Caromarlyse’s log (French/German/Portuguese/Russian/Welsh)

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Caromarlyse
Green Belt
Posts: 387
Joined: Fri Dec 06, 2019 2:31 pm
Languages: English (N), French (C1-ish), German (B2/C1-ish), Russian (B1-ish), Portuguese (B1-ish), Welsh (complete beginner), Spanish (in hibernation)
(All levels estimates and given as a guide only)
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Re: Caromarlyse’s log (French/German/Portuguese/Russian)

Postby Caromarlyse » Sun May 15, 2022 8:08 pm

It felt like a less productive week, even though I spent the same amount of time on languages as last week.

French
    * Finished La poule et son cumin.
    * Listened to a few podcasts.

German
    * Up to 64% through Todesreigen. I have spent a long time reading it, but it's a long book!
    * Listened to various podcasts.

Portuguese
    * Finished A era dos muros.
    * Read bits and pieces of another couple of books, in an attempt to decide on my next read.
    * Listened to E tem mais… podcasts, as well as an interesting video from Portuguese with Leo on Galician. Also watched a new episode of 3%.
    * Some work on my Português em foco textbook.

Russian
    * I'm now 32% through Атомические привычки. I'm not quite sure how I've made so little progress with it this week.
    * Listened mainly to Russian with Max podcasts and videos. I also listened to a Что это было? podcast, and was initially pleased by how much I'd understood, but I think a lot of that might be because the subject matter was familiar. But it was definitely a lot more than just noise!
    * Another couple of classes, one that went pretty smoothly, the second less so.
    * Some grammar - some new verb groups as well as short-form adjectives (revision plus discovering how erratic stress can be with these in their different forms).

Fitness
I'm a bit under 10k steps daily for the week, but my watch's battery died today, so I missed out on some steps I did actually walk. I'll have to catch up this week! I did do my workouts and stretching, though.
9 x

Caromarlyse
Green Belt
Posts: 387
Joined: Fri Dec 06, 2019 2:31 pm
Languages: English (N), French (C1-ish), German (B2/C1-ish), Russian (B1-ish), Portuguese (B1-ish), Welsh (complete beginner), Spanish (in hibernation)
(All levels estimates and given as a guide only)
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Re: Caromarlyse’s log (French/German/Portuguese/Russian)

Postby Caromarlyse » Sun May 22, 2022 5:11 pm

French
    * Watched quite a few episodes of Le dessous des cartes, including some interesting ones on the Caucasus and Kaliningrad.
    * Not French, but, inspired by the Caucasus episode, I then listened to an interesting Langfocus video on the differences between Turkish and Azeri. And saw that the Turkish and Azeri words for needle are very similar to the Russian one, which I had been struggling to remember (no idea why, as it's short!). Anyway, I hope that has sorted my memory problem.
    * Listened to a podcast.

German
    * Finished my book. It's worth over 11.5% of a super challenge all on its own!
    * Listened to a couple of podcasts.

Portuguese
    * Binge watched 3% (seven episodes in total).

Russian
    * I'm still ploughing through Атомические привычки. I'm quite slow at reading in Russian. I've also realised I do have one-touch look-ups, and I really need now to resist using it all the time.
    * Listened to Russian with Max podcasts and videos. I also listened to another (for natives) podcasts, and gave up after seven minutes because I couldn't understand what they were talking about!
    * Another couple of classes (and prep for them).
    * I actually opened Quizlet, and went through half of my A1 folder. I forgot the word for "a drink" the other day, so I figured I needed to do something about it. It's not actually too bad going through flashcards of words that you either remember immediately or very easily re-remember having seen them again once! I might have discovered how flashcards might work for me (in very small doses...).
    * Lots of grammar. I discovered that courses on the http://www.tips4russian.com site are currently free. I didn't know about them previously, so it was just fortuitous that I could access them without payment. I have completed the entire verbs of motion II course. I think it's excellent - there are little summary videos on one or two/three prefixes, which are super clear, followed by audio drills. The latter are files in which you're asked (in English) to translate a short sentence into Russian. The Russian version is then read out after a pause, slowly and then faster. This is just the kind of practice I need to automate my knowledge. The drills have also been cleverly conceived, because not only do they test you on verbs of motion, but also on imperatives, telling the time, the verbs meaning "to ask", word order, personal pronouns, use of the past tense after чтобы, reported speech, use of что etc-нибудь etc etc. You also obviously get to hear the correct stress. Having done all of these, I feel a lot more secure in the conjugations of some verbs that I kept getting muddled. I've downloaded the files so I can listen and practise further (which is recommended). There were also some written quizzes, but I can generally do those ok; it really is the automaticity I need to work on. The explanations given in the videos also cleared some things up for me, such the use of за- instead of в-, changes in the root form of the verb when a prefix is added, the impact of spelling rules, etc. I'm going to go back and do the verbs of motion I course next; having done the final test in the second course (translations of 18 sentences into Russian), I've realised I need revision of походить/пойти etc. I'm also going to go through the videos in the second course, and annotate my existing notes on the topic with new points that came up. There are other courses too, but I'll stick to verbs of motion for the moment!
    * As a result of the above, I'm completely behind on my homework for this coming week... :shock:

Fitness
I'm under 10k steps daily for the week again, and my watch's battery died again whilst I was out on a walk :oops: I did do my workouts and stretching again, though. The highlight was a 16kg Turkish get up (with single arm floor press to start) on both sides.
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jeffers
Blue Belt
Posts: 848
Joined: Sat Aug 22, 2015 4:12 pm
Location: UK
Languages: Speaks: English (N), Hindi (A2-B1)

Learning: The above, plus French (A2-B1), German (A1), Ancient Greek (?), Sanskrit (beginner)
Language Log: https://forum.language-learners.org/vie ... 15&t=19785
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Re: Caromarlyse’s log (French/German/Portuguese/Russian)

Postby jeffers » Wed May 25, 2022 1:15 pm

I think I have seen mention of Le dessous des cartes here or there on the forum, but I've never looked into it. Thanks for mentioning it, because it does look interesting. Also, I'm still at the point where it's useful to have a lot of my watching include native subtitles, so it's nice to see that they provide French subtitles. I'll definitely give a few episodes a try!
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Le mieux est l'ennemi du bien (roughly, the perfect is the enemy of the good)

French SC Books: 0 / 5000 (0/5000 pp)
French SC Films: 0 / 9000 (0/9000 mins)

Caromarlyse
Green Belt
Posts: 387
Joined: Fri Dec 06, 2019 2:31 pm
Languages: English (N), French (C1-ish), German (B2/C1-ish), Russian (B1-ish), Portuguese (B1-ish), Welsh (complete beginner), Spanish (in hibernation)
(All levels estimates and given as a guide only)
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Re: Caromarlyse’s log (French/German/Portuguese/Russian)

Postby Caromarlyse » Thu May 26, 2022 5:48 am

jeffers wrote:I think I have seen mention of Le dessous des cartes here or there on the forum, but I've never looked into it. Thanks for mentioning it, because it does look interesting. Also, I'm still at the point where it's useful to have a lot of my watching include native subtitles, so it's nice to see that they provide French subtitles. I'll definitely give a few episodes a try!


Yes, I think it's definitely worth watching. So much work behind each episode.
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Caromarlyse
Green Belt
Posts: 387
Joined: Fri Dec 06, 2019 2:31 pm
Languages: English (N), French (C1-ish), German (B2/C1-ish), Russian (B1-ish), Portuguese (B1-ish), Welsh (complete beginner), Spanish (in hibernation)
(All levels estimates and given as a guide only)
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Re: Caromarlyse’s log (French/German/Portuguese/Russian)

Postby Caromarlyse » Wed Jun 01, 2022 8:10 am

MAY REVIEW

Monthly totals
French: 13.57 hours
German: 37.05 hours
Portuguese: 27.75 hours
Russian: 64.80 hours

My personal Super Challenge plan has gone well. It's got me back into French - I've read one book (La poule et son cumin), listened to a number of podcasts and watched a lot of episodes of Le Dessous des cartes. I've started reading my next book (Le pays des autres by Leïla Slimani), but haven't yet got into it. I'm on track with SC pace. German has also gone well - I've read one book (Todesreigen) and I am already about 75% of the way through the next in the series. I've also listened to the usual podcast suspects. I'm well on track with SC pace, especially for the books part. Portuguese has also been going well in terms of listening - I've got hooked to 3% - though I'm slightly behind with the reading part. I have another translation lined up to read next, again of a Malcolm Gladwell book: The Bomber Mafia. Once I've finished my current German read I'm going to ignore German for a while so I can catch up here.

Russian has continued being the focus. I've not done too well with reading Atomic Habits, but I have challenged myself a bit more with listening. I've started working with euronews as well as watching some Deutsche Welle videos in Russian. I also went back to Поедем поедим. The first one I watched (about Georgia) I could understand loads and thought I'd improved, but then the next one (about Mordovia) was harder! I also found a new podcast for learners - called Russian Twist - which I think will be useful in that there are two presenters so you get to listen in on a conversation, rather than a monologue. I listened to an interview with Dr Curtis Ford (the creator of the verbs of motion course I've been doing) as well as a few others. I did get a bit jealous of other foreigners' Russian accents given it's an area where I struggle loads, but I'm trying not to let it get to me too much! I also did my usual classes, with my usual levels of success!

Fitness: average daily steps for the month: 11,173.5. Pulled it back towards the end of the month ;). Need to do more stretching. Workouts all good. I'm on a (planned) break right now, but have diarised the re-start.

PLANS FOR JUNE
Nothing too demanding; I just want to keep things ticking over.

French: read one book, continue listening.

German: finish my book, continue listening.

Portuguese: read one book, continue watching 3%.

Russian: try to finish my book! Continue listening. Re-start classes after short break.
7 x

Caromarlyse
Green Belt
Posts: 387
Joined: Fri Dec 06, 2019 2:31 pm
Languages: English (N), French (C1-ish), German (B2/C1-ish), Russian (B1-ish), Portuguese (B1-ish), Welsh (complete beginner), Spanish (in hibernation)
(All levels estimates and given as a guide only)
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Re: Caromarlyse’s log (French/German/Portuguese/Russian)

Postby Caromarlyse » Sun Jun 12, 2022 5:53 pm

I've been on holiday so have taken a bit of a break. It's been nice, but I could have done with longer!

French: I have kind of neglected it... Just a tiny bit of listening. I've found something on Arte that I'm going to watch tonight, though. I also need to get back to my reading habit now I'm back into my normal routine.

German: I've discovered ZDF Magazin Royale, a late night satirical comedy show, and have been bingeing on the back catalogue. I'm really enjoying it, and, from a language perspective, am pleased at how easily I can understand (most of) it. I also watched an Arte documentary entitled Mitbewohner statt Pflegeheim and listened to my usual Easy German podcasts.

Portuguese: Just some episodes of 3%. As with French, I need to get back into reading.

Russian: I've got through three graded readers: Anna Karenina (for a second time), The Garnet Bracelet, and Crime and Punishment (which I'd started several times but not finished). I've also listened to some Russian with Max podcasts and a video on verbs of motion, a Russian Twist video, and a DW news in Russian broadcast. Back to classes this week, including some new ones that I'm going to trial. One of these will focus on pronunciation; it remains to be seen whether there is any hope for me! I've done (compulsory) classes in French and German pronunciation before and really struggled, but they were in large-ish groups where there was no time to help someone like me who was just not picking anything up ;-). I'm happy enough with my French and German now as they are clearly perfectly comprehensible despite the English accent (work and study have proved it), but I'm not convinced that my Russian is understandable to anyone who is not especially patient and sympathetic... So it would be nice if I could make some kind of improvement.

Fitness: No workouts but so many steps thanks to lots of hiking whilst on holiday! I'm averaging over 16,000 a day this month so far and that's with one day of travelling and little movement. I did manage to keep up stretching, because all the hiking made everything seize up... :?
10 x

Caromarlyse
Green Belt
Posts: 387
Joined: Fri Dec 06, 2019 2:31 pm
Languages: English (N), French (C1-ish), German (B2/C1-ish), Russian (B1-ish), Portuguese (B1-ish), Welsh (complete beginner), Spanish (in hibernation)
(All levels estimates and given as a guide only)
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Re: Caromarlyse’s log (French/German/Portuguese/Russian)

Postby Caromarlyse » Sun Jun 19, 2022 4:09 pm

A productive week in terms of life admin and Russian, though less so with everything else. I think all I've done in other languages is listen to some German podcasts, including one over 2.5 hours long giving an overview of Russian history from 9th century Rus to date! Oh, I also did someone a favour and told them what a four-page letter from an official German body said (half a page of information; three pages of waffle).

So Russian was the almost sole focus. In summary:

    * I did a lot of classes, including some trials with new teachers. In order, my perception of my own performance in them was: pretty good - excellent - not too bad - do you even know anything? - pretty reasonable :D. Thankfully the terrible one was with a teacher I'd had before, or it could have been even worse. As it was, I think she put my difficulty down to me having been on holiday, but in fact it was more tiredness/irritation at work stuff on that day and at that time.

    * The meeting new teachers thing went really well. I often feel I'm making no progress given I still find it so hard to express myself in classes, but this really showed that once I go back to something straightforward, I have improved. I was able to recycle some language that was given to me in a similar introductory session six months or so ago, and thus explain something in a natural way (I think!). None of them tried to tell me I needed to go back to material for beginners, which is definitely also a huge sign of progress...

    * The pronunciation session didn't work out. For a kind of good reason, in that she said that with my level of Russian (and she meant good, not bad!), there was really nothing to worry about. Nothing in how I pronounce Russian hinders communication. This was reassuring, though I know there are still issues (I couldn't pronounce the word ткань later in the week in a way that could be understood, for example, and another of the new teachers said I need to work on getting the stressed о more open and focus on the ы - which I can pronounce, but only when paying attention). So I think I'm just going to make corrections as and when I get picked up on them, and do the odd exercise from the pronunciation course I have every now and then. The pronunciation teacher does offer other types of lessons and was nice, but I don't have room for her - or more materials - in my schedule, sadly.

    * The history-focused lesson was really good, and I'm going to continue. We are going to start from the beginning and make our way through Russia's history to 1991. I've got a book in intermediate-level Russian out of which I can read a chapter before each class as a primer. I'm also encouraged to read about the same period in English so I can discuss different perspectives on the same events. I've noticed this week how I am starting to be able to read something in Russian and then remember it well enough to report back, and I think these classes will really help to hone this skill. I have also been meaning to study Russian history properly for a while, but haven't quite got round to it; knowing I have a class in the diary should be the kick up the backside I need to get my act together ;).

    * Noticing that improvement came from one of my regular classes, in which I often read a text beforehand and then in class summarise it/answer a load of questions about points it raises. This week it was all about cloning, in particular of mammoths, so not all that easy really. I subsequently watched a short YouTube video on a similar topic. The channel seems to be a new one (there are only two videos on it so far) but has the potential to be a good source - it is kind of similar in idea to MrWissen2Go, but covering only scientific topics.

    * The class I describe above as "excellent" was one I booked on a bit of a whim/gut feeling, but it turned out to be a really good idea. I loved the teacher, and she seemed really thorough and keen to push me forward, in all areas. It was good to get a different perspective on things to focus on. She's also keen to have me write an essay a week, and long-form writing is something I've neglected for a while.

    * I generally do well being busy, and with all of this I'm going to be, but I'm seeing this as a summer focus, and I will see how I go.

    * I also listened to a Russian with Max and some Russian Twist podcasts. The latter are new to me (I'm going through the back catalogue). They're pitched at learners with a slightly higher level than Russian with Max, so I'm pleased I can follow them - I don't get everything, but I definitely do already understand more than I did when I first started with Russian with Max.

    * Finally (I think!) I did some grammar each day. I've done a lot with Let's Improve our Russian 1 already, but my notes/answers to exercises are a bit all over the place, so I'm trying to get through it in order, consolidating as I go.

Fitness: all done, aside from steps on a couple of days when it was too hot for me to venture outside.
7 x

german2k01
Green Belt
Posts: 467
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2021 8:16 pm
Location: Germany
Languages: English, Urdu, and German
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Re: Caromarlyse’s log (French/German/Portuguese/Russian)

Postby german2k01 » Sun Jun 19, 2022 8:48 pm

Caromarlyse,

Since you are pretty advanced in the German language. I think you are the right person to whom I should address my query with regards to tackling verbs in German. How did you approach learning German verbs and their different conjugated forms? Did you add sentences in Anki? Did you highlight verbs while reading?
What is the best way to tackle them so that you can use them spontaneously in a conversation?
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Caromarlyse
Green Belt
Posts: 387
Joined: Fri Dec 06, 2019 2:31 pm
Languages: English (N), French (C1-ish), German (B2/C1-ish), Russian (B1-ish), Portuguese (B1-ish), Welsh (complete beginner), Spanish (in hibernation)
(All levels estimates and given as a guide only)
x 1611

Re: Caromarlyse’s log (French/German/Portuguese/Russian)

Postby Caromarlyse » Mon Jun 20, 2022 8:29 am

german2k01 wrote:Caromarlyse,

Since you are pretty advanced in the German language. I think you are the right person to whom I should address my query with regards to tackling verbs in German. How did you approach learning German verbs and their different conjugated forms? Did you add sentences in Anki? Did you highlight verbs while reading?
What is the best way to tackle them so that you can use them spontaneously in a conversation?


I'm not sure how advanced I am - I did it (successfully!) at university, but then seriously neglected it for a long time. I can understand without much of an issue everything I want to listen to (which doesn't include youth slang...) and can read "light" adult fiction as a restful activity. I've never been through a C-level course in full though (the CEFR didn't exist when I was studying it formally), and the C-Grammatik book I've got definitely has a lot that is new to me. I do intend to go through it in full some day! My active skills are rusty.

Turning to your question, I'm also not sure how much use I can be. I definitely remember trying to memorise the verb tables you get at the back of German textbooks/grammar books (fliegen - fliegt - flog - ist geflogen etc), to varying degrees of success. I also have a German verb drills book from my school days, which I was never very diligent about using. I never had electronic flashcards way back then, and haven't come to like them since. I just don't find it works very well.

Things that have helped me, in various languages, are as follows.

Generally, I've always liked testing myself, so, for example, at random selecting an infinitive and trying to conjugate it correctly, or going through exercises. Sometimes I'll make myself my own question sheet, prepare my own answer key (all using bought materials so I know it's correct), and at intervals go through it and correct myself. I find I need to put myself in situations where I am forced to recall something again and again before I finally properly remember it. Marking what I've done wrong helps me, because I get a little annoyed at the mistake and pay attention, and that helps my memory. I do this alongside wider exposure to the language, with the idea being that you should come across what you're getting wrong/trying to learn in real life, which should further help your memory. I also just prefer to press on with novel things rather than beating myself over the head with stuff I can't seem to remember. Ultimately I'll end up circling back (by which time it should have become easier). Of course, the wider exposure also has the added benefit that some forms end up just sounding right without you even being able to remember how you learnt them.

I also think at the more advanced level it really helps to read high-quality journalistic articles intensively. So take something from Der Spiegel/Focus etc and look at the verbs. Do you know why a particular tense was used? Would you have used a different verb/formulated it differently? How else could you convey the same meaning? If you understood the verb, would you have had it in mind to use yourself/been able to conjugate it properly? Are there Nomen-Verb-Verbindungen, and did you know them? German likes to nominalise more than English - note examples of this also and remember the phrasing that German naturally prefers. For completeness, you should probably pay attention to the preposition(s) + case used with the verb too. Summarising the text afterwards (in writing or orally) is, I think, an excellent test and exercise.

You can also sit down with a group of verbs that follow the same pattern or just a small number of verbs that you have decided you want to get right and make a concerted effort to use them. I've found with Russian that googling the past tense of a verb in the news tab will sometimes bring up headlines showing that past tense form in use. It then becomes a lot stickier in my memory. The use of a form in a song also does the same thing.

As for getting all of this right spontaneously in a conversation, I'm not sure I ever do ;-). But getting things wrong in a conversation is, for me, an important part of the memorisation process: by messing up "live", I can pretty much guarantee that I will never make the same mistake again!
5 x

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MorkTheFiddle
Black Belt - 2nd Dan
Posts: 2114
Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2015 8:59 pm
Location: North Texas USA
Languages: English (N). Read (only) French and Spanish. Studying Ancient Greek. Studying a bit of Latin. Once studied Old Norse. Dabbled in Catalan, Provençal and Italian.
Language Log: https://forum.language-learners.org/vie ... 11#p133911
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Re: Caromarlyse’s log (French/German/Portuguese/Russian)

Postby MorkTheFiddle » Mon Jun 20, 2022 5:14 pm

This is a good summary of verb study for many languages, I think.
I also like how you appreciate the value of mistakes.
1 x
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