Takeaways for effective learning

General discussion about learning languages
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Chmury
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Takeaways for effective learning

Postby Chmury » Wed Feb 08, 2023 10:08 pm

I posted this video in my language log yesterday and made some points about it in German, but thought I'd also post it here as everyone can benefit from the work and findings of Andrew Huberman. If you haven't listened to his podcast already and are interested in the science of longevity, health, and optimal mental, physical, and emotional function, check it out. It's a wealth of knowledge.

Key points from the video:

— Learning is like a seesaw. We learn best when we bring as much concentration as possible to the act of learning, and directly after this bout of study, allow our minds to rest.

— We learn in 90 minute cycles. After every cycle, allow yourself to take a break, have a nap, or do some NSDR routine (non sleep deep rest) for 20 to 30 minutes.

— Throughout each 90 minute learning cycle, randomly take 10 second mental breaks in which you let your mind rest. The science shows that this helps people learn more effectively.

— Always try to get a good night's sleep. Long lasting change happens in deep sleep (Acetylcholine — a neurotransmitter — marks potential parts of the brain for change during learning, however it is only during bouts of rest and particularly in deep sleep, when these marked areas undergo change and become more securely stored in the brain).

— Periods of rest are almost as important as the act of learning itself. Think of learning as a two part process. 1. the act of learning. 2. the periods of rest which will allow it to become stored and literally embodied knowledge.

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Hindernisse und Schwierigkeiten sind Stufen, auf denen wir in die Höhe steigen

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noblethings
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Re: Takeaways for effective learning

Postby noblethings » Sun Feb 12, 2023 9:15 pm

I am so happy for the people who learn in 90-minute cycles!

I am not one of them :lol: :lol:
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Re: Takeaways for effective learning

Postby luke » Sun Feb 12, 2023 10:21 pm

noblethings wrote:I am so happy for the people who learn in 90-minute cycles!

I am not one of them :lol: :lol:

This one seemed like it would work even if the cycles were not 90 minutes:
— Throughout each 90 minute learning cycle, randomly take 10 second mental breaks in which you let your mind rest. The science shows that this helps people learn more effectively.
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luke
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Re: Takeaways for effective learning

Postby luke » Sun Feb 12, 2023 10:23 pm

noblethings wrote:I am so happy for the people who learn in 90-minute cycles!

I am not one of them :lol: :lol:

This one seemed like it would work even if the cycles were not 90 minutes:
— Throughout each 90 minute learning cycle, randomly take 10 second mental breaks in which you let your mind rest. The science shows that this helps people learn more effectively.

So I've been using it to take a breath, or stand up, or look at my surroundings. :)
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Re: Takeaways for effective learning

Postby Iversen » Sun Feb 12, 2023 10:29 pm

The 90 minutes cycle is not a pure invention, but I don't think it is important enough to dictate how I structure my study hours. And even if it is that important (against expectation) then I think I would feel it in the form of tiredness or distraction or restlessness. As for taking short pauses - well I already did that. And in the pauses I read Llorg or eat something or look at the birds outside (and then they fly away because birds don't like to be looked at). I have also had an unexpected guest today. As for concentration - ahem well, yes,that's important. But I have studied for several hours today while listening to music of composers from Franz Berwald over Besozzi to Heinrich Franz von Biber, and without that I think I would have become restless and stopped focusing.

By the way, one of the things I discussed with my guest (apart from the construction of crumhorns) was the utility or not of shopping lists. People who have been dubbed experts by the media have a tendency to have rather rigid receipts as how to do things, and using shopping lists when buying food is one of things I have heard recommended by such 'experts'. Personally I think they are idiotic unless you are of the type that can't behave rationally in a supermarket. I look at the things they have on offer in the place I have entered and decide whether they are worth buying (and it's not enough that they are cheaper than usual if I don't need or want them), and that means that I save money on things I still would have bought, but maybe another day. In some cases I have returned home and realized that I should have bought a certain item, but I could also have forgotten to write it on the list. In short, shopping lists means a loss of flexibility, and that's why I mention them here in a thread about study methods.

If I buy minced beef instead of pork in the supermarket because there is an offer on beef then I may have to change my plans for the next dinner, but so what? Sooner or later I'll succeed in buying minced pork plus milk plus an egg, and then I can eat my 'frikadeller'. And it's the same thing with language studies. Maybe I don't feel like studying Greek today, but then I study Bulgarian instead - after all they are neighbours. Or I don't feel like studying the bilingual text I have about Silurian fish in Polish, but then I can maybe study a text about medieval Serbian Kings - or do a wordlist in Russian. And if I only have ten minutes then that may be enough to read an article in a magazine or see whether anybody has written something interesting here. I could also just sit down and think about I could do later on (however sitting down and doing absolutely nothing shouldn't be done excessively - it's addictive), and then I may even feel like getting back to my studies or whatever I was doing.

Having a fixed schedule for what you have to do and when must be exceedingly boring. Keeping enough options open to permit you to be chaotic but getting something done is much more fun - and probably also more efficient.
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Re: Takeaways for effective learning

Postby Le Baron » Sun Feb 12, 2023 11:00 pm

The thing about studying and then taking rest/NSDR is something I've read before and also heard in a video lecture by a languages professor (who happened to be critiquing Krashen). Since then I've followed it and I think it is beneficial. There is a tendency to study and then do some other activity, like casual reading, watching something r whatever, which might even involve some mental exertion, and it's probably the wrong thing.
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Re: Takeaways for effective learning

Postby noblethings » Mon Feb 13, 2023 12:59 am

luke wrote:
noblethings wrote:I am so happy for the people who learn in 90-minute cycles!

I am not one of them :lol: :lol:

This one seemed like it would work even if the cycles were not 90 minutes:
— Throughout each 90 minute learning cycle, randomly take 10 second mental breaks in which you let your mind rest. The science shows that this helps people learn more effectively.

When your mind is resting for 10 seconds, does it mean you are thinking about nothing?
I never, ever think about nothing...
Switching to something relaxing or fun works for me. And 10 seconds won't cut it either. More like, at least 15min?
I guess everytime someone on Youtube or elsewhere comes up with some ultimate technique, there will be many people who won't benefit. Because truly, everyone needs to find what works for them.
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Re: Takeaways for effective learning

Postby mattmo » Sun Mar 05, 2023 11:56 am

A personally feel for effective learning there is no one true or right way of doing it but I know the better your health and fitness in general the more you are able to study well. I think that language learning is a process and is a marathon not a sprint.
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Re: Takeaways for effective learning

Postby Raconteur » Tue Mar 07, 2023 11:20 am

Le Baron wrote:The thing about studying and then taking rest/NSDR is something I've read before and also heard in a video lecture [...] Since then I've followed it and I think it is beneficial. There is a tendency to study and then do some other activity, like casual reading, watching something r whatever, which might even involve some mental exertion, and it's probably the wrong thing.
I second this. I think we need a more precise idea of what is and isn't NSDR according to the science behind these claims (if indeed, there is any). Is casual reading of a book or engaging on LLORG a form of rest that works for this purpose? What about watching the video posted above? Other than meditation, light stretching, or taking a walk alone in some serene place, I cannot think of any other form of rest that applies here.
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Re: Takeaways for effective learning

Postby Picaboo » Tue Mar 07, 2023 7:25 pm

In general, I think the points are all great.

But 90 minutes? There is no such magical number.

It depends on what you're doing. Some activities wear you out faster than others, just like physical activities.

If I read and listen to Korean above my level I wear out very fast. After 20 minutes my brain feels fried.

If I do the same activity with easy material I will never wear out, but I get bored and distracted.

In either case, I need to take a short break. If that break time happens to be at 90 minutes, it would be purely coincidental. (I'm writing this on one such break, btw:))
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