Perseverance - learn to stay motivated in language, learning and life

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kelvin921019
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Re: Perseverance - learn to stay motivated in language, learning and life

Postby kelvin921019 » Wed Oct 21, 2020 3:57 am

tai wrote:In addition, I feel a bit reluctant to start Language Transfer lessons, after filling up commute hours with Assimil and lunch hours with Glossika. Maybe I have not found a time period dedicated to it yet. In fact, I have not touched it for a week, but pleasantly surprised when I hit lessons 21 and 22 last Friday, as the content start to reinforce the verb tenses.

....

I feel like there is nothing to be proud of sharing and so have been feeling uneasy towards writing a log here, a forum full of successful learners who would describe their advanced level issues rather than beginners' issues like mine. Anyway, some thoughts:.

Hi there, it's me again :lol:

Just wanna drop by and tell you not to worry about writing about "beginners' issues", which I think is in fact constitute a big part of the language logs here. If I remember correctly, I think most of my log is me whining about how tough the process is, together with my constant frustration and worries. It is useful to channel out your frustrations and worries here because the other members here will give you timely encouragement and practical advice which may be of help.

My experience of Assimil (2014, which is a water down version of yours) is that its difficulties will ramp up a lot as you progress. It's like flying a hot air balloon that in order to progress I have to constantly off-load other resources in order to maintain my Assimil routine. I think I off-loaded Glossika and some japanese studies in order to make way for Assimil. Hope it helps!
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tai
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Re: Perseverance - learn to stay motivated in language, learning and life

Postby tai » Wed Oct 21, 2020 11:03 am

tangleweeds wrote:Really, there are all kinds of us, and I enjoy reading all kinds of logs. I feel like my log is an endless repeat of getting started on something interesting, getting derailed by health issues, and forgetting most of it, repeat, repeat, repeat. I would get discouraged, only I do notice how much faster/better I re-learn what seemed to have been forgotten.
I appreciate your sharing of your experience a lot, tangleweeds. Sometimes it's easy to feel like I have forgotten the stuff right after closing the book. I don't know if there will be any feeling of "ah-ha I got it" revelation or not, like when one has finally made sense of a mathematical theorem, when it comes to language learning. Coming from a science subject training background seems to have lured me to search for and gauge my own understanding by the presence of that kind of feeling.

tangleweeds wrote:Pimsleur certainly emphasizes that actually speaking when prompted during their audio courses is key to successful learning.
I will try to find a sustainable and affordable option to try Pimsleur again - I tried the first 2 or 3 lessons for free once but it was noticeably slow. Anyway, thanks! :D
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I hope I can successfully learn something this time.
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tai
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Re: Perseverance - learn to stay motivated in language, learning and life

Postby tai » Wed Oct 21, 2020 11:26 am

kelvin921019 wrote:My experience of Assimil (2014, which is a water down version of yours) is that its difficulties will ramp up a lot as you progress. It's like flying a hot air balloon that in order to progress I have to constantly off-load other resources in order to maintain my Assimil routine. I think I off-loaded Glossika and some japanese studies in order to make way for Assimil. Hope it helps!
Thanks and I like your analogy of off-loading weights to fly a balloon. :lol: That has really summarized it well.

The Assimil difficulty does feel ramping up fast to me. Now I am at Lesson 45 and can't imagine 5 days later I will be doing the active wave already. Just bring it on! :D
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I hope I can successfully learn something this time.
Assimil Spanish with Ease: 43 / 109
Language Transfer: 50 / 90

tai
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Re: Perseverance - learn to stay motivated in language, learning and life

Postby tai » Wed Oct 21, 2020 12:58 pm

A bit of notes taking for myself...
By coincidence, I have come across a recent talk by Lýdia Machová: 9 Practical Lessons from Learning 9 Languages from Polyglot Gathering Online 2020. Speaking has been highlighted as one of the key takeaways for the audience.

Let me type out Lýdia Machová's 9 lessons...
1. I don't need to wait till I'm advanced to use authentic resources!
2. A systematic plan can do wonders in a few weeks!
3. Language learning is a lot faster when the materials and methods are fun.
4. The only way to learn a language well is to speak it a lot (even more so with similar languages!).
5. It may not always be the perfect time to learn a language. (And it's okay!)
6. You must achieve comfortable fluency in order not to lose the language.
7. Language learning is fun when you think of it as a decoding game.
8. It pays off to work on your language, the results will show later!
9. The beginnings are always difficult, but don't give up!

And, if I may add, also from the talk itself, focus on the parts that are known but not the mistakes.

In summary...
Have Fun - enjoy and stay motivated
Have a lot of Contact - get as much exposure as possible
Have effective Methods
Have a System - be accountable and organized

Methods is the hardest one!

She mentioned reading Harry Porter in target language. It looks like I should find an interesting book to read in Spanish at some point. Or TV with bilingual subtitles.

Edit: Fixed typos.
Last edited by tai on Thu Oct 22, 2020 5:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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I hope I can successfully learn something this time.
Assimil Spanish with Ease: 43 / 109
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tangleweeds
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Re: Perseverance - learn to stay motivated in language, learning and life

Postby tangleweeds » Wed Oct 21, 2020 7:20 pm

tai wrote:I don't know if there will be any feeling of "ah-ha I got it" revelation or not, like when one has finally made sense of a mathematical theorem, when it comes to language learning. Coming from a science subject training background seems to have lured me to search for and gauge my own understanding by the presence of that kind of feeling.
One of my ever-shifting/melding college majors was math, and I will say that I do actually get that aha! feeling working with syntax/grammar--except of course for those pesky exceptions language is far more prone to than math. This is probably why I enjoy linguistics as the meta-study of how languages tend to work.

tai wrote:Pimsleur certainly emphasizes that actually speaking when prompted during their audio courses is key to successful learning. I will try to find a sustainable and affordable option to try Pimsleur again - I tried the first 2 or 3 lessons for free once but it was noticeably slow
I'm poor, but fortunately my library still has a wide range of Pimsleur on CD, and I still have an old laptop with optical drive, rip rip.

I also find the first lessons painfully slow when trying to get up to speed with a language I've already studied a bit, and taking long walks to burn through a couple of lessons per day until I find my place has helped--once I find my place, I can stay on a single lesson for a couple of days.

Thanks for your lecture notes, btw--super helpful! I find the "decoding game" view, while unfashionably translation-oriented, is especially appealing as a math/computer geek.
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Dr Mack Rettosy
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Re: Perseverance - learn to stay motivated in language, learning and life

Postby Dr Mack Rettosy » Thu Oct 22, 2020 2:25 pm

Hello tai,

I wanted to reach out because many things you have said resonate with me.

About the challenges of writing, I think any good writer will agree that the writing process is uncomfortable. Words never faithfully transfer your thoughts and often much editing is needed to "re-shape" the writing closer to your "true" thoughts. For what it's worth, I think your writing is quite good. You express your ideas clearly and your English is excellent! Stay consistent and you can only improve!

Regarding the reading of language logs, I quite agree. Reading other's experience gives a vicarious sensation of having taken their journey for yourself. I've found producing in the mornings when fresh (active learning, writing, etc) and then consuming (watching, listening, reading) in the evenings when tired works well. It's all about balance between production and consumption. I think you are off to a good start with your own journal, and looking forward to seeing you progress!
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Re: Perseverance - learn to stay motivated in language, learning and life

Postby lingua » Thu Oct 22, 2020 4:19 pm

The log is what you make of it. For me it's the best part of this forum. It's completely changed the way I study. It has also caused me to add too many languages. I was perfectly happy with Italian only for years though I always had in mind to learn Latin and return to German someday. And now I'm tackling a few more.

I appreciate the different writing styles and get something out of all of them. Your log is for you so you should write about what you find useful.
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tai
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Re: Perseverance - learn to stay motivated in language, learning and life

Postby tai » Fri Nov 06, 2020 10:19 am

Last 2 weeks I have been busy with work, the project work in the job eating into my evenings and weekends.

Reading fellow forum members replying to this thread helped me keep logging.

My progress was not good in these 2 weeks. And then I decided to repeat the second half of the passive phase of Assimil in this period to make myself more comfortable.

The familiar dialogs are easier for my auditory cortex to pick up words from the speech stream. I’m also thinking to count my study time to Spanish each day so that instead of seeing myself repeating the same lessons, I can have some alternative measures.

On a side note, I have received the books Modern Tibetan Language vol. 1 and 2, and they come with CDs! I bought it online from an Italian bookstore called Oriental Books. They would be a great addition to my collection. I think I will have some difficulty in deciding my next language, but the decision won’t be now as I need to learn how to learn a language by doing Spanish first.
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I hope I can successfully learn something this time.
Assimil Spanish with Ease: 43 / 109
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tangleweeds
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Re: Perseverance - learn to stay motivated in language, learning and life

Postby tangleweeds » Fri Nov 06, 2020 7:51 pm

tai wrote:I have received the books Modern Tibetan Language vol. 1 and 2, and they come with CDs! I bought it online from an Italian bookstore called Oriental Books.
Ooh! Ooh! Ooh! Thank you! I had never even considered Tibetan, but now those are on my languages wish list too! :twisted:

tai wrote:I’m also thinking to count my study time to Spanish each day so that instead of seeing myself repeating the same lessons, I can have some alternative measures.
This is not a bad idea. Repeating stuff you feel shaky on is not lack of progress, and keeping track of time can help a self-critical brain digest that fact. I use a timer in my language study spreadsheet, when I purposefully sit down to study, at least. Lately I've been getting sucked into things unexpectedly, which makes timekeeping difficult, but it's a sign of healthy intrinsic motivation.

Dr Mack Rettosy wrote:I think any good writer will agree that the writing process is uncomfortable. Words never faithfully transfer your thoughts and often much editing is needed to "re-shape" the writing closer to your "true" thoughts.
So very true! (she said, warily eying her Drafts box full of unworthy unposted log updates)
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Ho-hum, waiting for the latest neurological relapse to pass.
Study tips for (mental) invalids welcome!

tai
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Re: Perseverance - learn to stay motivated in language, learning and life

Postby tai » Sun Nov 29, 2020 12:53 pm

Most of November turned out to be a very busy period for me professionally and the new colleague joining the team in work caused me a lot of tension to the people dynamics in my work project and long hours in saving the situation. I suffered from insomnia and low energy for weeks. That has shifted away my energy from my daily study in Spanish.

During this period I could only maintain re-listening to the Assimil and Glossika materials already studied so far. I have repeated Assimil 1-49 once. I hope it will help to sink in a bit more.

Situation at work has now improved a bit and seeing that I have “run out of” Assimil review lessons, I will continue progressing with Spanish.
2 x
I hope I can successfully learn something this time.
Assimil Spanish with Ease: 43 / 109
Language Transfer: 50 / 90


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