Learning Japanese From Zero

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golyplot
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Re: Learning Japanese from zero by listening

Postby golyplot » Sun Oct 23, 2022 5:03 am

Tonight, a little over a week after ragequitting JPDB and deleting all my decks, I decided to give it another try, but a little differently than before. I manaually created decks for each of the completed stories that I've already read on Satori Reader (Akiko, Hole in the Wall, Kiki-Mimi Radio, Kona's Big Adventure, Meditation, Oku-Nikkou, S&S Long Distance Relationship, and The River Sanzu - plus I plan make a partial deck for The Jam Maker (partial as it is still ongoing) tomorrow). I figured that if I'm only studying words in stories I've already read on SR, it might not be so bad.

It looks like it's going to take me quite a while just to get through these though. In fact, even at the start, without doing any new cards, I already had a review pile of 207 cards! Presumably, deleting all your decks doesn't actually delete your review history, so if you had previously studied a word, and then later you come back and add a new deck with that word, it will pop right back up in your review queue.

Unfortunately, despite the words theoretically being only somewhat familiar ones now, it still takes forever to get through the reviews. In my initial review session tonight, I only made it through 14 reviews in 5 minutes!

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golyplot
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Re: Learning Japanese from zero by listening

Postby golyplot » Mon Oct 24, 2022 3:57 am

As mentioned, I created a partial (up to ch18, the latest published - I accidentally wrote 19 in the screenshot) deck for The Jam Maker on JPDB today, which of course added some more reviews to the pile and also bumped up my known words and new cards. I also did four more JPDB review sessions today (5min each like usual, so 20m total) and got the review pile down to "only" 168. Obviously, this is still going to take a while.

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Of course, the main reason that I decided to try only studying words from stories I've read on SR on JPDB this time around is not just because I've read the stories and thus theoretically have seen the words before. After all, it's not like I actually remember much about stories I've read a while ago, let along every single word.

The real reason is because I figured that whenever I see a troublesome word, I can just look it up and find the context(s) it appeared in in SR and see the human translation (and sometimes annotations) to understand it better in context, something which is not possible when studying words from sources outside of SR. I looked up a bunch of such words today.

One example is くれぐれも, a word that has always troubled me. I looked up where it appeared in Satori Reader in Hole in the Wall ch16 and saw a note explaining that the usual dictionary definitions are not actually correct and that it really means strong advice or admonition, so now I know (again).

It turns out that I actually wrote about this last month but had forgotten about that completely. Although, looking back, what is really interesting is to see the note I had quoted there, from where it appears in News.

Usually, Satori Reader will re-use the same note whenever something appears in multiple stories, but it appears that in this case, they wrote different notes. For reference, when くれぐれも appears in Hole in the Wall, they have the following explanation:

The word kure-gure-mo can be a little hard to get your mind around, since the English definitions in the dictionary don't always seem to fit precisely.
The reason that the dictionary gives the definition as "repeatedly; sincerely; earnestly" is because this phrase comes before some warning or entreaty that the speaker wishes to convey strongly. It might help to think of it as meaning, "I urge you earnestly" or "no matter what you do."
Here's a common sentence you'll hear it in:
くれぐれも体に気を付けてください。
I urge you to please take care of yourself.
In the episode, Chuuya's dad is pressing the point: Maybe it worked out this time, but no matter what you do / I urge you earnestly, be careful of humans.



While the note I quoted before from News says

The kuregure mo on the front is an adverb that literally means "earnestly" or "sincerely," but it often comes before some well-intentioned admonition. Think of it as meaning "Take all good care and (do such-and-such)" or "Be very careful and ..."
Therefore, the above means "One wants to take every care to ensure that they don't come off at a critical moment."



An example of looking up a troublesome word that didn't go so well was ついている. After checking SR, I concluded that its inclusion in the decks was just a misparse and removed it (which is why you can see the word count for the Akiko deck go down by 1 from the screenshot yesterday).
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golyplot
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Re: Learning Japanese from zero by listening

Postby golyplot » Tue Oct 25, 2022 2:54 pm

Last night, I finally read the last chapter of News on Satori Reader and added a News deck on JPDB, bumping up the pile quite a bit. I've been doing a bunch of JPDB sessions lately, but still currently have 156 reviews pending (and 2710 new cards for once I get through those). I wonder if I can finish learning the words from SR on JPDB before I finish reading all the stories on JPDB. My guess is no.

Also, I finished reading いつも通りの日常で、、君からすれば ch14 last night.
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golyplot
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Re: Learning Japanese from zero by listening

Postby golyplot » Thu Oct 27, 2022 2:42 pm

Saw a useful seeming grammar note on SR yesterday. I'm pretty sure I've seen this before, but it doesn't count if you don't remember it, so seeing it again helps.

彼と会うことはなかった
You might wonder why the narrator uses this pattern instead of simply saying awanakatta, "She didn't encounter him."
The pattern <phrase ending in informal present> koto ga aru means "there are occasions when <phrase>." So, for example:
彼と会うことがある。
There are occasions when I encounter/meet with him.
This pattern usually implies that the occurrence is not frequent, but not extremely rare, either. Sometimes a word like tokidoki might be inserted before aru to adjust the frequency, but the underlying idea is of something that recurs at some interval.
When used in the negative, the sense is not simply that the scenario does not occur on one particular occasion, but that there are no occasions on which it happens, even though there are many opportunities.
Here, Kyouko tries for a full week to encounter the man, and there was not even one occasion on which she did.
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CDR
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Re: Learning Japanese from zero by listening

Postby CDR » Thu Oct 27, 2022 6:28 pm

golyplot wrote:Saw a useful seeming grammar note on SR yesterday. I'm pretty sure I've seen this before, but it doesn't count if you don't remember it, so seeing it again helps.


I just saw this as a flashcard! Great to know it is used somewhere other then my flashcards/JLPT :lol:. It did not describe the meaning of the construct when it is negative however, so thank you for sharing.
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golyplot
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Re: Learning Japanese from zero by listening

Postby golyplot » Fri Oct 28, 2022 4:11 am

Way back in late August when I was listening to 4989 American Life, I remember in ep115 when she was talking about the Golden Gate Bridge, I heard her say "tenji" a couple times, which was odd, since I thought it meant braille, but I figured maybe she was commenting on braille signs at the bridge or something. I noted it down to check the transcript later (well, the main reason was actually to find vocabulary to talk about the Golden Gate bridge, since I was embarrassed in my first iTalki lesson when asked about local tourist attractions and barely managed a comment about Muir Woods), but I didn't get actually get around to it until tonight, two months later.

It turns out that it was just a homophone, and she actually said 展示物, which means something like "exhibits".

残念だったのが、私どこに行ってもビジターセンターに行って展示物見たりするのが好きなんですけど、あとそのビジターセンターに併設されたお土産屋さんを見るのも好きなんですけど、


I did encounter one interesting new word in the process - kuguru, to pass under (as she mentioned a tanker passing under the bridge).


Also, I finished watching The Promised Neverland on Netflix tonight. I highly recommend it. It constantly has you on the edge of your seat, wondering how they are possibly going to escape.

Or at least I finished watching the first season, which is all Netflix has. Afterwards, I looked up spoilers, since I was still confused about some stuff, like the significance of Krone's pen. It turns out that the anime actually has two seasons. However, the second season is apparently very bad and fans like to pretend it only has one season, so I guess it's for the best that Netflix doesn't have the second season.
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golyplot
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Re: Learning Japanese from zero by listening

Postby golyplot » Fri Oct 28, 2022 12:56 pm

I woke up at 5:10 this morning and couldn't fall back asleep, and got up at 5:31 to get on the computer and watch another Booktuber Belle video to try to make myself sleepy so I can go back to sleep. That's happened a lot recently, as I previously mentioned, but not in over a week, so it's a bit frustrating to see it happening again.

Anyway, at one point Belle goes to a bookstore and it sounded like she said "tenji" presumably referring to the display of books, much like my previous post. It's always interesting how you encounter something and then start seeing it everywhere.

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golyplot
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Re: Learning Japanese from zero by listening

Postby golyplot » Sat Oct 29, 2022 6:01 am

Tonight, I started watching Romantic Killer, a new anime on Netflix. The review I checked said it had a distasteful premise and recommended skipping it, but I figured I might as well try it, since I'm not sure what else to watch after finishing The Promised Neverland.

The premise is that introverted high school girl Anzu, who has never experienced romance in her life, is cursed by an evil fairy to live in a real-life Otome game until she falls in love. Modern Western sensibilities would likely play it as psychological horror, but I have a strong suspicion that the anime will end up as a straight romance with Anzu eventually falling in love in spite of herself.

Anyway, there was another interesting coincidence. Yesterday, I read an article in The Economist, talking about the concept of ikigai and how Western self-help peddlers are using it to cloak themselves in Eastern mysticism while actual Japanese people are bemused because the term is rarely used in Japan and when they do, it is just for small joys. Therefore, I was surprised to hear "ikigai" in the very first scene of Romance Killer tonight.

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golyplot
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Re: Learning Japanese from zero by listening

Postby golyplot » Sun Oct 30, 2022 5:53 am

I encountered a new word in Romantic Killer today: 変質者.

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Also interesting is that there was a comment in ep2 about idiots not getting sick. I remember that in The Promised Neverland, at one point someone made a comment about idiots not getting sick as well (the flashback with Emma and Norman, IIRC). At the time, I assumed it was just a joke, but seeing the same thing in two different shows makes me suspect that it is some common superstition in Japanese culture that I hadn't heard of before.

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Another interesting SR note:

見つかる・見当たる

These words both appear in this article, and mean very similar things, so you might wonder about the difference.
Mitsukaru is the intransitive cousin to the transitive mitsukeru, "to find." It's intransitive, so you don't mitsukaru something, it just mitsukarus on its own. But, crucially, with mitsukaru/mitsukeru, actual searching is going on. So if you say:

鍵が見つかった!
My keys turned up!

...the keys are spoken of as simply "turning up" spontaneously, but the reason they turned up is that someone was looking for them. One imagines a person looking in the usual spots, turning over couch cushions, looking under the bed, etc.
Miataru is similar in that something "comes into view" or "becomes visible" spontaneously, but it feels slightly more passive. The amount of work implied stops at perhaps the level of visually surveying the landscape.
In our story, notice that the narrator uses miataru to refer to Kouhei's visual scanning, and mitsukaru when he goes to search more thoroughly.


Also

飛ばされたとしても

The pattern <sentence ending in past tense verb> to suru means "to suppose <sentence>" in the sense of entertaining a hypothetical scenario. For example:

彼女が今電話したとしましょう。
Let's suppose she called right now.

Here, Kouhei says "even if we suppose it was blown away" or "even supposing that it was blown away."


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Also, here's a graph of my first week back at JPDB:

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golyplot
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Re: Learning Japanese from zero by listening

Postby golyplot » Mon Oct 31, 2022 4:08 pm

Saturday night, I once again woke up early and couldn't sleep and got up and watched two Booktuber Belle videos before going back to bed. It's frustrating how often that happens nowadays. Sunday night, I woke up and had trouble sleeping, but I just lay in bed until I fell asleep again instead of getting on the computer.

Anyway, I learned that a live action movie "Whisper of the Heart" is coming out in Japan, an adaptation of the same manga as the famous 1995 animated Ghibli film. (Not that I've seen either). Pretty much all Japanese media that makes it to the west is anime (or videogames), so it was a bit jarring to see the trailer for a live action Japanese movie.


In other news, I looked up "mousei" and saw that it was listed as "serious reflection; soul-searching; penitence" on Jisho, which seems quite a bit stronger than the "remorseful" it was actually translated as in the subtitles here. The "Remorseful: to be filled with remorse" in the subtitles sounds pretty silly.
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Also in an interesting coincidence, the kanji 規 and 準 both came up within three reviews of each other on Wanikani yesterday morning (and I burned both).
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