Your Language Learning Weaknesses

General discussion about learning languages
Speakeasy
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Re: Your Language Learning Weaknesses

Postby Speakeasy » Tue Jul 10, 2018 8:29 pm

Xmmm wrote: ... If you watch a 45 minute TV show, it is composed of scenes...
I would have to agree. In addition, I would suggest that the dialogue deployed in the average TV show or film is actually quite limited both as to quantity and expressiveness. That is, the plots are simplistic and astonishingly repetitive, the scenes call more upon the viewer's ability to follow the physical action, as the camera jumps quickly about and as the scenes switch every few seconds, than his aural acuity. Extended, vocabulary-rich dialogues are quite rare. What dialogues do exist are often delivered very quickly, either for dramatic or for comedic effect. I no longer consider the average TV shown or film to be a valuable source of expanding my understanding of my target languages. Clipped, taught, mumbled speech is freely available from anyone working behind a counter ... and you can always, politely, ask them to repeat their utterances.

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Re: Your Language Learning Weaknesses

Postby NoManches » Wed Jul 11, 2018 2:41 am

Cainntear wrote:
kulaputra wrote:I feel I'm repeating myself so I'm probably going to let this topic be after this post.

You aren't -- you're defending your standpoint and explaining where you're coming from, which makes for a productive discussion.
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Agreed! Not to mention you've learned multiple languages so you have different experiences than people like myself (who've only learned 1 foreign language).

I don't necessarily agree with everything you've said but who knows, maybe with more experience I'll change my opinions on certain things. If everyone on this forum agreed on everything and didn't have different ideas then I probably wouldn't be a member here :D
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Re: Your Language Learning Weaknesses

Postby Cainntear » Wed Jul 11, 2018 9:37 pm

Xmmm wrote:That's how you get a number like 60% comprehension. It applies to long TV shows (or books). Easy parts mix with hard parts and you average it.

Hmmm.... books don't have the same visuals to help cue understanding though. With TV, a change of scene helps reset and reground the viewer, whereas I find a change of scene in a book I don't really understand to be very disorientating.
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Xmmm
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Re: Your Language Learning Weaknesses

Postby Xmmm » Wed Jul 11, 2018 10:14 pm

Cainntear wrote:
Xmmm wrote:That's how you get a number like 60% comprehension. It applies to long TV shows (or books). Easy parts mix with hard parts and you average it.

Hmmm.... books don't have the same visuals to help cue understanding though. With TV, a change of scene helps reset and reground the viewer, whereas I find a change of scene in a book I don't really understand to be very disorientating.


Yes, I'd agree with that. The "60% comprehension" number is sketchier for books. When I reported 60% comprehension for the first few Italian books I read, it meant I could tell you the meaning of random paragraphs or pages but didn't have clue what the overall book was about.

But the learner needs some way to measure progress, right? If I'm reading a book in Wolof, I have 0% comprehension for sure. But if I'm reading a book in Italian and understand one third of the paragraphs, then my comprehension is 33% ... which functionally may be pretty close to zero. But it tells me as a user that I'm improving relative to where I was at two months ago when I was at 25%, or whatever. And yes you cross some magic line (80%) and everything makes a lot more sense, but it's unsatisfactory for the learner to go "0% 0% 0% 0% 0% whoa 80%".
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