Iversen's second multiconfused log thread

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mentecuerpo
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Re: Iversen's second multiconfused log thread

Postby mentecuerpo » Fri Jan 03, 2020 10:58 pm

Iversen wrote:SP: En los años después la reconquista los reyes católicos (Ferran y Isabela) intentaron purgar su pais de toda tendencia secular y, especialmente, cualquier sombreado de tendencias islámicas o judías. En este clima, por supuesto, la música de la iglesia era el área de trabajo más importante del compositor, pero también fue el período en que aparecieron los primeros compositores importantes especializados música para instrumentos relacionados con la guitarra - y esta música evidentemente fue escribo para tocar al domicilio.

En el hecho los instrumentos pizzicados con dedo o púa ya existían desde la antigüedad - incluso precursores de la guitarra moderna - pero a la corte española fue la vihuela que prevaleció, y la guitarra se convirtió en el instrumento de las clases bajas. En el resto de Europa fue, de otro lado, el laúd que se convirtió en instrumento dominante - incluyendo archilaudes gigantes y teorbos. Hoy en día puedes escuchar la misma pieza de música jugado con todos estos instrumentos, pero, por supuesto, son principalmente los músicos profesionales que poseen un laúd o una vihuela.


Bonito punto histórico que usted menciona en su blog. Cuando se piensa sobre la guitarra clásica, viene en mente España. Ahora me explico porque la guitarra clásica tiene representantes y tanta influencia española. Por ejemplo, las guitarras clásicas hechas en España tienen fama a nivel mundial. Los guitarristas españoles tienen renombre internacional como el ilustre guitarrista clásico, Andrés Segovia, y los hermanos Romero.

Algunos importantes conciertos para guitarra clásica han sido compuestos por compositores españoles como el concierto de Aranjuez (Joaquín Rodrigo) y Los Recuerdos de la Alhambra (Francisco Tárrega).

El Flamenco, usa la guitarra clásica española.
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Re: Iversen's second multiconfused log thread

Postby Iversen » Fri Jan 03, 2020 11:13 pm

No he terminado con la guitarra española en absoluto: habrá informaciones sobre Sanz, Sor, Tarrega y otros en una sección posterior. Y el clavicordio primero debe inventarse, pero entonces habrá también algo sobre Domenico Scarlatti y padre Antonio Soler. E incluso más tarde, intento también mencionar la música gitana y los compositores que se inspiraron en esto, como por ejemplo De Falla y Rodrigo y Paco de Lucía. La música española para piano también merece un capítulo (o parte de un capítulo). Un hecho lamentable: yo podía jugar las Goyescas de Enrique Granados hace mucho tiempo, pero desafortunadamente esto hoy es imposibile yá que despuès de mas de 20 años no he tocado mi pianoforte.

¡No obstante, me divierte tanto escribir esta historia que puede perdurar mucho tiempo!

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Re: Iversen's second multiconfused log thread

Postby Iversen » Sat Jan 04, 2020 10:18 am

If anyone out there thinks that I have dropped my language studies and only spend my time writing texts about music.. well, it is not quite the case. For instance yesterday evening I worked with two texts, on in Slovak and the other in Indonesian.

The Slovak one told about even more small... no by the way, let's take it in Slovak:

SLK: Slovenský text pozostával z niekolkých krátkych úryvkov z webových stránok múzeí, a vcera som cítal o Obchodnom múzeu a Vodárenskom múzeu. V roku 2019 som navštívil Bratislavu a navštívil som vodárenské múzeum, ktoré je blízko botanickej záhrady (a na ulici vedúcej k zrúcanine Devín). Prvýkrát som prišiel na víkend a bol zatvorený. Strážca bol nahnevaný a hlúpy, ale na malom plakete sa uvádza (v slovenskom jazyku), že múzeum bolo otvorené iba v pracovné dni. Dobre, vrátim sa - a tak vidím botanickú záhradu dvakrát, napriek premenlivému pocasiu. A ked som bol v múzeu, bol som jediný host. Bolo to takmer ako navštívit súkromnú vilu.

F5923b07_búrka nad Lidlom.jpg

IND: Teks bahasa Indonesia adalah tentang Santa - sisa dari Natal.

IT: Infatti ci fu qualche testi più - nella linga sarda (che io non ho studiato). Li ho letti come lettura di buonanotte, senza dicionario neppure traduzione (il sardo non è ancora nell'elenco di Google Translate). Il primo testo era scritto nella lingua parlata naturale: una signora con la sua famiglia ha visitato un museo archeologico in occasione "de sa jorronada de is Museus Abertus", ed era un testo informativo ma difficile. L'ultimo - sul bilinguismo - è stato alquanto deludente, malgrado il titolo. Quello al medio togliò esattamente il topico menzionato da Mentecuerpo ieri: la musica degli zingari in Spagna. E questo è stato davvero facile da capire: prova per te stesso il seguente estratto di un articolo ottimo sulla Flamenco da sardu.net:

(SARDO) Su Flamenco est una de sas culturas musicales pius particulare e fatzilmente reconnoskìbile de s'Europa. Sa caraterìstiga peculiare de su Flamenco est in sas influèntzias de sas diferentes orìzines, difatis podimus incuntrare in custa musica cumponentes culturales hindù, àrabas, judeas, gregas, castillyanas etz. (...) In su sud de s'Ispannya e pius pretzisamente in Andalussia, sos Zitanos arrivein in su sèculu XV ue die pro die ponian aficu a sa musica issoro formèndela in manera ispetaculare.

EN: And now back to English. I mentioned a few days ago that Henry VIII actually composed nice dance music as a young man. Then there were some rather wellknown composers who wrote church music: Taverner, Tye, Tallis - the latter is mainly known because Vaughan-Williams wrote an excellent fantasy over a thema by mister Tallis, but also because he composed a veritable polyphonic tour de force, his "Spem in Alium" for 40 voices - here sung by a choir of 700! And Guinness Record Book was not even invented back in the 1500s!

The real breakthrough came under queen Liz with a host of composers who wrote music for harpsichord, consort and .. well, some of them are mostly known for their songs (like for instance Morley and Weelkes), and of course many wrote church music (including W.Byrd, cfr. below) - but that's not my cup of tea.

One of the most important composers from this period was John Dowland, who spent some of his time in Denmark at the court of Christian IV. He actually got a VERY high salary there (500 daler a year), but still he was one of the most woefully melancholic souls in the whole history of music. For instance he wrote a collection of songs known as "Lachrimae, or Seaven Teares" - and luckily these are also found in a version for consort. The second one it the famous "Flow my tears". For the harpsichord he wrote pieces with titles like Melancholie Galliard, Complaint, Forlorne hope fancy, Fortune my foe, Go from my window, Melancholie Galliard and Semper Dowland semper dolens. One reason for him to be a tad melanchiolic could be his catholic leanings (quite problematic in England at the time). Even the queen herself called him an "obstinate Papist" - but since he remained loyal to the court and wrote beautiful music he was not burned at the stake, hanged or had his entrails cut out. Lucky Dowland.

Another wellknown composer, William Byrd, apparently conversed from protestantism to catholicism around 1570, which eventually led to his dismissal from the Royal Chapel, but didn't prevent him from becoming a very rich man. The bulk of his harpsichord pieces are found in a monumental collection called the "Fitzwilliams Virginal Booke" and in a publication of his own, known as "My Ladye Nevells Book" - for instance the programmatic "Battell" in several sections. And his titles are not quite as tearful as those of mr. Dowland: many are pavans and gailliards etc. dedicated to wealthy noblemen, but he also wrote cute small pieces like "Jhon come kisse me now" from the Fitzwilliams book. Speaking about titles, one passage from Wikipedia caught my eyes:

"Byrd's Quomodo cantabimus is the result of a motet exchange between Byrd and Philippe de Monte, who was director of music to Rudolf II, Holy Roman Emperor, in Prague. In 1583 De Monte sent Byrd his setting of verses 1–4 of Vulgate Psalm 136 (Super flumina Babylonis), including the pointed question "How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?" Byrd replied the following year with a setting of the defiant continuation, set, like de Monte's piece, in eight parts and incorporating a three-part canon by inversion."

"how shall we " etc... does that ring a bell? Of course this quote comes from the bible, but it turns out that it was made famous by a disco group named Boney M - not because an obscure Frenchman named de Monte wrote something over it in 1583. Byrd also wrote music for consort - in fact most composers of the day did, maybe with the exception of the learned doctor John Bull, who was a famous harpsichord virtuoso. There are basically two types of consort: simple ones with only one kind of instruments, although in different sizes, and broken consort where instruments from different families are mixed. Some pieces of this kind are strict polyphonic pieces with titles like In Nomine or Fantasy (Fancy). One of last composers to write this kind of music was Purcell (1659?-1695), who wrote no less than 38 operas, but also a set of 'fancies' for string consort - but NOT the famous trumpet voluntary 'by Purcell': it was in fact written by Jeremiah Clarke and named "The Prince of Denmark's March".

Other renowned consort composers include Jon Jenkins, Coperario and several generations of Ferrobosco's. Purcell died young - allegedly because his wife had locked him out on a cold day, though some say tuberculosis (it could be a combination). Clarke fell in love with a young lady from a higher social class than himself and shot himself - but got special (posthumous) permission to be buried in sacred ground.

FInally: why were the whole generation of composers from the late 16. century known as virginalists when their preferred keyboard instrument was the harpsichord? Well, for the simple reason that queen Elizabeth I was known as the virgin queen - and she could even play the instrument herself which therefore was named after her. She was also a noteworthy polyglot - I think we have a thread about that topic somewhere. The strange thing is actually why modern Anglophones insist on calling the instrument 'harpsichord' when it isn't anything like a harp.

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Re: Iversen's second multiconfused log thread

Postby Iversen » Sun Jan 05, 2020 8:56 pm

I left France dangling in the aftermath after the generation of song composers that comprised people like Dufay, Josquin des Prez, Okeghem, Obrecht, Busnois, Sermisy, di Lasso et Binchois ... and poor Janequin, whose name I forgot to mention. Some of them worked for the French court, others for the Burgundian court. But then the 100 years war ended and France entered a new period under kings François I and Henri II. The most famous poets at the time were the called La Pleïade, with people like Ronsard and du Bellay at the front. But then it occurred to me that I didn't had any idea about who wrote music to their poems so I did some searches on Youtube to find out about it, and the name of de Monte came up - I mentioned him in connection with the British composer Byrd - but apart from that the names that were mentioned, like de Castro and Renard and Boni, were totally unknown to me.

FR: Heureusement, il y avait aussi des français qui écrivaient pour l'orgue, clavecin ou luth, et j'en sais beaucoup plus sur leur musique. Le premier compositeur minimalement connu pour l'orgue est Jehan Titelouze (1563-1633), qui composait dans un style sévère et presque austère avec beaucoup de polyphonie. Mais il semble qu'il n'a publié rien avant les années 1623-1626, et les publications par autres compositeurs ont paru seulement vers 1640 (Roberday, Racquet, Courrois).

C'est plutôt la même chose avec les compositions pour le clavecin, où le premier nom à remarquer est celui de Jacques Champion de Chambonnières, suivi par ceux de d'Anglebert, Lebègue et Louis Couperin, l'oncle du beaucoup plus connu François Couperin, qui a publié non seulement des oeuvres pour l'orgue et le clavecin, mais aussi des ouvres nommées 'concerts' pour des ensembles de chambre. Il y'a encore un compositeur et claveciniste auquel je voudrais attirer l'attention - ou peut-être que je devais écrire 'compositrice' cette fois, car il s'agit de Élisabeth-Claude Jacquet de La Guerre, née 1665 et morte en 1729, qui avait une très bonne réputation à la cour de d'abord Louis XIV, depuis Louis XV. Les compositrices sont peu visibles dans l'histoire de la musique classique, aussi faut-il qu'on applaudisse chaque fois qu'on découvre quelqu'un(e) qui a brisé la malédiction.

Elisabeth Jacquet de la Guerre.jpg

Les pièces pour l'orgue (parfois integrées en messes ou 'livres' pour l'orgue) ont souvent des noms tirés de leur registration - comme par example l'offertoire sur les grands jeux (allemand: Hauptwerk), Agnus Dei pour Cromhorne en taille et Basse de trompette - et quand l'organiste tire tous les registres de son apparât ça se dit comme 'plein jeu' - et avant l'invention des orgues avec pneumatique automatique c'était presque une condamnation à mort sur les pauvres âmes qui opéraient les soufflets en dehors de la toile de fond. On dit que chaque fois que Jean Sébastien Bach était invité à tester de nouveaux orgues, il tirait d'abord tous les registres "pour tester les poumons de l'orgue". Et les ouvriers de derrière (et leurs poumons) ont payé le prix...

Sous Louis XIV quelque chose qui reflétait le style de leadership du roi s'est passé: en mars 1672 il a permis à l'italien Lully d'acheter un privilège qui interdise à toute personne "de faire chanter aucune pièce entière en France, soit en vers françois ou autres langues, sans la permission par écrit dudit sieur Lully, à peine de dix mille livres d'amende, et de confiscation des théâtres, machines, décorations, habits… ". En d'autres mots il a donné à un seul compositeur le pouvoir total de la musique de scène en France. Et cette situation a cessé seulement en 1687 quand Lully s'est tué par inadvertance en martelant une lourde canne qu'il utilisait comme batôn à travers son pied - et puis il y a eu gangrène dans la blessure.

J'ai essayé de trouver une image authentique de Lully avec le bâton dans le pied, mais n'ai pas réussi. Vous devez vous contenter d'une photo à l'autre moitié du monsieur - remarquez l'expression arrogante sur son visage!

Lully.jpg
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Re: Iversen's second multiconfused log thread

Postby mentecuerpo » Tue Jan 07, 2020 4:37 am

Iversen wrote:IT: Infatti ci fu qualche testi più - nella linga sarda (che io non ho studiato). Li ho letti come lettura della buonanotte, senza dicionatio neppure traduzione (il sardo non è ancora nell'elenco di Google Translate). Il primo testo era scritto nella lingua parlata naturale: una signora con la sua famiglia ha visitato un museo archeologico in occasione "de sa jorronada de is Museus Abertus", ed era un testo informativo ma difficile. L'ultimo - sul bilinguismo - è stato alquanto deludente, malgrado il titolo. Quello al medio togliò esattamente il topico menzionato da Mentecuerpo ieri: la musica degli zingari in Spagna. E questo è stato davvero facile da capire: prova per te stesso il seguente estratto di un articolo ottimo sulla Flamenco da sardu.net:

(SARDO) Su Flamenco est una de sas culturas musicales pius particulare e fatzilmente reconnoskìbile de s'Europa. Sa caraterìstiga peculiare de su Flamenco est in sas influèntzias de sas diferentes orìzines, difatis podimus incuntrare in custa musica cumponentes culturales hindù, àrabas, judeas, gregas, castillyanas etz. (...) In su sud de s'Ispannya e pius pretzisamente in Andalussia, sos Zitanos arrivein in su sèculu XV ue die pro die ponian aficu a sa musica issoro formèndela in manera ispetaculare.



Iversen, do you keep a blog when you travel, a travel journal, or log? I know that your trip to the water museum was in 2019, but you remember many details. It is nice that you had the museum just for yourself.

I have never read anything in Sardo before; it has so many cognates to Spanish and Italian that I can get the gist of the story. Interesting article. It is interesting that the Gypsies were in South Spain and that they came from North Indian. I saw many "Roma" people during my visit to Rumania in 2001.

(Me suena un poco al idioma Portugues, el cual no hablo). I want to visit Sardina, but of course, so many places to visit in my bucket list.
Greetings!
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Re: Iversen's second multiconfused log thread

Postby Iversen » Tue Jan 07, 2020 10:17 am

I do indeed keep some kind of travel journal or whatever you call it. It really started during my first interrail trip in 1972, where I bought postcards and took photos, and when I got home I also drew a map of my route, but still didn't write a real travelogue with texts and all that. But then I did 20.000 km on my second interrail trip and 30.000 on no. 3, and the need to make a short and koncise description of the trip became more obvious. But so far nothing more than that. The big breakthrough came much later when I got a computer and a scanner. I then scanned all my photos and postcards (plus those of my nearest family) and built a html-based system, which - with a few revisions - still is the one I use today.

I named each photo or postcard after its position in my albums - for instance F4237a01 would be the photo (Foto in Danish) in album 42 page 37 front side upper left corner (numbering in zig-zag down that page). P would indicate a postcard, S a stereo photo, M a photo in one of my mother's albums and X a very old album with photos and/or postcards, inherited from deceased members of my family. I started out with around 15.000 scanned photos and postcards, but as of today there are 45.512 items in the system.

The entrance to the system is a front page with links to all my travels, ordered chronologically. For each trip I have an overview description and a day to day travelogue with the pictures from each day in small format under the text. If I click the text I get all pictures from that day in large size below each other, and if I click one picture I get that picture in higher resolution. Today, several computers and windows versions later, I have switched to using Google maps for the maps of each destination, but for a long time I drew handwritten maps of each town - as shown below.

The latest addition to the system was the general map system, which I added when I had bought a CD with maps of the world. With this I can click on a town and see all pictures from that place (the connecting lines on the map below do not show my travel routes - they just connect places with separate picture pages).

And on top of that I have a tag based system showing pictures with a certain theme - like food or sundowns or .. well zoos. Originally I had a separate system for the zoos, with descriptions in text and the groundplan of each zoo, but now I have of course integrated that into my general travel system. And the zoo texts is actually the only place where I systematically have tried to add (edited) texts from the internet in the relevant languages to my own description in Danish. The reason that I haven't used foreign languages more is of course that the system was conceived before my language craze was reborn in the year 2008.

It would be too cumbersome to update all this manually after each trip, so I have programmed some Excel macros which do some of the job for me - though I still have to reorder the items manually and write the texts (in Notepad or Notepad+).

Scannet_kort_Italia.jpg

F4237a01_as-seen-from-the-air.jpg

And now I have written so much about my travel system that it would be overkill to add the daily dosis of musical history. So instead I'll just mention the things to come (which actually is the title of a film with music of sir Arthur Bliss). I ended the musical history of France with Lully, but didn't mention the special 'French style', nor mention the names of their dances. I have promised to write more about Spanish music for guitar and cembalo. Italian baroque music has to be mentioned - i.e. the instrumental music of Vivaldi & co., but also the history of Italian opera, which ramifications to the rest of Europe. And no history of the baroque music would be complete without a section about die Herren Bach, Bach, Bach, Bach, Bach, Bach, Bach, Bach, Bach, Bach, Bach und Händel - and all the rest of the German composers from that period.

After that it will still be in German since I have to write about the Mannheimer school, which was something like a precursor to the 'real' Vienna classics, that is: people like the Haydns and Mozarts and the one and lonely Beethoven - and let's just add Franz Schubert, since he counts as a romantic composer, but did live in Vienna. And from there it will be a journey through a number of national schools of romantic music, followed by the parts of 20. century music which I like myself. But I haven't planned that in detail yet - except that I'll use the opportunity to try writing something in some of my weaker languages. Unfortunately that doesn't include Finnish and Hungarian - I still have to figure out how to present Liszt and Sibelius...
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Re: Iversen's second multiconfused log thread

Postby Iversen » Tue Jan 07, 2020 6:58 pm

FR: Au travail, temps de retourner au monde de la musique...

J'ai laissé la France au moment de la mort de monsieur Lully. Comme compositeur il répresentait la France de Louis XIV, et son style était imposant et controllé - comme les jardins de Versailles tournés en musique. Un point qui le sépàre de la musique italienne est l'emploi de rythmes inégaux - une pratique tellement incorporée que les compositeurs françaises n'ont même pas pris la peine de l'indiquer dans dans les notes. En d'autres mots: si vous voyez gok gok gok gok dans les notes, vous pouvez être sûr que cela s'interpretait comme DAgok DAgok DAagok à l'époque. Les musiciens d'aujourd'hui savent cela, mais il n'est pas besoin d'aller très loin arrière dans le temps pour que les musiciens ont joué la musique d'une manière beaucoup plus regulière. Le thème de l'Eurovision et la fanfare du Te Deum de Marc-Antoine, et pour entendre la différence vous pourriez comparer cette version avec celle ci.

Une autre invention des français était l'ouverture française, qui existait avant Lully, mais c'est lui qui l'a donné sa forme canonique en trois parties. D'abord une partie lente en rythmes inégaux, depuis une section fuguée plus vite et finalement la première partie encore une fois, avec ou sans changements. Un emploi drôle du mot 'Ouverture' est celle de l'utiliser pour des suites en plusieurs mouvements, mais c'est surtout au-dehors de France qu'on voit ça. Une ouverture en Allemagne est donc le plus souvent une suite.

Le représentant le plus célèbre de la musique sous Louis XV est sans doute Jean-Philippe Rameau, qui a écrit des oeuvres pour la scène aussi bien que des 'concerts' pour les ensembles de chambre - et un tas de pièces pour le clavecin, groupées dans du moins trois 'livres'. Son style est plus gracieux que celui de Lully, et parfois quasi humoristique, comme dans la pièce dite "la Poule", qu'on entend parfois dans une version pour ensemble - comme ici. Si Lully représente le baroque, Rameau représente le rococo.

FranskMad.JPG

EN: And now to something completely different: Italy - and then Spain.

IT: Al fiorentino Peri è generalmente attribuita l'invenzione dell'opera, ma è stato Claudio Monteverdi da scrivere le prime opere che qualcuno si è ancora preso la briga di eseguire oggi (Orfeo, Ritorno d'Ulisse, Coronazione di Poppea) - come si vede, i soggetti furono presi dall'antichità.. E gli italiani hanno iniziato le loro opere con un preludio colla struttura rapido-lento-rapido. Inoltre, coltivavano il bel canto e certamente non ritmi rimbalzanti (come in seguito i francesi). Esportarono non solo opere ma anche compositori operatichi al resto d'Europa (salvo la Francia, dove ci fu quasi una guerra civile quando qualcuno tentavo nel anno 1752 di far opera italiana a Parigi ("La Querelle des Bouffons")). L'ironia è che la tradizione lirica in Francia commenzò nel 1645 quando il cardinale Mazarin invitò un gruppo operatico da Venezia al corte francese sotto il giovane Louis XIV.

ItalienskDramatik.JPG

Uno dei compositori italiani più prolifichi di opere era il signore Alessandro Scarlatti da Palermo - un uomo estremamente industrioso detto il padre della opera neapolitana. Tuttavia l'opera più importante di signor Scarlatti fu il suo figlio Domenico (1685-1757, cioè quasi contemporaneo con Vivaldi, J.S. Bach e Handel). Domenico ricoprì varie posizioni in Italia, ma si trasferì nel 1719 a Lisbona, da Lisbona di nuovo a Roma, ma nel 1729 a Siviglia e da lì in 1733 a Madrid. E qui ha smesso di scrivere opere e invece ha scritto 555 esercizi per strumenti a tastiera (da alcuni erroneamente chiamati sonate). Li suonano ancora oggi perché sono allegri, brevi e raffinati - sono materiali di lavoro di ottima qualità per gli dilettanti avanzati.

SP El otro compositor que quiero mencionar aqui es su discipulo, padre Antonio Soler (sí, fue ordenado sacerdote!). En la década de 1960 yo compré un LP con seis de sus conciertos para dos instrumentos clave, que se tocaban alternando entre varias combinaciones di pequeños órganos y cémbalos. Y esa grabación todavía hace parte de mi colección, pero ahora como un archivo eletronico. Pero el trabajo más cautivador de Soler es indudablemente su fandango, aqui en una grabación con notas. ¿Se puede sentir la influencia de los gitanos?

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Otro compositor italiano que emigró a España fue Luigi Boccherini, 1743-1805. Es decir, pertenece al período posterior a Domenico Scarlatti y su estudiante español Soler. Era un excelente jugador de violonchelo que se dice que inventó las posiciones del pulgar en los juegos de violonchelo (que se usan cuando los violonchelistas tocan pasajes stratosfericos, aproximadamente por debajo de la mitad de las cuerdas). Su obra más famosa es el concierto en si bemol mayor ... excepto que en realidad fue escrito por cierto Grützmacher sobre temas de Boccherini. Sin embargo, la verdad es que Boccherini escribió varios conciertos de violonchelo y sonatas para su instrumento, pero el más famoso de los conciertos realmente no fue el suyo. Pero hay otro lado de Boccherini que es menos conocido: escribió una serie de quintetos para guitarra y cuerdas. Por supuesto, yo recomendaría a las personas que se hagan un poco de esfuerza y las compren para apoyar a los músicos, pero durante la espera hay una coleccion completa aqui en Youtube. Y mientras tanto, se puede también escuchar el famoso minuetto, el cual pero proviene de un quinteto para cuerdas y solamente cuerdas (opus 13 no. 5). O su ambulación notturna por las calles de madrid - Op. 30 no. 6
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Re: Iversen's second multiconfused log thread

Postby Iversen » Thu Jan 09, 2020 8:16 am

Italian is actually one of my oldest languages, and the reason is that it has been the traditional language for indication og tempo and all other things in classical scores. So first I borrowed an Italian dictionary at the library, and then I became interested and borrowed a textbook too. In modern scores it has become more common to use your national languages, but Italian is still the default language of music

So with that in mind, let's have a peek at the Italian music scene in the 18.century. We have already seen some of the names for typical forms appear during the renaissance (you may remember mister Gabrieli), in the baroque period the sometimes change their meaning. For instance the sonata became a piece in several movements for one or two melody instruments and basso continuo. Basso continuo was typically a harpsichord plus a bass instrument, typically a viola da gamba - you remember: the bowed string instruments with a body that slopes toward the neck. In English the 'gamba' is often called "viole", but in German and Danish we call them 'gamber'. The alternative was a viola da braccio, and .. well, the "viola" (German "Bratsch") is a member of that family, but basically it is the modern bowed string instruments minus the doublebass. And of course they have italian names: violino (the small one), viola and violoncello (the big one). And some clever guy got the excellent idea to add a pin at the bottom of the 'cello - but only after the baroque period. So baroque cellists still had to keep the instrument between the legs.

As for the symphony - it was called "sinfonia" in Italian, but so far the name was mainly used about opera preludes. "Concerto" became a very commonly used name, but one special use should be noted: "concerto grosso" is a concert (on three movements) for a small soloist group and orchestra (which at this point generally consists of first and second violins, violas, celli + doublebasses (who played the same notes, just an octave apart)). However the composers also wrote 'concerti' with several soloist instruments. And one thing more about concertos: they became more and more difficult to play - not least the violin concertos. However the virtuoso keyboard concerts only came later.

IT: La storia del violino commincia abbastanza pacificamente con Arcangelo Corelli (1653-1713), che scrisse molte sonate per il violino più una sola raccolta di 12 concerti grossi (opus 6). Secondo le fonti, ha suonato molto bello e sensibile, ma apparentemente non particolarmente virtuoso - e ovviamente ha evitato di scrivere voci di violino che egli stesso non poteva suonare. La sua concerto più famosa è il concerto grosso opus 6 numero, chiamato concerto di Natale perché contiene una siciliana al ritmo del 12/8 - un'allusione ai pastori nel campo nel evangilio di San Marco - o forse quello di San Luca). Altri compositari hanno anche scritto concerti da Natale, come per esempio il signor Manfredini.

Tuttavia le richieste della tecnica del violino furono spinte da compositori /solisti come Locatelli (1695 Bergamo al 1764 Amsterdam) e Tartini (1692 Pirano al 1770 Padova). Il più notavole esempio di questo è la Sonata del Diavolo di Tartini, famosa per i 'trillo del diavolo' fatto simultaneamente su due corde. Questa sonata è diventata così iconicamente famosa che ne sono state realizzate diverse versioni di rock - ma tutto con il famoso trillo.

SER: У родном месту Тартина (Пиран) стоји му статуа, али живео је углавном у Венецији. Веза са Балканом ме, међутим, подсећа на композитора Соркочевић који је рођен и умро у Рагузи (Ragusa, данашњи Дубровник), али док је био активан као композитор живео је у Ромима.

F1805a02 - Tartini in Piran (now Slovenia).jpg

IT: Il grande nome del barocco italiano, tuttavia, era il 'prete rosso' Antonio Vivaldi (1678-1741). Egli fu assunto come maestro di violino dalle autorità del Pio Ospedale della Pietà di Venezia in 1703, dove rimase sino al 1720. Qui si è trovato in una magnifica situazione per un compositore : doveva imparare la musica a decine di giovani donne di talento, e queste dame hanno suonato non solo il violino ma infatti strumenti di ogni genere, tra cui il violoncello più trombe e tromboni. Quindi Vivaldi ha scritto non solo concerti di violino 'regolari' come i suoi colleghi, ma concerti per ogni tipo di strumento e combinazioni di strumenti - incluso la strana tromba marina (in tedesco: Marientrompete, Trompetengeige, Nonnengeige o Trumscheit). Era una lunga scatola triangolare con una sola corda, che si ha accarezzata con un arco e giocata utilizzando solo gli armonici naturali della corda. E quando finisse il suo impiego all'Ospedale, nel frattempo fu diventato così famoso che ricevette ordini da ogni possibile principe in Europa - per esempio, scrisse una serie di concerti per molti strumenti per il re di Dresda (e morì infatti non a Venezia, ma a Vienna). Sfortunatamente, quattro concerti per violino dal suo opus 8 'I quattro Stagioni' vengono giocati tanto da quasi far dimenticare che anche ha scritto altre opere (inclusi opere con cantanti ecc.), e il resto della produzione anche merita di essere ascoltato.

EN: But during the baroque period copyright was not a matter of course...

FR: ... et 'opus 13' di Vivaldi, appelé "Il pastor fido" (le berger fidèle)?. Cette oeuvre se compose de six sonates pour des instruments plus ou moins optionnels plus basse continue. Quand j'étais adolescent et j'ai acheté un disque Turnabout avec cette collection, 'Vivaldi' était encore nommé comme le compositeur sur la couverture. Mais depuis, les musicologues ont trouvé un reçu secret d'un compositeur amateur français nommé Chédeville à l'éditeur Marchand. qui déclare explicitement que les sonates de Chedeville devraient être publiées comme une œuvre de plus du beaucoup plus célèbre Vivaldi - ce qui d'ailleurs n'empêche que la musique soit de bonne qualité...

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Re: Iversen's second multiconfused log thread

Postby Iversen » Fri Jan 10, 2020 10:58 am

.. And now we are already well into in the baroque period, but just on the border to that period we find the German composers who tried their best to survive the thirty years war - people like Rosenmüller, Pezel, Scheidt and Schein. They mostly wrote religious music for vocalists, but also some really pretty suites. And the most surprising thing - given the turmoil of the period where they lived: much of this music is surprisingly calm and serene (as I wrote in another thread ).

GE: Es ist unmöglich über deutsche Barockmusik zu sprechen, ohne Johann Sebastian Bach zu erwähnen (und auch Händel, aber wir werden auf den später zurückkommen). Er war aber nur ein Mitglied einer weit verzweigten Musikerfamilie, und bloß in meiner eigenen Musiksammlung gibt es zehn Bachs - aber es gab noch viele dazu (Stammbaum, siehe hier). Als erster Musikant in der Familie gilt en gewisser Veit Bach, der im 16. Jahrhundert gelebt hat. Johann Sebastian hat so weit ich weiß kein Oper geschrieben, aber davon abgesehen hat er in fast alle Genren gearbeitet - weitgehend davon bestimmt, wer ihn angestellt hat.

Zum Beispiel war er organist in zuerst Halle, dann Weimar - und dort hat er natürlich Orgelmusik geschrieben, HAUFEN davon! Dann wurde er am Hofe von Cöthen angestellt, und dort hat er den größten Teil seiner Kammer- und Orchestermusik geschrieben, einschließlich der berühmten sechs brandenburgischen Konzerte und der vier "Ouvertüren" (Suiten). Leider durfte er sich 1723 als Thomas-Kantor in Leipzig engagieren und mußte bis zu seinem Tod 1750 seine Zeit damit verschwenden, kleine Jungen zu züchten, Kirchenmusik zu schreiben und mit seinen Vorgesetzten über seine Anstellung zu streiten. Der einzige Lichtblick in dieser Zeit war, daß aus seinem Besuch am Hofe von Friedrich II von Preußen zwei späte Meisterwerke hervorgingen: Ein Musikalisches Opfer und die Kunst der Fuge. Es ist jedoch zweifelhaft, ob Friedrich sie überhaupt gespielt hat - er interessierte sich vorwiegend für Flötenkonzerte im Rokokostil, am liebsten in G-Dur und vorzugsweise von ihm selber geschrieben (oder von Quantz). Und auch Bachs eigene Söhne sind vom Barock ins Rokoko gezogen - einer von ihnen nannte den Vater angeblich "die alte Perücke".

Der Generalmusikdirektor von Hamburg hieß Georg Philipp Telemann. Er war weiser als Bach - er hat sich nähmlich geweigert, das Amt als Thomaskantor zu übernehmen. Und ich weiß nicht, was er in Hamburg verdient hat, aber die Stadt hat schon etwas für das Geld bekommen: Telemann war so unglaublich produktiv, daß er im Guinness-Rekordbuch gelandet ist als der fleißigste Komponist aller Zeiten..

Kunst105.JPG

Und dann gab's ja noch dezu ein gewisser Georg Friedrich Handel. Der Vater hätte ihn lieber als Jurist gesehen, aber mit neun Jahren fing er an, Kantaten zu schreiben. Später wurden daraus Oratorien und eine unheimlich lange Reihe von Opern - aber zum Glück auch Instrumentalkonzerte und Kammermusik (sonst hätte ich ihm hier nicht so viele Zeilen gewidmet!). Er war ein Jahr also organist in Halle angestellt, ist dann nach Italien gefahren, wo er vier Jahre geblieben ist, aber wenn ihm vom hannoverischen Kurfürst den Posten des Kapellmeisters für jährlich 1500 Reichsthaler angeboten wurde, nahm er die Pferdekutsche zurück nach Deutschland, ist aber ein Paar mal nach England gereist .. und letzt endlich ist er dort geblieben.

EN: On the way to Italy he left two trunks with early works back home - and they got lost. On the way to England he lost the two dots over the 'a' so from now on his name was George Frideric (or Frederick) Handel. And in London he made himself a comfortable living by writing operas. But then queen Anne died and her successor was ... the prince elector of Hannover. But clever Handel managed to appease him by hiring a boat and an orchestra and let it play his specially composed Watermusic while sailing up and down the Thames. Later in life he became slightly more religious and wrote oratories instead of operas - some of you may have noticed the unavoidable Messiah, which has a tendency to be sung around Christmas (but not in my flat).

Kunst152.JPG
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Re: Iversen's second multiconfused log thread

Postby Iversen » Sat Jan 11, 2020 2:52 pm

Most of you have probably heard about JS Bach (before reading about him in this thread). Others may have heard of a guy named Haydn. But what happened betweeen those two? That's the theme of today's message.

Karl III Philipp von der Pfalz.jpg

GER: Der Kurfürst Karl III. Philipp von der Pfalz (Bild oben), dessen Hauptstadt Mannheim war, hat die Musik so sehr gemocht, daß er ein Orchester geschaffen hat, daß absolute Spitze sein sollte. Und um den mit Kompositionen zu füttern hat er und sein Nachfolger Karl Theodor gute deutsche Musiker wie Johann, Carl und Anton Stamitz, FX Richter, Beck, Fränzl, Cannabich und Holzbauer angestellt. Ahem, hab' ich da "deutsche" geschrieben? Tatsächlich sind die hälfte davon Böhmisch, und sie haben die darauf folgende drei Deutschen und den Österreicher trainiert. Weil ich Tschechisch (oder Böhmisch) nur als die Verwandte einer gewissen anderen Sprache betrachte, werdet ihr die Erklärung auf Slowakisch erhalten.

SLK: Ján Václav Antonín Stamic (1717-1757) stal sa predchodcom dynastie husľových skladateľov, ktorí našli zamestnanie pod ochrannými krídlami náčelníka cintorína v Mannheime. Keď však Nemci nemohli vysloviť svoje meno, volal sa Johann Wenzel Anton Stamitz. A jeho dvaja synovia Carl Philipp Stamitz a Anton Thadäus Johann Nepomuk Stamitz - obaja významní skladatelia zo školy Mannheimej - boli v skutočnosti Karel a Antonín, ale samozrejme sa stali známymi iba pod ich nemeckými krycími názvami. Chytro! A ' Franz Xaver Richter'? Môžem vám predstaviť František Xaver Richter..

FR: Il faut pourtant admettre que certains des compositeurs nommés ci-dessus ont échappé à Paris, ou quelqu'un avait inventé les soi-disant Concerts Spirituels. Mais au moment de la révolution ils ont peut-être regretté leur choix.

SLK: V malom meste, ako je Mannheim, samozrejme neexistoval priestor pre všetkých skladateľov Čechov, takže niektorí hľadali iné nemecké hlavné mestá. Pruský Friedrich II (v Postupime/Potsdame) sa zjavne stretol s členmi rodiny Benda - hádajte, odkiaľ pochádzajú. Jeho hlavným dodávateľom flautových koncertov v G bol však nemecký Johann Joachim Quantz.

GER: DIe brüder Joseph und Michael Haydn wurden in Rohrau, Österreich, in der Nähe von Ungarn geboren, und sie sprachen Deutsch. Der jüngere Bruder Michael war eigentlich ein ausgezeichneter Komponist, aber im Schatten eines Superstars zu leben ist gar nicht einfach. Bruder Joseph war viele Jahre bei Prinz Paul Anton von Esterhazy beschäftigt - und ironischerweise befindet sich das Schloß der Esterhazy tatsächlich in Ungarn (wie der Name zeigt). Aus Fürsorge für den alten Gregor Werner, der erste Kapellmeister war, hat der Prinz den Haydn zuerst nur als zweiter Kapellmeister angestellt - doch als Werner starb, stieg Joseph Haydn auf den ersten Platz auf. Und dort hatte er drei Probleme: seine Frau, die sich keinerlei für die Musik interessierte und die seine Notenblätter als Backpapier verwendete, die Entfernung vom Schloss Esterhazy zu alles anderes (vor allem Wien) und die Liebe des Prinzen zu einem fremdartigen Instrument namens Baryton, die niemand sonst - früher oder nachher - geteilt hat. Der gütige Paul Anton von Esterhazy starb aber in 1790 und wurde von dem sparsamen Sohn Anton abgelöst, der als erstes das total überflüssigen Hofensemble von Haydn demolierte. Dies ermöglichte aber Haydn, der inzwischen berühmt geworden war, zwei Konzertreisen nach London zu unternehmen, wofür er die letzten zwölf von insgesamt 104 Sinfonien schrieb.

SW: Jag har alltid varit djupt imponerad av produktiviteten hos de anställda kompositörerna i barocktiden och den följande klassiska eran - den sjönk dramatiskt när kompositörerna blev egenföretagare. Det finns naturligtvis undantag, till exempel den finska dirigent ock komponist Segerstam, som per september 2019 hade skrivit 335 symfonier. Enligt Wikipedia måste de utföras utan dirigent, och förklaringen är naturligtvis att Segerstam inte har tid - han skriver redan på nästa symfoni!

EN: And the old form of employment is, of course, the explanation for me not immediately to plunge into a lot of babble about W.A. Mozart and Beethoven - they had already dropped the thing with the permanent employment at a church or court. But Mozart in particular (and Schubert after him) still wrote music at a frenetic pace - luckily. As Aokoye suggests in 'the other music thread', Schubert actually wrote so much - not least Lieder - that you can forgive him for writing seventeen operas which nobody ever stages due to their ridiculous libretti.

Kunst011.JPG

By the way: I have made some calculations as to how many messages it'll take me to reach the end of the thether for Western classical music - at least 12, and then I still haven't managed to clean out in all the corners. When I'm through I'll need a good long holiday...
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