Son interesantes las anécdotas de Gabriel García Márquez en Vivir para contarla. Esta tarde llevé el libro al restaurante y noté dos palabras para Anki:

la frase fatídica (fateful)
cifras tan exiguas (meager, paltry)


Ayer miré varias entrevistas con Gabriel García Márquez. Ésta fue buena:



Rough recap
Insomnia struck last night. I watched a few YouTube interviews. The EDITRAMA channel has a bunch of restored videos from RTVE.es with new reflections by the interviewer. I watched more than an hour of the Julio Cortázar interview.

Unrelated, and not mentioned above, I watched some interviews with Nobel Prize Winning author Mario Vargas Llosa and noted he's quite articulate. Still haven't figured out how he hurt Gabo's feelings, which may have ended their friendship. Don't need the answer. Just need an open investigation. (Early in the Gabriel García Márquez linked above, the interviewer asks Gabo about Llosa and we just get hurt from his facial expression). Llosa was a good looking man and appears to have come from more privilege than Gabo. Privilege can bring with it some insensitivity and sometimes even some envy.

The Cortázar interview had a very interesting section where he was asked about his writing style and also "what a story means". Definitely worth watching if you're into reading or writing or philosophy.
6 x
: 124 / 124 Cien años de soledad 20x
: 5479 / 5500 5500 pages - Reading
: 51 / 55 FSI Basic Spanish 3x
: 309 / 506 Camino a Macondo

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Re: Luke's very confused Spanish Learning Log

Postby luke » Thu Jan 06, 2022 6:55 pm

FSI 41... done.
The "coffee, no breakfast, walk, cold shower" "secret" did the trick yesterday and today. It got me through the Reading and written answer exercises and that's how I can call 41 done for now.

By the way, I was entertained to piece together my "secret" along with an FSI review "paired sentences" drill that played as I was driving home from my walk, contemplating the reading/writing exercise:

I don't eat until I leam (while I don't leam) my lessons.
Yo no como hasta que no aprendo mis lecciones.

I won't eat until I learn (while I don't learn) my lessons.
Yo no como hasta que no aprenda mis lecciones.

Cien años en la cienaga
Cienaga is sometimes translated as "swamp". It's a common word in Cien años de soledad. I use it in the title here because I like that they both include "cien". That's probably obvious. I mention it though because I do not think of the book as a swamp.

I'm counting this as "trip #9". I've been reading the parallel text out loud. Reading it out loud, not shadowing, gives me time to think and explore. This is perhaps the most "intensive" read yet.

I created a few Anki cards in the last day or so. One delightful one has 4 images of 4 different species of birds. It's one of those cases where I didn't know at least one of the bird names in English. And with birds, sometimes they look different in different parts of the world. Bluebird = azulejo. The image I found didn't look like the ones around where I grew up, but I didn't grow up in Columbia. I chose a columbian bluebird. ;)

azulejo provides examples of several facets of vocabulary. I knew the story was describing a list of birds all along, based on the context. Once I slowed down, "azul" = "blue", became apparent. It ends with 'ejo', which in Esperanto would be a "container of blue". That's a neat notion.

I'm not trying to memorize all the bird names or anything like that. Originally it was just to add a visual to the names, but in the process, petirrojo (robin red breast) and bluebird both landed in my lap.

Vivir para escucharla
Vivir para contarla, the autobiography has become a "listen and shadow" track. I still use the rewind button, but sometimes "repeating aloud" is the trick to focus on the audio. I'm listening to the audiobook, which gave us the title to this section of the log.

Todos los cuentos necesitan ser leidos
Reading extensively is helpful, but I don't do much of it. One of the mind wanderings during today's walk was to put Gabo's Todos los cuentos into an extensive reading track. That might be too much, and I haven't started it yet, so just noting it:

Cien años de soledad - reading intensively
Vivir para contarla - listening extensively
Todos los cuentos - read extensively(?)

Just seeing reading/intensively juxtaposed with listening/extensively helps me see there's some variability going on within those domains.

Reading extensively is different than listening extensively. In general, I'm helped by visuals as well as audibles. Not doing them at the same time increases the sensitivity of the "non-supported" skill. E.G., how a blind person may have a more acute sense of touch. Not sure I feel the "bandwidth" for an extensive reading track right now. It's more work than surfing youtube. Maybe I can "pre-listen" my way into it. I.E., have 2 extensive listening tracks and hit a new cuento now and then to make the first extensive reading a bit easier.

Bars for Posterity
: 3 / 124 Cien años de soledad (9x)
: 305 / 1249 Vivir para contarla (2x)
: 41 / 55 FSI Basic Spanish
: 47 / 55 FSI Presentations of Pattern

Oh, and it also came on me that I might should just do a single "presentation of pattern" drill at a time. I've been generally sort of dabbling in about 3 at a time, but not really focusing enough. If I do one - all the wood behind one arrow - maybe I'll make progress on that track more regularly.
9 x
: 124 / 124 Cien años de soledad 20x
: 5479 / 5500 5500 pages - Reading
: 51 / 55 FSI Basic Spanish 3x
: 309 / 506 Camino a Macondo

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Re: Luke's very confused Spanish Learning Log

Postby luke » Mon Jan 10, 2022 1:52 am

Espero que puedo escribir un poco y no malo mientras eschucho un video en el fondo.

Este no es el video que escucho, pero es uno que quiero mencionar:



Es otra entrevista con Gabriel García Márquez y RTVE.es. Me gusta la interacción entre Márquez y el entrevistador. Un respeto mutuo.

¿Qué pasa?
Esta mañana encontré un artículo con tema como, Lea estos 5 libros de Gabriel García Márquez antes de Cien años de soledad. El título no fue precisamente así, pero con el mágico oculto del sitio web, no fue sencillo guardar el vínculo. Tengo confianza en ustedes y nuestro jefe supremo, Google, que se puede también hallarlo si quisieran.

Una de las 5 obras es Los funerales de la Mamá Grande. Por fortuna, este serio de cuentos está contenido en Todos los cuentos. Escuché las dos primeras historias, La siesta del martes (1963), y Un dia de éstos. Me gustaron. Las escuché durante el paseo de la mañana.

What?
I like to research my pastime in Spanish. This morning, google led me to an article with a title like, '5 books to read before 100 Years of Solitude'. La primera fue Relato de un náufrago. La tercera fue Los funerales de la Mamá Grande. This third suggestion is basically "book 2" in Todos los cuentos, which I have from Audible as well as the hardcover. The first two cuentos, which I listened to this morning were engaging and straight forward. I could hear my Anki cards getting reviewed as the narrator said, atuendos (attire) and a few other words I've picked up from Cien años de soledad.

I enjoyed that, and somehow, these first 2 short stories from "book 2" were easier to focus on than the first couple from "book 1". It's nice hearing familiar words in new contexts.

I've been doing a combination of Listen-Reading and just listening to Vivir para contarla. The translator is Edith Grossman, who I know because she did a Don Quixote translation a few years back. She's good. The combination of idiolect and the one-to-many nature of words/translations gives a deeper appreciation for the translator.

I'm enjoying the intensive reading of Cien años de soledad. Going through it using the divisions Kepa Amuchastegui came up with for his YouTube reading of the book. It's pleasant looking things up and not racing through the reading.

Este fue el video de fondo, y es muy interesante:



The video above was very good and has me interested in the book Vargas Llosa wrote, but I'm currently thinking I'll save it for down the road, as it covers all of Gabo's work up through 100 Years of Solitude, so I'd like to get a feel for everything from the original master before branching out to more abstract or psychoanalytical views (especially if they're taking the "magic" out of "magical realism").

A propósito, creo que tengo una idea sobre la ruptura de la amistad de García Márquez y Vargas Llosa. Creo que García Márquez se sintió una traición personal y honda.

Finalmente, el canál Spanish After Hours me parece buena. Spanish After Hours reminds me of the Dreaming Spanish. She makes input comprehensible with pictures, descriptions, words on the screen, spoken Spanish, etc.
5 x
: 124 / 124 Cien años de soledad 20x
: 5479 / 5500 5500 pages - Reading
: 51 / 55 FSI Basic Spanish 3x
: 309 / 506 Camino a Macondo

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Re: Luke's very confused Spanish Learning Log

Postby luke » Mon Jan 10, 2022 5:50 pm

This is a good channel. I mentioned Spanish After Dark just above when I edited the previous post. It deserves a picture:



It's simple and very well done. If you want to learn like a child, she and Dreaming Spanish can be your Mom and Dad. They're young and want to help. Since both have YouTube channels, you can adjust the speed if it's too slow or you just want to check them out.

I really wanted to write, FSI Unit 42 is done and 43 is underway. There are 55 units in the course, by the way.

Unit 43 is where Platiquemos split the course. When I finish 43, I expect to say, "I'm 6/8's done", and when I finish 45, "I'm 3/4s done", for those of you who like math. The original FSI course has 4 parts. Platiquemos, a rework, split the course into 8.

These little metrics of progress, like finishing a unit, help me stay motivated and connected.

I added Los funerales de la Mamá Grande to the progress bars for posterity:

: 8 / 124 Cien años de soledad (9x)
: 503 / 1249 Vivir para contarla (2x)
: 3 / 8 Los funerales de la Mamá Grande
: 42 / 55 FSI Basic Spanish
: 47 / 55 FSI Illustrations

It has 8 short stories. They go from under 7 minutes to about an hour. Todos los cuentos is actually a combination of 4 books of Gabriel García Márquez' short stories in an "everything" package. Los funerales de la Mamá Grande is the "second" book. Some characters from 100 Years of Solitude are mentioned, as well as Macondo, the central location of Cien años de soledad.

This weekend I enjoyed a fair bit of YouTube, particularly finding out more about the rift between Vargas Llosa and Gabo. I'm still piecing that together, like I am Cien años de soledad. I think it was more personal and grave, from Gabo's perspective, than a couple of hypotheses I've heard (political differences or a woman).

En la segunda entrevista de RTVE.es, la que he vinculado arriba, Gabo dijo algunas cosas que mi dieron cuenta, que sus obras fueron muy, muy personales, y de alguna manera, magíca, como se provino de una musa. El título del libro de Varas Llosa tiene las palabras "un deicido". De eso, pienso, que si alguien tenga un conocimiento amplio del concepto de diós, estoy seguro que Gabo no considería si meme como uno que pudiera matar a Diós. (Musa siendo una diosa).

Y, más que eso, creo que Vargas Llosa pudiera ocultar algunas partes de su investigación, y se acercó de Gabo como amigo. Gabo es un hombre privado. Las secretas que Gabo se hubieran divulgado a Vargas Llosa, como amigo, podrían parecer por el elogimiento de Vargas Llosa meme y no para Gabo.

Pero, quiero leer el libro de Vargas Llosa algún día. El caso no está cerrado.

Can you say that in English and try to make more sense this time?
Here I'll do a more literal translation than I usually do, in case some kind individual decides to give a hand to someone in need. :) No pressure though. Would rather have a reader than a handout.

In the second RTVE.es interview that I linked to above, Gabo said some things that made me think that his works were very, very personal, and in a way, magical, like they came from a muse. The title of the book by Varas Llosa has the words "un deicido" (killer of God). From that, I think that if someone has a broad definition (or understanding) of the concept of God, I'm sure that Gabo wouldn't consider himself to be a killer of God. (A muse is a god and Gabo was grateful for every gift the goddess gave him).

And more than that, I think Vargas Llosa may have hid (or took advantage) some parts of their relationship for his research. He approached Gabo as a friend. Gabo is a very private man. The "secrets" that Gabo may have divulged to Vargas Llosa, as a friend, a fellow writer, were used by Vargas Llosa to benefit himself, not Gabo. (basically a narcissistic motivation on the part of Vargas Llosa AND somewhat competitive AND Gabo felt betrayed, as he wouldn't have been so open with someone who wasn't an intimate friend).

But I want to read the book by Vargas Llosa one day. The case (on the rupture of their friendship) is not closed.
7 x
: 124 / 124 Cien años de soledad 20x
: 5479 / 5500 5500 pages - Reading
: 51 / 55 FSI Basic Spanish 3x
: 309 / 506 Camino a Macondo

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Re: Luke's very confused Spanish Learning Log

Postby Cerebral_Arbitrage » Tue Jan 11, 2022 2:57 pm

Interesting discussion about Gabo, Llosa and their estrangement. I also find these historical mysteries fascinating.
2 x
365 Day Challenge: 0 / 365
PFC - Daily Vocabulary Review: 0 / 365
PFC - Read 500 pages: 0 / 500
PFC - Watch 120 hours of video: 0 / 7200


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