s_allard wrote:French, nonsensical and illogical ? Well, this coming from a speaker of English is rich
Why is it 'rich'? I've already demolished that old, hackneyed claim that English is somehow the most illogical/nonsensical... For people coming from many language backgrounds (Germans especially find French incomprehensible) French clearly feels illogical or nonsensical. I never used to see this quite so much, but after talking to lots of learners and listening to exactly what their complaints are, I see some of these complaints as legit. As rdearman has said more than once there is a lot of inconsistency and exceptions; there is certainly inconsistency in pronunciations and things like elision/liaison, where the claim for its reason is continually contravened. Where is the logic and euphony in something like 'en haut' where he 'n' is dropped and two vowel sounds clash? Or something like 'n expletif', which is fine if you just heard it used and copied it, but as a learner it probably looks nonsensical. That's just a tiny tip of an iceberg. In contrast to this the teachers of French and the materials I've seen (Bescherelle etc) live in a fantasy world where everything works like logical clockwork.
It needs to be seen from the point of the learner. Also the myth of 'chaotic English' needs putting to bed.