Dave's log, (German and French)

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Bex
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Re: 10,000 pages of German

Postby Bex » Mon May 04, 2020 7:36 am

Do you feel it's easier to read (you understand more/reading speed) now than when you started?
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DaveAgain
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Re: 10,000 pages of German

Postby DaveAgain » Tue May 05, 2020 7:24 am

smallwhite wrote:
I just did the first 13 Dialang reading questions to see what they're like. Do you remember how you scored in them?
No, sorry.


Bex wrote:Do you feel it's easier to read (you understand more/reading speed) now than when you started?

Yes, but the value of tests is that they're an objective evaluation. Anyways ... Changes!

I 've been thinking about what I can change, and one easy substitution would be to just replace one thing with another so I'm going to replace watching a TV programme, with shadowing an audiobook. I may also replace reading a biographical wikipedia article with reading something else, but I'm not sure what would be better. I may just drop that. perhaps de.wikihow.com
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smallwhite
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Re: 10,000 pages of German

Postby smallwhite » Tue May 05, 2020 8:20 am

DaveAgain wrote:
smallwhite wrote:
I just did the first 13 Dialang reading questions to see what they're like. Do you remember how you scored in them?
No, sorry.


Bex wrote:Do you feel it's easier to read (you understand more/reading speed) now than when you started?

Yes, but the value of tests is that they're an objective evaluation. Anyways ... Changes!

I 've been thinking about what I can change, and one easy substitution would be to just replace one thing with another so I'm going to replace watching a TV programme, with shadowing an audiobook. I may also replace reading a biographical wikipedia article with reading something else, but I'm not sure what would be better. I may just drop that.

Okay, if we can't discuss specific questions from the test then my general advice would be (1) to read more non-fiction and a wider variety of it, specifically including everyday topics and media formats, (1a) to look into textbooks for snippets of writings that you don't otherwise have access to (eg. jury summons, classified ads) and (2) to learn and remember the actual meanings of A1-B1 vocabulary and grammar (as opposed to just their rough meanings). Reading tests are likely designed to test your grasp (vs guess) of the language. Good luck!
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badger
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Re: 10,000 pages of German

Postby badger » Tue May 05, 2020 7:12 pm

I'm curious what proportion of words you were understanding & how much of the plot you were able to follow. I remember you were reading at a very considerable rate - I commented on it a few pages back in the thread - & it made me wonder what level of comprehension you were at to be able to read at that speed.

I'm working my way through 10k pages of French at the moment & am at the Harry Potter stage which I suppose is YA level, & where I can understand enough that, for the most part, I'm not so concerned about understanding the words (although obviously some I have to get from context & a few I have to look up) & instead have some mental cycles spare to notice interesting bits of grammar & the like. I do mix it up a bit with more literary, Adult-level books, but I definitely read them a much more slowly & have to look up a lot more words.

I wonder whether it might benefit you to step down a level (or two) in reading age such that you can get most of the words & most of the understanding through reading extensively, rather than higher-level material at a lower level of comprehension, & then ramp up to the next level when you're ready.

I hope you won't take this as criticism, it's not intended as such, rather that I'm doing the same thing & am interested in your experience.
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slowmoon
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Re: 10,000 pages of German

Postby slowmoon » Tue May 05, 2020 8:38 pm

The Dialang result only differentiates between A1-C2. You could make a big improvement within one of those six levels, though you'd get the same result. To measure progress, you need a test with more gradation.
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DaveAgain
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Re: 10,000 pages of German

Postby DaveAgain » Tue May 05, 2020 9:25 pm

badger wrote:I'm curious what proportion of words you were understanding & how much of the plot you were able to follow. I remember you were reading at a very considerable rate - I commented on it a few pages back in the thread - & it made me wonder what level of comprehension you were at to be able to read at that speed.

I'm working my way through 10k pages of French at the moment & am at the Harry Potter stage which I suppose is YA level, & where I can understand enough that, for the most part, I'm not so concerned about understanding the words (although obviously some I have to get from context & a few I have to look up) & instead have some mental cycles spare to notice interesting bits of grammar & the like. I do mix it up a bit with more literary, Adult-level books, but I definitely read them a much more slowly & have to look up a lot more words.

I wonder whether it might benefit you to step down a level (or two) in reading age such that you can get most of the words & most of the understanding through reading extensively, rather than higher-level material at a lower level of comprehension, & then ramp up to the next level when you're ready.

I hope you won't take this as criticism, it's not intended as such, rather that I'm doing the same thing & am interested in your experience.
Hey, my results aren't good so criticism is appropriate.

You're mistaken about my choice of texts though, they were intended in many cases to be at the easier end of the scale. Plays are just speech, novels are speech + description; plays should be easier. The Hornblower books I read are ones I read in English as a teen, they're YA adventure stories that I know well. etc.
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badger
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Re: 10,000 pages of German

Postby badger » Tue May 05, 2020 11:40 pm

DaveAgain wrote:Plays are just speech.

it's still speech in foreign though, that's the tricky bit. :D
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slowmoon
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Re: 10,000 pages of German

Postby slowmoon » Sun May 10, 2020 11:57 am

What's next, DaveAgain?
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DaveAgain
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Re: 10,000 pages of German

Postby DaveAgain » Sun May 10, 2020 12:29 pm

slowmoon wrote:What's next, DaveAgain?
More reading :-)

I think with French I used to read paper books without looking up words, and look up words when reading eBooks. I suspect I'll drift back towards that.

At the moment I'm reading three books. One where I parrot an audiobook, and look up any unknown words; one I'm just reading, although I have read an English translation of it some years ago, and an eBook I'm reading German-English-German.

When I finish those I may try the vocabulary test you took, so I've got a benchmark to judge any future development.

You mentioned a new project with wordlists the other day, what have you got in mind for that?
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Mista
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Re: Dave's log, French & German.

Postby Mista » Sun May 10, 2020 12:43 pm

DaveAgain wrote:I'm doing a mixture of intensive and extensive reading so I'm not sure what to change. Perhaps I just need more time at it?


What exactly do you do when you do intensive reading? If you are mostly focusing on vocabulary, it could be that Dialang expects a better understanding of grammar at the B1 level.

Also, is that a summary of your reading activities, or all of your studying activities? If the latter, it's possible that you would profit from some more productive activities, like writing summaries in your target language of what you read. It could help you become more conscious of the details in what you are reading.
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