Kelvin's RU, JP, ESP log <- In this order

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woshijiajun
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Re: JP, EN, ESP log: I thought life would be easier but no....

Postby woshijiajun » Mon Jan 04, 2021 9:02 pm

kelvin921019 wrote:the importance of audio
Today I stubbled upon a sentence in Tobira like this
世界で一番インスタントラーメンをたくさん食べる国は中国451.7億食、
I just can't figure out why で is used here and flip through some grammar books but the closest one I can come up with is "continuation" (something like "and"). Then I checked with the audio and turn out I'm right because there's a rather obvious pause after the で
世界で一番インスタントラーメンをたくさん食べる国は中国で[Pause]451.7億食、

One thing I find it more and more useful in understanding Japanese writing is the accompanying audio. The stress and tone are really helpful in breaking down the sentence and understanding the context.

I think as native Chinese speakers we definitely have an advantage here. Even though Japanese isn't tonal there's definitely a different use of tone than in English with the pitch accent system.

I remember when I studied Japanese class in university, it kind of went over the western students heads a little when the teacher tried to explain it. Me and the other Chinese students didn't really struggle with it as much. Although pitch accent aside, we all did have our own pronunciation issues depending on our backgrounds. :lol:
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kelvin921019
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Re: JP, EN, ESP log: I thought life would be easier but no....

Postby kelvin921019 » Tue Jan 05, 2021 11:00 am

woshijiajun wrote:I'm doing much better thanks! Luckily it wasn't the virus! :lol:
I'm glad I was able to be helpful to you before :) I like seeing more people in HK learn Spanish! It's such a fun and expressive language, it's a shame more people don't want to learn it.

Great to hear from you haha! I can't stress more on the world I have opened with Spanish. I have so much fun watching videos in Spanish on youtube and to be honest I have learnt much more about the world. To be honest language indeed is a barrier to our understanding of certain part of the world. Though now the process is painfully long (because I have to pause and re-watch certain parts until I understand to a decent extent)

woshijiajun wrote:It seems we like to read the same materials a lot! Let's swap recommendations some time! :D I just finished updating my Kindle now too. So full of books that I don't know where to start. I'm often guilty of reading stuff in parallel even though I know I shouldn't and I was always taught not to :lol:

My upcoming reading in Spanish (likely for 2021) would be:
- Harry Potter (currently 12/17 chapters)
- Sapien (continue with a few more chapters)
- Corázon tan blanco (I found this book when I was doing B2 exam practice)
- La sombra del viento
I have the physical copy of the last 2 books and perhaps I will just use them as shelf decoration and go read the Kindle version instead.
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woshijiajun
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Re: JP, EN, ESP log: I thought life would be easier but no....

Postby woshijiajun » Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:30 pm

kelvin921019 wrote:My upcoming reading in Spanish (likely for 2021) would be:
- Harry Potter (currently 12/17 chapters)
- Sapien (continue with a few more chapters)
- Corázon tan blanco (I found this book when I was doing B2 exam practice)
- La sombra del viento
I have the physical copy of the last 2 books and perhaps I will just use them as shelf decoration and go read the Kindle version instead.

Ok then I am sure we have very similar tastes now in books! :lol: I have read all of those apart from the last one, which I decided randomly I would like to read in Catalan since it's set in Barcelona (even though Ruiz Zafón wrote it in Spanish originally). Only because I am planning a possible move to Barcelona in the coming months when all the restrictions hopefully ease. It's pretty good so far!
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kelvin921019
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Re: JP, EN, ESP log: I thought life would be easier but no....

Postby kelvin921019 » Thu Jan 07, 2021 1:32 pm

Status check

As you may aware, I am kind of an exam freak. I just want to keep testing myself on whether I have reached the desired level yet. So...I did a quick N2 test (https://www.jlpt.jp/samples/sample09.html) as a diagnosis to see how far I'm from N2, so that I can see whether I should aim at N2 or just stay with N3 in the coming July. I did that 2009 practice test, which presumably is a water-downed version of the official test. Surprisingly:
Listening: 4/5
Grammar: I skipped it
Reading: 9/10
Vocabulary: 10/12
It's much better than I expected. Especially for the reading and vocabulary part, tho I just cheat through a lot of words using Chinese. I am also satisfied with my reading speed. Perhaps due to my constant contact with Japanese, it is less frustrating then Spanish tbh. As to listening, I would extend my gratitude to my 10+ years of being a fan to Japanese culture. So....it's the vocab and grammar which I need to work on the most. In any event, I think N2 in coming July is a rather realistic goal for me.
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kelvin921019
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Re: JP, EN, ESP log: I thought life would be easier but no....

Postby kelvin921019 » Fri Jan 08, 2021 5:57 pm

Japanese: back to be a (out-of-control) Japanese fan
Instead of talking about my progress on Japanese, I just briefly talked about the things I (once again) indulge in:
- Music-wise, I am recently very into a music group called YOASOBI. I just repeatedly play their music, watch their interview, their radio show (I think I can understand 30-50% without subs, 70% with subs and dictionary), as well as their performance on 紅白(the NHK year end megashow).
- Series, Anime - I am re-watching 魔法科高校の劣等生 (with L1 subtitle) (S1 and S2). I watch it for pure personal enjoyment but I can focus more on the language. I randomly add words which caught my attention into Anki
- TV program - there are a lot of interview, talk show on youtube (tho without sub). They are just interesting enough for killing time and usually one can infer most of the context just by action and subtitles so it doesn't confuse so much even I can only comprehend 30-50% of the content

Spanish
- I'm reading Harry Potter. This is the only thing I keep reading. Apart from that, I sometimes read El Pais or La Nacion
- Apart from that, my daily listening task comes from the 10 mins news of RTVE or FOCO podcast. It is rather useful to use a L2 as your source of international news as you have the "back story" to understand the context.
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kelvin921019
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Re: JP, EN, ESP log: I thought life would be easier but no....

Postby kelvin921019 » Tue Jan 12, 2021 4:07 am

Japanese: Tobira
Spanish: Maintenance
English: Objective Proficiency


Spanish (and some English?)
I think I have been too demanding to myself in terms of Spanish listening level. Yesterday I was watching some random interview of people on street in Spanish and I was really disappointed that I could only understand what the professionals (i.e. the news anchor, the interviewer, the narrator etc) say but almost never actors, interviewees, normal people.

Then yesterday I listened to an interview of an England football player and an interview with a famous rocker Ozzy Osbourne. I realize that even I have a hard time understanding certain accents in English without devoting 100% attention. Then I guess perhaps I'm not as weak as I thought in Spanish listening. I may focus more on documentaries / youtube videos first and only when I have sufficient cultural and language knowledge I shift to TV series.
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kelvin921019
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Re: JP, EN, ESP log: I thought life would be easier but no....

Postby kelvin921019 » Thu Jan 14, 2021 4:54 pm

Japanese: Tobira
Spanish: Maintenance
English: Objective Proficiency


Japanese
One challenge of watching Japanese anime / show is that there's no subtitles in Japanese. So I used to watch anime with chinese subtitles and to be honest it's not helping much my japanese. On the other hand, needless to say it's difficult to watch JP shows without subs at all. I tried to watch BEASTARS on Netflix cos my favourite band (current) YOASOBI plays their theme song for season 2.

My comprehension rate is between 30-80% with subs so that's a good sign and I just randomly insert some new words into Anki. In view of the review hell, I may soon stop the "Genki review" deck (basically translating Genki's dialogues from L1 to L2) after this week.

I also realized that there are around 30% of N3 grammar missed in Tobira book after comparing it with NKZM. I think I have made the correct decision not to plunge straight into NKZM N2.

Log update
I wished to do a grand summary of my study (method / cost etc) in my previous log but I simply didn't have the mood to do it. I think I will make use of the chinese new year holiday (mid Feb) to write a short summary of my 1-year journey.
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tungemål
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Re: JP, EN, ESP log: I thought life would be easier but no....

Postby tungemål » Thu Jan 14, 2021 5:58 pm

kelvin921019 wrote:I think I have been too demanding to myself in terms of Spanish listening level. Yesterday I was watching some random interview of people on street in Spanish and I was really disappointed that I could only understand what the professionals (i.e. the news anchor, the interviewer, the narrator etc) say but almost never actors, interviewees, normal people.

Then yesterday I listened to an interview of an England football player and an interview with a famous rocker Ozzy Osbourne. I realize that even I have a hard time understanding certain accents in English without devoting 100% attention. Then I guess perhaps I'm not as weak as I thought in Spanish listening. I may focus more on documentaries / youtube videos first and only when I have sufficient cultural and language knowledge I shift to TV series.


I find that spoken Spanish can be rather tough to understand, and especially TV-series. Maybe it's because of the approximant sounds in Spanish. If you can follow TV and radio reporters, then I'd say your listening comprehension is good. Anyway, to practice listening the youtube channel "Easy Spanish" could be beneficial. They always interview people on the street.

Did you write somewhere about your Spanish B2 test? I would be interested to hear about your experience.
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kelvin921019
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Re: JP, EN, ESP log: I thought life would be easier but no....

Postby kelvin921019 » Fri Jan 15, 2021 3:23 am

tungemål wrote:I find that spoken Spanish can be rather tough to understand, and especially TV-series. Maybe it's because of the approximant sounds in Spanish. If you can follow TV and radio reporters, then I'd say your listening comprehension is good. Anyway, to practice listening the youtube channel "Easy Spanish" could be beneficial. They always interview people on the street.

Did you write somewhere about your Spanish B2 test? I would be interested to hear about your experience.

Thank you! I have been trying "Easy Spanish" but I think they lied on the "Easy" part :D I usually watched RTVE 10 minutes news and usually I can grasp the general idea of a news on the 2nd or 3rd run if I devote my attention to it. Interestingly, I find some reporters easier to understand than the others and some accents (Spanish and Rioplatense) easier to understand than the others (of course provided that they are spoken clearly).

Spanish B2 test was pretty tough to me and I think I should have failed the test as I performed rather badly in the listening part. I think my reading should be enough to compensate the writing task but oral should not be enough to compensate the listening part.

I did oral in the morning and reading -> listening -> writing in the afternoon non-stop. It was mentally exhausting as there was only a short break between listening and writing task but frankly the weather is so cold that day that the short break wasn't helping at all.

I performed exceptionally well (much better than a marginal fail) in oral as I though I would be struggling. I was a bit nervous as it was my first time talking in Spanish face-to-face in my whole life. Somehow I calmed myself down pretty quickly and the examiner in the end asked me how long had I learn Spanish and he replied "interesante, interesante" after hearing that I self-studied and havn't taken any formal classes.

The reading and listening share the same answer book so I had all the right to prepare myself with the listening questions when the invigilators were preparing the audio. I think my mind had already been exhausted after the reading test and I struggled to focus in listening. The Listening test was sinfully difficult in the usual sadist DELE style. There can be questions where I fully understand the audio but still failed to figure out the correct answer. I just hope that I get somewhere near a marginal fail so that my oral performance can compensate for it.

Writing task is okay but I think I underperformed. For some reason we were required to use a black pen to do the task but we were not allowed to using any correctional fluid / tape so I crossed out quite a lot of words when I was polishing my work. I hoped that the marker can recognize my handwriting.

In hindsight, I think I would perform much better if I had chosen to take the May 2021 one instead. I rushed myself to complete the preparation books so much that I became a bit fatigue right before the exam. I may also write some comment on the materials I have used later. To be honest, the quality of even the best preparation books are a bit disappointing.
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kelvin921019
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Language Log: https://forum.language-learners.org/vie ... 15&t=16306
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Re: JP, EN, ESP log: I thought life would be easier but no....

Postby kelvin921019 » Mon Jan 18, 2021 4:16 pm

Japanese: Tobira
Spanish: Maintenance
English: Objective Proficiency


One thing that makes me イライラする (irritated) now is that language study have eaten up basically most of my leisure time so I don't really have a chance to read things in my TL apart from for language learning purpose. On the other hand, my vocabulary in Japanese isn't enough for reading anything too meaning in Japanese apart from those water-downed materials. Apparently a prolonged A2 hell is something that starts to irritate me as I basically flied through this hell in Spanish in 3-4 months.

Out of interest I tried a real JLPT N2 dokkai paper again and manage to finish all readings in 50 mins with 2 wrong (19/21). I think I will try a few more dokkai and cyoukai so as to reassure myself that my reading and listening level for Japanese is enough (and therefore no need to invest so much on these but focus on Grammar and vocab).

I promised myself that I should focus on causal reading after N2 exam but I start to from time to time have a rush of feeling that I want to do a third language. I think I need to try harder to suppress this feeling.

P.S. as to 魔法科高校の劣等生, I didn't drop it. I simply finished it at a rate of 5-6 episodes 1 night. :lol: :lol: :lol:
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