Selecting a Dictionary: L1, L2, L1/L2

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Speakeasy
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Selecting a Dictionary: L1, L2, L1/L2

Postby Speakeasy » Thu Jun 08, 2017 10:12 pm

Recently, a fellow member asked me for my recommendations of a German-English/English-German dictionary. I thought about this for a while and, rather make specific recommendations, I decided to open a new discussion thread dealing with the more general question of “selecting a dictionary”; that is, the criteria, the process, et cetera that members use in arriving at their individual decisions. If this topic has been raised and discussed in the past, please feel at liberty to post links, submit quotations and the like. My own brief comments on selecting dictionaries follow:

First, I would note that, for the “popular” languages, there are simply too many good alternatives as well as some bad, or at least disappointing, ones. Second, in selecting a dictionary, I always consider matters such as: physical size, usable content, current and foreseeable needs, and cost. Third, although it is not always feasible, when looking for dictionary, I try to find a bookstore that offers a wide selection of large and small unilingual and bilingual dictionaries, so that I can make a direct comparison.

In comparing dictionaries, I often arrive with a list of fifty-or-more words and, going through the list, I compare the entries for these words in each of the dictionaries. Based on my appreciation of the fullness of the definitions, the examples, and any ancillary information, I make a selection of one small bilingual, one large bilingual, and one large unilingual L2 dictionary. Then, taking into consideration my budget and my “realistic” commitment to learning the L2 language in question, I make a purchase. To be truthful, sometime later, I convince myself to return to the bookstore and pick up whatever I had put aside and, a couple of years thereafter, donate these secondary choices to a local library or to a charitable organisation.

Obviously, there are many more choices available online. Unfortunately, comparing the dictionaries online is frequently impossible. To make matters worse, the online “customer reviews” of dictionaries are no more reliable than those of introductory language courses, genre: “Two weeks after beginning this course (I did not have time to complete it), I spent four days visiting Rome and everyone I met there complimented me on my fluent Italian as well as my flawless accent.” So, this brings us all back to asking for specific recommendations on language blogs, where competing dictionaries will be suggested. Often, the well-intentioned recommendations are absent of a clear statement as to “why” these choices are better than others, whereas a description of the selection criteria and decision-making processes are not revealed or discussed.

So then, on behalf of the member who asked me for a specific recommendation, I invite you all to describe the “how and why” of your selection criteria and your decision-making process. Merci à l’avance!

EDITED: Typos, of course!
Last edited by Speakeasy on Fri Jun 09, 2017 3:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
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aokoye
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Re: Selecting a Dictionary: L1, L2, L1/L2

Postby aokoye » Fri Jun 09, 2017 12:47 am

L1 (English) dictionary choices - I only use online/electronic dictionaries (for reasons I will explain). I use the subscription based OED, the Oxford American Dictionary (only because it's what my MacBook defaults to), Urban Dictionary, and Wiktionary to a small extent as well as Google's dictionary function to a slightly larger extent. The OED I mainly use to look up the origin and etymology of a word though occasionally I'll use it at school when I'm hanging out with linguistics friends and we're being snarky about a word. The reasons I use online dictionaries are multi-fold. They aren't heavy, because they aren't made of paper they can have as many entries, definitions, examples, etc as the database can hold, and they get updated frequently (because, again, not paper). I like Urban Dictionary and Wiktionary because they are user generated. As I'm sure multiple people have picked up by now, I'm very much a descriptivist and I'd much prefer to know how a word is used by a number of people who use it on a regular basis as opposed to how it is deemed to be used by a selection committee. Additionally new words will show up quicker in Urban Dictionary and Wiktionary than they will the OED (and the like) because of the OED's selection process.

L2 (German)
- I use Duden's online dictionary, Duden-Wissensnetz deutsche Sprache (again - it came with my Macbook), and occasionally Langenscheidt's Power Wörterbuch Deutsch which is the only paper dictionary I own and use on any sort of more than once a decade basis. I use Duden because it's "well respected" (which has its upsides and its downsides) and because it's convenient. I bought the Langenscheidt because I like that it gives example sentences. Part of me wishes I used it more but most of me knows that that's unrealistic.

English/German - Dict.cc, Leo (almost never), the Oxford German Dictionary (again, it came installed), and to a small but growing extent Linguee. I use Linguee because of the context in the translation. Dict.cc I use because a. it's user generated (this echos why I like Urban Dictionary), b. I also have the app on my phone and c. it gives me a lot of relevant options in terms of translations. It also does have audio. I use the Oxford German Dict a lot because it's just so convenient. I have my laptop set up so if I tap a word with two fingers the dictionary will pop-up.
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Re: Selecting a Dictionary: L1, L2, L1/L2

Postby aravinda » Fri Jun 09, 2017 3:02 am

Speakeasy wrote:Recently, a fellow member asked me for my recommendations of a German-English/English-German dictionary...
...on behalf of the member who asked me for a specific recommendation, I invite you all to describe the “how and why” of your selection criteria and your decision-making process. Merci à l’avance!

Thank you, Speakeasy. (I am that fellow member, if it is not clear). I posted this question elsewhere on the forum (but including Grammars and being specific to German) before reading your post.

https://forum.language-learners.org/vie ... 112#p76112

Now, what should I do with that post? Delete?

Word list & different forms of a word (conjugated/declined forms)
Your word list makes me curious and also reminds me of other people who had a similar approach. For example, on comparing French dictionaries, one person used to check whether the dictionary had separate entries for certain forms (other than the infinitive) of an irregular verb. The example they gave was the participle "eu" of the verb "avoir". (Maybe not the best example but you get the point).
Interestingly, yesterday I had a similar experience when I was checking my elder daughter's English homework. We checked plural of "potato" in Collins Australian School Dictionary and Australian Primary Oxford Dictionary. Only the latter gave the plural, "potatoes". (This is not a comparison of Collins and Oxford dictionaries. Collins is my go to in bilingual dictionaries).

Nature & extent of definitions
Personally, clarity and conciseness are more useful than coverage/breadth of definitions. This especially applies to the beginner stage but not limited to that. A Latin teacher used to recommend a dictionary that usually gave only main and primary meanings of a word over a dictionary that included multiple and broader secondary meanings of a word. That makes good sense to me.

Number of words
This is something tricky. First, you can't really go by the numbers quoted by the publisher because different dictionaries seem to have a different way of "counting" words. Second is the "actual usefulness" of having so many more words. Speaksay's recommendation of "one small bilingual, one large bilingual, and one large unilingual L2 dictionary" is very much consistent with my own experience and practice with regard to other languages. To be clear, my ideal "small" dictionary is not a Collins Gem type pocket dictionary but a bigger one and my "large" monolingual dictionary would be the largest single-volume dictionary (not a multi-volume dictionary).
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Speakeasy
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Re: Selecting a Dictionary: L1, L2, L1/L2

Postby Speakeasy » Fri Jun 09, 2017 3:21 am

aravinda wrote: ... I posted this question elsewhere on the forum (but including Grammars and being specific to German) before reading your post. https://forum.language-learners.org/vie ... 112#p76112 Now, what should I do with that post? Delete?
From a purely technical standpoint, it is very difficult to delete a post to which someone has already responded. Some members prefer to skirt the technical difficulty by simply "editing" their post by removing the original content and replacing it with a message to the effect that it is no longer required, it has been superseded, or it has been deleted, et cetera. However, as you asked a legitimate question and as smallwhite has provided a thoughtful reply, my advice would be to "let it stand."
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Re: Selecting a Dictionary: L1, L2, L1/L2

Postby Jbean » Fri Jun 09, 2017 3:38 am

I use the Collins Spanish-English and Italian-English because their apps work well and their usage is quite contemporary and extensive. I use the Larousse French-English app because it has adequate usage and it pronounces the words for me. For L2 apps I use DEL (it's free!) and Le Petit Robert which is also a pronouncing dictionary. I use Linguee a lot to translate idiomatic phrases and check usage.
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Re: Selecting a Dictionary: L1, L2, L1/L2

Postby aokoye » Fri Jun 09, 2017 3:52 am

aravinda wrote:Thank you, Speakeasy. (I am that fellow member, if it is not clear). I posted this question elsewhere on the forum (but including Grammars and being specific to German) before reading your post.

https://forum.language-learners.org/vie ... 112#p76112

Now, what should I do with that post? Delete?
I would just keep the post especially given that there has been at least one reply to it as of right now.

Word list & different forms of a word (conjugated/declined forms)
Your word list makes me curious and also reminds me of other people who had a similar approach. For example, on comparing French dictionaries, one person used to check whether the dictionary had separate entries for certain forms (other than the infinitive) of an irregular verb. The example they gave was the participle "eu" of the verb "avoir". (Maybe not the best example but you get the point).
Interestingly, yesterday I had a similar experience when I was checking my elder daughter's English homework. We checked plural of "potato" in Collins Australian School Dictionary and Australian Primary Oxford Dictionary. Only the latter gave the plural, "potatoes". (This is not a comparison of Collins and Oxford dictionaries. Collins is my go to in bilingual dictionaries).
What is the word list that you're talking about? I think you've likely noticed that the intended audience of the dictionary is going to affect how the publishers format said dictionary. When you say that one dictionary gave the plural "potatoes" do you mean that it literally had a different entry for the plural? I personally wouldn't want to use a dictionary, as an adult, that gave a full, or even partial, entry for the plural (I would expect a children's dictionary to potentially provide that though). What I would insist upon from a dictionary aimed at L2 speakers is the plural inflectional morphology for all of the nouns assuming that the language didn't have a single marker for plurals. This is, from what I can tell, pretty common for dictionaries aimed at L2 German speakers (as well as glossaries of DaF textbooks). So for instance, I just opened up the Langenscheidt dictionary I mentioned in my last post and the word Holzfäller looks a bit like this:
der Holzfäller (-s, -) eine Person, die beruflich im Wald Bäume fällt.
hierzu Holzfällerin die
. If you were to look in the beginning section of the dictionary you'd find that the the first part of the info in the parentheses tells you what the genitive singular ending is and the second one (after the comma) is what the plural ending is. In this case there is no plural ending. Honestly it's going to be an issue of space. There's no way a dictionary of around 50k headwords could also provide an entry for the plural of all of the nouns and not have the dictionary essentially be one that isn't reasonably portable. I have similar opinions on the conjugations of verbs. I can see why it would be very very useful for beginners but the sheer size of the dictionary would make it a hindrance for people above a beginner stage. For what it's worth, however, there are books like 501 German verbs and websites like Verbix. This is also yet one more advantage of electronic dictionary (dict.cc has the plural of almost all of the nouns that are used in plural as well as much of the conjugation information for verbs.

Nature & extent of definitions
Personally, clarity and conciseness are more useful than coverage/breadth of definitions. This especially applies to the beginner stage but not limited to that. A Latin teacher used to recommend a dictionary that usually gave only main and primary meanings of a word over a dictionary that included multiple and broader secondary meanings of a word. That makes good sense to me.
I can see this being very true for beginners and somewhat true for dead languages with an arguably limited amount of written texts. For living languages, however, I really disagree with the idea that for people who aren't beginners one or two definitions is better than five or six.

Number of words
This is something tricky. First, you can't really go by the numbers quoted by the publisher because different dictionaries seem to have a different way of "counting" words. Second is the "actual usefulness" of having so many more words. Speaksay's recommendation of "one small bilingual, one large bilingual, and one large unilingual L2 dictionary" is very much consistent with my own experience and practice with regard to other languages. To be clear, my ideal "small" dictionary is not a Collins Gem type pocket dictionary but a bigger one and my "large" monolingual dictionary would be the largest single-volume dictionary (not a multi-volume dictionary).
I agree in terms of the numbers quoted issue. There's a reason why Langenscheidt says (in German) "Around 50,000 headwords" I think you'll find that eventually you'll run into words that aren't in your dictionary and that you can't easily guess from context (or that you have no desire to guess from context). I mean I've already run into that with the 50k dictionary. There are a lot of words that I come across that just aren't in that dictionary. This is true both for words that are in textbooks and words that are in newspapers or TV shows. For what it's worth I'm also studying German at a C1 level so my needs are different than yours.

You also run into the issue of new words and new/renewed uses for "old" words. The OED typically waits 10 years before adding a new word. 10 years. Add to that the amount of time it takes to process the new word and then the number of times a new dictionary is published. Language changes far faster than that and that is one of the beauties of user generated dictionaries (people also generally self police very well in terms of these things). This limitation of paper dictionaries has actually seen judges using Urban Dictionary and the like for some cases.

Speakeasy's suggestion just wouldn't work well for me and that's fine. What works for one person won't work for another and we all need to find what works well for us individually.
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Re: Selecting a Dictionary: L1, L2, L1/L2

Postby mcthulhu » Fri Jun 09, 2017 4:25 am

Some of us were learning languages and buying dictionaries long before online dictionaries existed; and depending on the language, you might also be in the same situation today, for less commonly taught languages for which no really good online resources exist (yet). In some cases there may not have been all that many decent hard copy dictionaries to choose from, either. Generally my purchase decisions were based on reputation, I guess - if a trusted expert in the language tells you that X is the best/standard dictionary for that language, X is probably what you should get. I've been lucky enough to work with a lot of people who knew what they were talking about. Of course, sometimes you go with what's available.

Naturally I've accumulated dictionaries, like most people obsessed with languages. Some of them were technical dictionaries, for fields not covered very thoroughly by general dictionaries. Some of them were other general dictionaries that I thought might cover gaps in what I already had, maybe because they just had more headwords, or more extensive idioms. I've occasionally used a few test words that I knew from my experience as a translator often presented problems and were not always well explained in other dictionaries; if a dictionary got those right, it was a plus. I never bothered with 50+ words, though, which would have been overkill for me.

Of course, if I noticed mistakes in a dictionary, that tended to disqualify it.

I've picked up small pocket dictionaries in the past, but have generally found that they are not worth the trouble - not enough coverage. They may be a step above phrase books, but that's about it.

I've never been too concerned about getting the dictionary with the longest entries. Sometimes too much information just gets in the way; I'm usually in a hurry to get back to what I was doing and don't want to wade through a solid wall of (sometimes tiny) text to find the answer I was looking for. Usually the essential range of meanings of a word is all I want; one of my pet peeves is L2-L1 dictionaries that seem to try to pad out definitions with every possible English synonym, when one or two words would have been enough. So, I agree with aravinda that clarity and efficiency are a plus. I should probably mention here that visual presentation and organization matter, because they help you to see information faster; packing as much text into a page as possible is not always a good thing. Some dictionaries are a pleasure to use, and some aren't.

It's also a plus if an L1-L2 dictionary provides usage guidance on choosing among possible translations, such as highlighting which of the words is the common one and so should be the default translation (not all dictionaries do this), which ones are bookish/formal, which are slang, etc.

I've never cared about slang coverage, or the latest slang. I've mostly had to work with standard literary or technical language. Maybe that would have been different if I'd been working with different materials. This is something where people's needs will differ.

I'd expect to see some grammatical information, at least what declension/conjugation a word belongs to, and the stems required to inflect it if it's irregular.

I'm still occasionally buying dictionaries, both paper and apps, sometimes as an impulse purchase, and I have rarely gotten rid of any of my collection of dictionaries. I have to say that I'm more likely these days to use an online dictionary than a paper one, when possible; but I'm not always at a computer.
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Re: Selecting a Dictionary: L1, L2, L1/L2

Postby Chung » Fri Jun 09, 2017 7:04 am

Speakeasy wrote:Recently, a fellow member asked me for my recommendations of a German-English/English-German dictionary. I thought about this for a while and, rather make specific recommendations, I decided to open a new discussion thread dealing with the more general question of “selecting a dictionary”; that is, the criteria, the process, et cetera that members use in arriving at their individual decisions. If this topic has been raised and discussed in the past, please feel at liberty to post links, submit quotations and the like. My own brief comments on selecting dictionaries follow:

First, I would note that for the “popular” languages, there are simply too many good alternatives as well as some bad, or at least disappointing, ones. Second, in selecting a dictionary, I always consider matters such as: physical size, usable content, current and foreseeable needs, and cost. Third, although it is not always feasible, when looking for dictionary, I try to find a bookstore that offers a wide selection of large and small unilingual and bilingual dictionaries, so that I can make a direct comparison.

In comparing dictionaries, I often arrive with a list of fifty-or-more words and, going through the list, I compare the entries for these words in each of the dictionaries. Based on my appreciation of the fullness of the definitions, the examples, and any ancillary information, I make a selection of one small bilingual, one large bilingual, and one large unilingual L2 dictionary. Then, taking into consideration my budget and my “realistic” commitment to learning the L2 language in question, I make a purchase. To be truthful, sometime later, I convince myself to return to the bookstore and pick up whatever I had put aside and, a couple of years thereafter, donate these secondary choices to a local library or to a charitable organisation.

Obviously, there are many more choices available online. Unfortunately, comparing the dictionaries online is frequently impossible. To make matters worse, the online “customer reviews” of dictionaries are no more reliable than those of introductory language courses, genre: “Two weeks after beginning this course (I did not have time to complete it), I spent four days visiting Rome and everyone I met there complimented me on my fluent Italian as well as my flawless accent.” So, this brings us all back to asking for specific recommendations on language blogs, where competing dictionaries will be suggested. Often, the well-intended recommendations are absent of a clear statement as to “why” these choices are better than others, whereas a description of the selection criteria and decision-making processes are not revealed or discussed.

So then, on behalf of the member who asked me for a specific recommendation, I invite you all to describe the “how and why” of your selection criteria and your decision-making process. Merci à l’avance!


My choice of a bilingual dictionary is guided mainly by how useful I think that it will be for me. To keep the discussion reasonably concise, I'll answer your post as if I were embarking on the study of a language that I've never studied before (i.e. looking for my first bilingual dictionary for the target language). I'm also fairly old-fashioned by preferring to learn the basics without turning on my computer, and do like hard copies of dictionaries (and textbooks) over an online version or just a .pdf on-screen (I do acknowledge though that there are a few decent online bilingual dictionaries for beginners such as Lingea and PONS).

In this instance, I'd put priority on an English-[target language]/[target language]-English dictionary that advertises itself as containing roughly 75,000 (-/+ 30,000) headwords and/or 100,000 (-/+ 25,000) translations. Examples would be this one and this one. Minor plusses for me with this first bilingual dictionary would be if it's paperback (I don't feel that guilty as I wear it down with frequent use and if it becomes dog-eared and/or beaten up in my bag), has maximum dimensions of about 8 x 5 inches in area and 2.5 inches in thickness, and if there are appendices with summaries on grammar. Even more supplements such as ones with sample business letters or detailed pronunciation keys (with or without IPA) aren't important to me as a beginner since I routinely seek other material for that kind of information. Unless I can get them very cheaply on Amazon Marketplace or similar, I don't go for large dictionaries at this stage as they're overkill (e.g. Collins Robert French Unabridged Dictionary, Oxford-PWN Polish-English English-Polish Dictionary). As a few rules of thumb these dictionaries usually bear the words "Unabridged", "Large", "Academic", "Comprehensive" in the title, come in more than volume, and/or contain about 1500 pages at minimum.

What I'm definitely not after in this first dictionary is something advertised with fewer than 30,000 headwords and that's not cross-referenced to English, although with languages at a very low profile I need to break my rules. Case in point: I had to spring for Sammallahti's Finnish-Northern Saami/Northern Saami-Finnish dictionary, although I did know just enough Finnish to make it useful, and could combine it with my copy of Gummerus' Finnish-English/English-Finnish dictionary as needed. Rules of thumb for me with these dictionaries are those that can fit comfortably in my jeans' back pocket and are thinner than 1 inch, contain fewer than 600 pages, and/or bear the word "gem", "mini" or "pocket" in the title. Basically a bilingual dictionary about the size of a traveller's phrasebook or a thinner volume from the Lonely Planet series is out of the running when I'm looking for that first bilingual dictionary as a learner.

Relatively few such dictionaries for my target languages fit the bill in one book, and when it comes to some of my target languages, I've "settled" for inferior dictionaries if I've found that I can complement them with other resources (cf. what I did with Northern Saami).

***

As examples, here are my recommendations for that first bilingual English-[target language]/[target language]-English dictionary

- German
The Oxford-Duden Pocket German Dictionary
Webster's New World German Dictionary: German/English English/German
Collins German Dictionary and Grammar

There's little to choose from all three, although the Collins' one has a handy summary of grammar in case you're too lazy to look up something in your textbook or a dedicated reference guide such as Hammer's German Grammar and Usage whereas the Oxford-Duden one has a nice touch of often showing the nominative plural and/or genitive ending (or respective forms outright if they're irregular) for the noun entries. Inclusiveness is about as good as can be for the size of the dictionary offered including when it comes to showing examples phrases or idioms of frequently-used headwords as well as case governance for verbs and adpositions. It's a given that any German dictionary worth its salt will mark the gender of nouns, the transitivity of a verb and if that verb is reflexive. Regardless of whichever edition of the preceding that a rookie gets, I suggest that he/she should get a dictionary that adheres to the spelling reform of 1996 with the tweaks of 2006 to make life easier even though that reform (tweaks in 2006 and all) is mandatory in schools only. It actually caused the most grief in Austria, Germany and Luxembourg. Standard Swiss German was less affected by the reform.

- Finnish
Suomi-englanti-suomi perussanakirja / Finnish-English and English-Finnish Basic Dictionary

This is the best of a fairly unspectacular lot in English-Finnish/Finnish-English dictionaries of my target size/specifications. On the plus side, it shows case governance of adpositions and many verbs, and frequently-used headwords are displayed with a few translations to English as well as a couple of example sentences. On the downside, it doesn't give any inflectional hints for headwords or have these cross-referenced to charts of inflectional models in the appendix as one can see in the large version of the Finnish-English dictionary. For that kind of information in a hard copy of a dictionary, one would need certain Finnish-Estonian, Finnish-German, Finnish-Hungarian or Finnish-Swedish dictionaries - see the Finnish Profile for suggested titles. Serpent would probably disagree with me on the need for such information in a bilingual dictionary given how predictable Finnish inflection is (albeit not for beginners, perhaps)

- Hungarian
Hungarian-English/English-Hungarian Practical Dictionary

This dictionary is actually small (31,000+ headwords in total per the back cover) but an annoying aspect about Hungarian lexicography for me is that the usual practice is to offer anything larger than a pocket dictionary (max. 25,000 entries; these often also have the Hungarian terms zsebszótár "pocket dictionary" or kisszótár "small dictionary" in the title) in two volumes: one volume led by Hungarian headwords and the second with headwords in the learner's language. The preceding dictionary just barely checks my boxes for a beginner in that it's in one volume, has (barely) enough entries to cover what a beginner could encounter and then a bit more, and indicates case governance of verbs. It also has a short summary of Hungarian grammar including a few conjugation tables. Grammatical gender isn't an issue because Hungarian doesn't have it while using more ink to print out a few case forms or conjugation examples beside the headwords is of dubious value because of how predictable it is. It would be nice however if the dictionary marked inflectional stems beside headwords when they differ from what one might mistakenly conclude based on knowing just the headword (e.g. ég "sky", eg- (inflectional stem)l dolog "thing" dolg- (inflectional stem))

The alternative is for a beginner to get a bilingual dictionary with the Hungarian kéziszótár "concise dictionary" (literally: "hand-dictionary") in the title. This could mean buying the English-Hungarian and then the Hungarian-English volumes. Each volume has about 50,000 entries so getting these are probably more than what a beginner needs although this isn't as much as shelling out for a bilingual comprehensive dictionary or nagyszótár "big dictionary" where each half can contain about 100,000 entries. In all cases, the coverage is predictably wider with any bigger dictionary and the same things apply with case governance shown and example phrases with frequently-used headwords.

To be on the safe side, look for a Hungarian dictionary (kéziszótár) that's published by Akadémiai kiadó "Academic Publisher" and/or edited by at least one of László Kiss, Tamás Magay and László Országh.

- Slavonic languages (excepting Bulgarian and Macedonian)
Because of the noticeable grammatical similarities between most Slavonic languages, I use the same rules of thumb when evaluating that first bilingual dictionary I'd get as a beginner.

i) one volume, both ways between the target and intermediary language.
ii) 75,000 entries (+/- 30,000) and at least a couple of example phrases or idioms for frequently-used headwords
iii) explicit indication of verbal aspect and aspectual counterparts of the headwords that are verbs
iv) indication of conjugational class (ideal if shown via a couple of verb endings in present tense next to the headword)
v) explicit indication of grammatical gender
vi) explicit indication of at least the genitive singular ending for headwords that are nouns - even better if the ending for nominative singular is also shown
vii) explicit indication of headword's irregular forms or stems where necessary
viii)* stress placement on the headword (handy for Belorussian, Russian and Ukrainian)
OR stress placement, vowel length AND pitch-accent marking on the headword (handy for BCMS/SC and Slovenian).

* viii) isn't relevant for Czech, Polish and Slovak since stress is fixed (first syllable in Czech and Slovak, second-last in Polish), there's no pitch-accent, and Czech and Slovak spelling regularly mark vowel length with acute accents while Polish doesn't have vowel length to begin with.

I often use the translations of the following words to see if the dictionary has what I'm looking for (especially important in the section that's led by headwords in the Slavonic language): "to read", "to eat", "book", "street", "man/person"

So for those Slavonic languages that I've had exposure to:

BCMS/SC: čitati, jesti, knjiga, ulica, čov(j)ek
Czech: číst, jist, kniha, ulice, člověk
Polish: czytać, jeść, książka, ulica, człowiek
Russian: читать, есть, книга, улица, человек
Slovak: čítať, jesť, kniha, ulica, človek
Slovenian: brati/čitati, jesti, knijga, ulica, človek
Ukrainian: читати, їсти, книга, вулиця, чоловік

From this, I can strongly recommend the following dictionaries to beginners given how well they satisfy my criteria i)-viii)

- Czech
Anglicko-český a česko-anglický příruční slovník
- Polish
Collins English-Polish/ Polsko-Angielski Dictionary
- Russian
Collins Russian Concise Dictionary

For the other languages, I have yet to find a bilingual dictionary that satisfies i)-viii) just as well, although I can get answers to my questions i) to viii) by consulting Wiktionary or the respective monolingual dictionary of those languages when I can't get answers from the bilingual dictionary.

Using the Collins English-Polish/Polish English compact dictionary as an example, I get the following with relation to i)-viii)
i) one volume, both ways between the target and intermediary language. CHECK
ii) 75,000 entries (+/- 30,000) and at least a couple of example phrases or idioms for frequently-used headwords. CHECK
iii) explicit indication of verbal aspect and aspectual counterparts of the headwords that are verbs CHECK
iv) indication of conjugational class (ideal if shown via a couple of verb endings in present tense next to the headword) CHECK

e.g.
czyt|ać (-am, -asz) (perf prze-) "to read"

Therefore, czytać is imperfective, czytam, czytasz are the 1st and 2nd person singular present tense respectively (use stem vowel a) and przeczytać is the perfective counterpart.

jeść (jem, jesz) (3 pl jedzą, imp jedz pt jadł, jedli, perf z-) "to eat"

Therefore jeść is imperfective, jem, jesz are the 1st and 2nd person singular present tense respectively, jedzą is the irregular 3rd person plural present tense, jedz is the irregular 2nd person singular imperative, jadł, jedli are the L-participles for singular and plural masculine (kind of irregular) and zjeść is the perfective counterpart.

v) explicit indication of grammatical gender CHECK
vi) explicit indication of at least the genitive singular ending for headwords that are nouns - even better if the ending for nominative singular is also shown CHECK
vii) explicit indication of headword's irregular forms or stems where necessary CHECK

e.g.
książ|ka (-ki, -ki) (dat sg -ce, gen pl -ek) f "book"

Therefore książka is książki in both genitive singular and nominative plural, książce is dative singular, książek is genitive plural, and finally feminine.

ulic|a (-y, -e) f "street"

Therefore ulica is ulicy in genitive singular, ulice in nominative plural, and feminine.

człowie|k (-ka, ludzie) (instr sg -kiem, gen pl ludzi, dat pl ludziom, instr pl ludźmi, loc pl ludziach) m "human being"; "man"

Therefore człowiek is człowieka in genitive singular ludzie in nominative plural, człowiekiem in instrumental singular, ludzi in genitive plural, ludziom in dative plural, ludźmi in instrumental plural[/i], ludziach in locative plural, and finally masculine.

viii) stress placement on the headword (handy for Belorussian, Russian and Ukrainian) OR stress placement, vowel length AND pitch-accent marking on the headword (handy for BCMS/SC and Slovenian). N/A

The Czech and Russian dictionaries that I've recommended aren't quite as detailed in i) to vii) as the Polish dictionary but they provide several of these hints systematically and that Russian dictionary marks stress placement even in forms that are in the example phrases of the headword.
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aravinda
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Re: Selecting a Dictionary: L1, L2, L1/L2

Postby aravinda » Fri Jun 09, 2017 7:12 am

Yes, aokoye, I would keep the post.
"word list"
I was referring to the Speakeasy's "a list of fifty-or-more words" he uses in comparing dictionaries. I myself have never used such a list in comparing dictionaries.
"Potatoes" example
I mentioned this because it was fresh in my memory. However, perhaps I was not clear. I did not mean different entries for all plural forms but from L2 language learners perspective, having all irregular forms of words as separate entries is helpful. Again, "potatoes" does not qualify for its own entry because it comes just after "potato" but it needs to be mentioned as the plural because it is a variant of the common method of plural formation in English and there are plurals like "photos" without an added "e". However, a form like "eu" needs to have its own entry under E (and refer back to "avoir") because my hypothetical L2 learner still does not know "eu" is related to "avoir".
Definitions
Here again, perhaps I was not clear. macthulhu expresses this better than me: "Usually the essential range of meanings of a word is all I want; one of my pet peeves is L2-L1 dictionaries that seem to try to pad out definitions with every possible English synonym, when one or two words would have been enough". That's exactly what the Latin teacher (and I) meant. (macthulhu makes some other good points in his post)
Note: I wanted to quote both aokoye & macthulhu in my reply. I know how to quote one member but not how to quote two or more in a single post. Apparently, others do this, so its just my ignorance.
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William Camden
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Languages: English (N), German (fluent), Turkish (fluent), Russian (fluent), French (semi-fluent), Spanish (semi-fluent), am studying Polish, have some knowledge of it, also studying modern Greek, basic knowledge of Arabic (mostly MSA, some exposure to colloquial dialects), basic knowledge of Latin and Italian, beginner in Scottish Gaelic.
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Re: Selecting a Dictionary: L1, L2, L1/L2

Postby William Camden » Fri Jun 09, 2017 2:22 pm

I am partial to pocket dictionaries of the Collins Gem, Langenscheidt, Oxford, Larousse etc. kind. There is only so much you can do linguistically with them - larger dictionaries are necessary, the further you get into a language, but pocket dictionaries are exactly that - you can take them anywhere. And when I am in all-out attack mode on an L2, I do literally take them everywhere, pulling them out at odd moments, like waiting for a bus, drinking coffee in a café etc. Also these dictionaries are good for the basic vocabulary of a language.
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