Study on Language Improvement with Native Materials

[rdearman]

Can I track my time offline with MS Excel or will I have to use Google Sheets online?

You only have to report back monthly, I actually expected everyone to use offline spreadsheets. So either is fine.

Can I know who in the other Group I'll be compared with? Username if LLorg member, language background if not LLorg member, maybe.

You will not be compared directly one-to-one. The data will be aggregated and anonymous.

There are very detailled instructions of what people in Study Group have to do as they read or watch: keep pausing video/audio to repeat every sentence they understand, etc. Should things like that be tracked separately from normal watching/listening? Or does it actually not matter whether people do it or not? I assume every single instruction in the pdf is significant and will have to be tracked or else why give the instruction.

Yes, they are detailed, and yes you should do it. But how could I possibly track it?

If I were to write out detailed instructions for how to train for a marathon, and one of the instructions is to always breathe in and out when your left foot hits the ground. Should I have you stop running and call me every-time you accidentally breathe out when your right foot hits the ground? No, I'm giving you a general instruction which you should try to do as much as you can. But I wouldn't expect you to generate a running log where you recorded 12,354 steps with left breathing and 6 steps right breathing. I would simply give you guidelines on how to breath, and to record your running times. If you asked me why you should breath in and out on one foot, I would say it is so you avoid getting a side stitch when you run. With increased running speed, your body needs more oxygen. Irregular and shallow breathing can especially lead to a side stitch. As is an efficient stride, the breathing rhythm is also crucial.

Actually it doesn't say to pause the video to repeat the sentence. It says to repeat every sentence you understand in full, and if you need more time, to pause the video.

When you hear a phrase which you know the meaning of in its entirety you should repeat it out loud to yourself. For example a character shouts over the fence to the neighbour. “Hey you’ve blocked my drive!” try to repeat the sentence. Pause the video if you need to in order to repeat the phrase.

So the study guide is how you should do each task. The spreadsheet with show you what you should track. Hope that answers the question.

[smallwhite]

I'm posting a draft tracking sheet here, for comments.

You only have to report back monthly, I actually expected everyone to use offline spreadsheets. So either is fine.

Great, then the format doesn't matter since I can use my own format during the month, and my main questions for now are:

1. What do those "Activities" mean? I didn't understand some of them. Can we please have explanations? Either more detailled activity names or short names with a legend somewhere within the spreadsheet.

2. Which activity requires which fields? Please tell us this also within the spreadsheet.

You will not be compared directly one-to-one. The data will be aggregated and anonymous.

I see. For some reason I thought there was also 1-to-1 or sub-group-to-sub-group comparison.

There are very detailled instructions of what people in Study Group have to do as they read or watch

But how could I possibly track it?

Why, the same way you track any other activity:

Activity List
* Listening normally
* Listening while repeating aka shadowing
* Reading normally
* Reading while listening to audio
* Watching normally
* Watching while repeating transparent sentences according to rdearman's instructions

Should I have you stop running and call me every-time you...

No, of course not, we have a tracking spreadsheet! We do not have to call you when we switch from listening-while-shadowing to listening-normally because we can track it in our spreadsheets. Similarly, we do not have to call you when we switch from watching-while-repeating to watching-normally because we can track it in our spreadsheets.

[zenmonkey]

I'm posting a draft tracking sheet here, for comments.

You only have to report back monthly, I actually expected everyone to use offline spreadsheets. So either is fine.

Great, then the format doesn't matter since I can use my own format during the month, and my main questions for now are:

1. What do those "Activities" mean? I didn't understand some of them. Can we please have explanations? Either more detailled activity names or short names with a legend somewhere within the spreadsheet.

2. Which activity requires which fields? Please tell us this also within the spreadsheet.

You will not be compared directly one-to-one. The data will be aggregated and anonymous.

Ok, I'll try to explain how to work the spreadsheet. You have short and long descriptions. If the below is not clear, please let me know.

Let's say you are going to watch the new series "Hobbit and Friends" in Italian and you are going to sometimes repeat the text and sometimes not (because it drives everyone else nuts).

Note that the spreadsheet has two tabs at the bottom:

Screen Shot 2017-07-17 at 12.28.21.png

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I) First, create two entries in the Material tab. One for each type of watching. You only need to create new entries here the first time you are going to use a material. If you already created the Material, then skip to step II :

Screen Shot 2017-07-17 at 12.14.33.png

(A) is the Activity Short Description, for you, written by you which will be useful for choosing from a list (see step II). What you write here does not matter, it won't be analysed.

(B) is the Activity Type, selected from the drop down reference list, for this activity. It is what matters for the analysis. If you think an activity type is missing, let me know.

(C) Is your long description, outlining the material used and type of use. It is open text.

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II) Second, once the Material exists you can easily choose it on the Activity tab

Screen Shot 2017-07-17 at 12.27.11.png

Once selected, add time spent, comprehesion and attention for that session.

[smallwhite]

1. What do those "Activities" mean? I didn't understand some of them. Can we please have explanations? Either more detailled activity names or short names with a legend somewhere within the spreadsheet.

2. Which activity requires which fields? Please tell us this also within the spreadsheet.

Ok, I'll try to explain how to work the spreadsheet.

I'm so sorry! I hope someone else found that detailled explanation useful. I understood that part; I understood how to use the Spreadsheet technical-wise.

By "1. What do those "Activities" mean?" I mean what does "L-R - Listening - reading L2" mean, or what does "Using Book-based Method" mean that is different from "course book - xxx", or what does "L-R - Listening L2" mean since isn't that the same as "Listening normally".

And by "2. Which activity requires which fields?" I mean, "Listening normally" requires the fields "Comprehension" and "Attention", how about "course book - study new", does that require the field "Comprehension", etc. Which fields are compulsory for each "Activity"?

[zenmonkey]

1. What do those "Activities" mean? I didn't understand some of them. Can we please have explanations? Either more detailled activity names or short names with a legend somewhere within the spreadsheet.

2. Which activity requires which fields? Please tell us this also within the spreadsheet.

Ok, I'll try to explain how to work the spreadsheet.

I'm so sorry! I hope someone else found that detailled explanation useful. I understood that part; I understood how to use the Spreadsheet technical-wise.

By "1. What do those "Activities" mean?" I mean what does "L-R - Listening - reading L2" mean, or what does "Using Book-based Method" mean that is different from "course book - xxx", or what does "L-R - Listening L2" mean since isn't that the same as "Listening normally".

And by "2. Which activity requires which fields?" I mean, "Listening normally" requires the fields "Comprehension" and "Attention", how about "course book - study new", does that require the field "Comprehension", etc. Which fields are compulsory for each "Activity"?

Valid questions, no apologies. I'll clarify both later today.

[zenmonkey]

1. What do those "Activities" mean? I didn't understand some of them. Can we please have explanations? Either more detailled activity names or short names with a legend somewhere within the spreadsheet.

2. Which activity requires which fields? Please tell us this also within the spreadsheet.

Ok, I'll try to explain how to work the spreadsheet.

I'm so sorry! I hope someone else found that detailled explanation useful. I understood that part; I understood how to use the Spreadsheet technical-wise.

By "1. What do those "Activities" mean?" I mean what does "L-R - Listening - reading L2" mean, or what does "Using Book-based Method" mean that is different from "course book - xxx", or what does "L-R - Listening L2" mean since isn't that the same as "Listening normally".

And by "2. Which activity requires which fields?" I mean, "Listening normally" requires the fields "Comprehension" and "Attention", how about "course book - study new", does that require the field "Comprehension", etc. Which fields are compulsory for each "Activity"?

Spreadsheet has been updated.

1) I've added explanations and links to the Activity Types on the Material tab. If they are not sufficient or remain unclear, please let me know. Also, I've had to create a few or adjust others, let me know if this raises questions or if I missed something. (column m)

2) I've created conditional formatting rules so that those that require Comprehension or Attention will show red if you have not filled them. Once filled, they turn normal color. The rules for the formatting are also on the Material tab. They may need some adjustments. (column n)

Link: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... sp=sharing

[smallwhite]

Spreadsheet has been updated.

Thank you!

I do have a few questions:

1.
Speaking/Conversation ... Time spent speaking not related to shadowing or tandems. 3

If this "Activity Type" above requires the field "Comprehension" then I assume it's strictly multi-person conversation and not applicable to self-talk, monologues and conversations with pets and mirrors? And we need a separate "Activity Type" for the latter?

2.
Using Memrise ... Using Memrise on phone or web

Will this be counted towards "Vocabulary"? At least Cavesa and I use Memrise for conjugation drill which would be under "Grammar". Rearranging the words is also "Grammar". Sometimes I use it for "Listening". Or does it not matter?

3.
Reading (L2 only) with word look-up ... Reading in L2 with the use of a dictionary or word look up. Also known as intensive reading. Not bilingual material. ... 1

course book - study new ... Books intended specifically for language learning - studying new material ... 1

Does "Comprehension" here refer to comprehension before or after the activity?

Intensive Reading: I understood 70% of the story before I used the dictionary and 90% after. Do I enter 7 or 9?

Coursebook: Material is new but this is my 3rd Germanic language so I already knew 80% of this stuff. Explanations are confusing so after reading I still only understand 90% of the stuff. Or, explanations are confusing and I only understand 60% of the explanations. Do I enter 8 or 9 or 6?

4.
Why have "Activity Type" on the "Material" tab and have users create dozens if not hundreds of "Activity Short Description"s? Why not use "Activity Type"s directly on the "Activity" tab? The extra steps don't seem necessary.

Thank you again!

[zenmonkey]

Spreadsheet has been updated.

Thank you!

Welcome! It is great having the questions. Makes for a much better outcome.

I do have a few questions:

1.
Speaking/Conversation ... Time spent speaking not related to shadowing or tandems. 3

If this "Activity Type" above requires the field "Comprehension" then I assume it's strictly multi-person conversation and not applicable to self-talk, monologues and conversations with pets and mirrors? And we need a separate "Activity Type" for the latter?

2.
Using Memrise ... Using Memrise on phone or web

Will this be counted towards "Vocabulary"? At least Cavesa and I use Memrise for conjugation drill which would be under "Grammar". Rearranging the words is also "Grammar". Sometimes I use it for "Listening". Or does it not matter?

3.
Reading (L2 only) with word look-up ... Reading in L2 with the use of a dictionary or word look up. Also known as intensive reading. Not bilingual material. ... 1

course book - study new ... Books intended specifically for language learning - studying new material ... 1

Does "Comprehension" here refer to comprehension before or after the activity?

Intensive Reading: I understood 70% of the story before I used the dictionary and 90% after. Do I enter 7 or 9?

Coursebook: Material is new but this is my 3rd Germanic language so I already knew 80% of this stuff. Explanations are confusing so after reading I still only understand 90% of the stuff. Or, explanations are confusing and I only understand 60% of the explanations. Do I enter 8 or 9 or 6?

4.
Why have "Activity Type" on the "Material" tab and have users create dozens if not hundreds of "Activity Short Description"s? Why not use "Activity Type"s directly on the "Activity" tab? The extra steps don't seem necessary.

Thank you again!

1 - I assumed multiperson convo - but could be used with both that and self-talk (and pets) then comp entered would be NA. If rdearman want another type for self-talk I'll add it.

Which brings me to a specific point, some of the answers below are study design decisions - I'll make a best guess, rdearman should review the proposed activity types and make some command decisions.

2 - Doesn't matter. I'm just booking the tool RD may contradict.

3 - Comprehension - comprehension refers to the global activity so I'd say 'after using the dictionary'. And it is specific to the time spent on the activity. If you think that you knew the material 80% but after reading you find it is only 60% because it is a confusing explanation. I'd note 60%. RD may contradict.

4 - I created the Material tab because one then only creates Activity Types once but may use it 100 times on the front tracking sheet. This way it is possible to have details of the type of material being used and ask RD may ask further questions without having us enter detail about the material each time. One doesn't have to ask length of material questions each time (personally I don't think asking that is that useful but it isn't my study).

If you prefer to use it without specifying the material details - (check with RD) - then just enter the short description once which matches the material type.

We could have stuck to a bare minimum sheet without asking material details or description or length but I think this provides a useful compromise. But thinking about it, yes, we could have a minimum entry version instead - (RD decision here).

[smallwhite]

4 - I created the Material tab because one then only creates Activity Types once but may use it 100 times on the front tracking sheet. This way it is possible to have details of the type of material being used and ask RD may ask further questions without having us enter detail about the material each time. One doesn't have to ask length of material questions each time (personally I don't think asking that is that useful but it isn't my study).

If you prefer to use it without specifying the material details - (check with RD) - then just enter the short description once which matches the material type.

We could have stuck to a bare minimum sheet without asking material details or description or length but I think this provides a useful compromise.

I believe you mean creates "Activity Short Description"s and "Activity Long Description"s once.

I do mean entering Material Length and entering just once. And skipping "Activity Short Description" and "Activity Long Description" altogether.

Activity tab:
(date time etc, Activity Type, Book or Movie Title, ...)

Material tab:
Activity Type
Book List (Title, Length in Pages)
Movie List (Title, Length in Minutes)

(Book & Movie in separate lists because titles can duplicate and units of count are different. Append prefix "book" or "movie" before using in dropdown list).

"Activity Type" is directly useable. "Activity Short Desc" and "Activity Long Desc" are not necessary. Skipping them saves users' time especially if they read many short articles and watch many short Youtube videos and do various activities with each material, and saves RD time because spreadsheets collected will be directly useable.

Unless I'm missing the purpose of this intermediate step of merging Material Title to Activity Type before using the merged field on the timesheet?

[zenmonkey]

4 - I created the Material tab because one then only creates Activity Types once but may use it 100 times on the front tracking sheet. This way it is possible to have details of the type of material being used and ask RD may ask further questions without having us enter detail about the material each time. One doesn't have to ask length of material questions each time (personally I don't think asking that is that useful but it isn't my study).

If you prefer to use it without specifying the material details - (check with RD) - then just enter the short description once which matches the material type.

We could have stuck to a bare minimum sheet without asking material details or description or length but I think this provides a useful compromise.

I believe you mean creates "Activity Short Description"s and "Activity Long Description"s once.

I do mean entering Material Length and entering just once. And skipping "Activity Short Description" and "Activity Long Description" altogether.

Activity tab:
(date time etc, Activity Type, Book or Movie Title, ...)

Material tab:
Activity Type
Book List (Title, Length in Pages)
Movie List (Title, Length in Minutes)

(Book & Movie in separate lists because titles can duplicate and units of count are different. Append prefix "book" or "movie" before using in dropdown list).

"Activity Type" is directly useable. "Activity Short Desc" and "Activity Long Desc" are not necessary. Skipping them saves users' time especially if they read many short articles and watch many short Youtube videos and do various activities with each material, and saves RD time because spreadsheets collected will be directly useable.

Unless I'm missing the purpose of this intermediate step of merging Material Title to Activity Type before using the merged field on the timesheet?

Yes, meant that. Or we can call them "Material entries" in the Material tab.

The material descriptions may or may not be necessary - again that's an RD decision - but if I remove that section then length per material also goes or needs to be entered for each activity event. If one is really reading many short articles (for example, from wikipedia) or videos from youtube then one can decide to just create single entries with a description "short article, generic, length variable" or "youtube video, cartoon series, length variable" or whatever seems reasonable to you as sufficiently descriptive to be referenced later if RD has questions. The idea of having something descriptive is for RD to be able to reach back to the participants and ask additional questions if he chooses to do so. If we skip the descriptions all together - that is going to be quite more difficult.

The output of the spreadsheet will be 'almost' directly useable - what I have not shown is the flat file representation that brings it all together. Please see tab "Flat". Here is the link:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... sp=sharing

Flat file outputs can then be consolidated directly into a statistical package (SPSS, PSPP, JASP, etc..), a master Excel sheet or dropped into a database for analysis.

There are some possible issues with the spreadsheet which involve data validation (users can enter values out of scope) and data consistency (if one edits the activity types on the material list it will screw things up...) and date format (you can still enter the wrong date format... I'm actually concerned about this one - I will fix that before the final version).

But I've tried to focus all my formulas on standard equations that should work on google sheets but also on Excel on Mac or PC (down to version 5 of Excel). Before we do a final release I'll do a version check too.