Luxembourgish anyone?

[PeterMollenburg]

Is French spoken natively anywhere in Luxembourg? Or is it a case of the population having a good knowledge of the language due to trade and cultural links with France?

Not sure this helps...
12% speak French as their main (native?) language. I'd imagine there'd be a higher proportion of French spaekers in the south next to the French border as well as a good number in the capital ahead of German speakers (as their main language). Although Luxembourgish, French and German all have official status it seems Luxembourgish is mainly used as a spoken language well ahead of sll other languages. French and German hold seemingly equal status in education, media, politics etc, but its not balanced in all these individual areas. One will usually be more prevalent in a certain period of schooling or just in politics or law for example than the other.

[William Camden]

Walloon used to be spoken in at least some parts of Luxembourg, as in neighbouring Belgium, but died out, displaced by the essentially Germanic Luxembourgish as a spoken language. French long seems to have had a status of official language but I don't know whether this meant it was a natural native language for anybody.

[lorinth]

I confirm what William Camden wrote about Walloon in Luxembourg. The small area is that of the villages of Doncols and Sonlez. They were studied by Atten in 1980. The study with a glossary is available online here.

Conversely, there's a significantly bigger border area in Wallonia where Luxembourgish is spoken (see the blue area on the linguistic map of Wallonia available here).

As for French in Luxembourg, I have yet to meet a Luxembourgish citizen who doesn't speak perfect French... To quote the French Wikipedia:

Le français est la langue législative et judiciaire. Il est utilisé par l'administration et la justice concurremment avec l'allemand ; le français reste la seule langue pour la rédaction des lois. Les panneaux de circulation sont généralement en français.

All three languages are used in the education system: Luxembourg in kindergarten, and French and German starting at the primary school level. Maybe a Luxembourger can give more specific details.

[William Camden]

Based on personal observation, French predominates at the official level in Luxembourg. It tends to be the language of official notices, traffic signs and so on.
The American war photographer Lee Miller passed through the area in 1944-5. Able to speak French herself, she was impressed by the language aptitude of Luxembourgers.

[PeterMollenburg]

As I seem to chase my tail, or history has a habit of repeating itself, i've come full circle (perhaps enough time has passed for the interest to seem new again) and have been exploring Luxembourgish again. I don't have much to share, just wanted to simply say i've been at it again (wanderlust) and am curious about this language and in particular the small country in which multilingualism thrives- that is truly exciting. In fact if it wasn't for the fact that their wages are the highest in the world for nurses and that the practically all the population their are multilingual I probably wouldn't find much interest in the place for me personally. Ah, if only i could land a well paying job there. Then it really would make a LOT of sense to be multilingual (from a practical standpoint). I even ventured off to the Assimil and Amazon websites to explore a little and I had a listen to a sample recording from the Assimil luxembourgois offer (30 lecons) on the amazon site. Having experience with Dutch and French more than German I can say with certainty that the descriptions given in this thread and in other places certainly ring true upon listening to the languages- it definitely sounds very German to my ear with sprinklings of French. Dutch (naturally) does not come to mind at all with regards to the sounds of the language, except for the fact that the language is Germanic and so the structures and cognates might ressemble Dutch at times, but definitely don't automatically conjure up Dutch sentiments. A quirky little language it seems Luxembourgish is, yet unfortunately not enough resources for my liking. Thinking back to EU23's mission of learning the languages of the European Union, in some ways I find it odd that this language is not one of the languages of the European Union, yet given the ease to which it's citizens can function in other larger European languages it also is seemingly not a big deal. Still despite the lack of learning resources, that's not to say i'd never study it, i'm just very used to be being extremely spoiled with the number of resources in the languages I've studied up to this point.

Now, onto my next wanderlust session staying up late and reading about... back to Norwegian perhaps... shall I?

[allhandsondex]

Thinking back to EU23's mission of learning the languages of the European Union, in some ways I find it odd that this language is not one of the languages of the European Union, yet given the ease to which it's citizens can function in other larger European languages it also is seemingly not a big deal.

It's probably because Luxembourg joined the EU - or, rather, the Coal and Steel Community - long before Luxembourgish was even standardised, let alone made official. While countries can change their first language with the institutions (Malta has done so and now there are Maltese booths in some meetings, Ireland added Irish with a derogation that meant not everything would have to be available in Irish but the derogation came up for renewal recently and Ireland opted to make Irish a full working language, so presumably now some interpreters with active Irish will need to be found...) I would imagine the Luxembourg government would view it as an unnecessary expensive hassle and a logistical nightmare. I know SCIC does have at least one interpreter who is accredited to interpret Luxembourgish (among a few others) into French, so if someone were really insistent in certain meetings it probably could be provided for.

[Jar-Ptitsa]

Not all the Luxemburgers can speak native French, but they speak it very well for sure. Their Luxenburgian language is hilarious, I love it. It's even more hilarious than Dutch, and that is difficult because Dutch is ridiculous. but Dutch is much uglier, Luxemburgian is just funny, it's basically a German dialect.

Luxemburgers are extremely wealthy, I can imagine that their nurses are the highest paid in the world. They don't pay tax, or there's something like this because in Wallonia some people have a luxemburgian car because of the tax.

[Jar-Ptitsa]

Here's a dictionary for Luxemburgisch to french or german, or vice versa.

http://dict.luxdico.com/deu/

[Kazumi]

I haven't seen this topic here, perhaps due to the fact I was wandering around the world.

I’ve actively studied Luxembourgish in Luxembourg and before going there. I’ve used some of the most common textbooks available and also more linguistics-related books as well. I will leave here some of the references I remember by memory now, aside from the ones from the first video below.

Just take a look on how Luxembourg sounds.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wN76InEVmQ

From minute 3:58 onwards, you might see some of the references available in the language. I’ve all of them, but they are in another country. I can’t take a look on them. If one day I go back home, I will edit this and add some additional information.

Another resource for those who are curious, other than the Youtube videos:
http://www.vdl.lu/Culture+et+Loisirs/Cours+organis%C3%A9s+par+la+Ville/L%C3%ABtzebuergesch+l%C3%A9iere+mat+MP3+_+Fichiers+audio.html


On Luxembourgish resources:

Lëtzebuergesch fir all Dag. Book 1 Exercises

Lëtzebuergesch fir all Dag. Book 2 Exercises

Lëtzebuergesch Léiere Mat

http://www.quattropole.org/en/e_learning
If you are into online stuff, you might give it a try. It was working some time ago and the registration is for free. For further information, send them an e-mail.

On grammar

In French

Grammaire de la langue luxembourgeoise. Luxembourg, Ministère de l'Éducation nationale et de la Formation professionnelle 2005 by BRAUN, Josy.
1,2,3 Lëtzebuergesch Grammaire by SCHANEN, François / ZIMMER, Jacqui.
Lëtzebuergesch Grammaire luxembourgeoise. En un volume. Esch-sur-Alzette, éditions Schortgen, 2012 by SCHANEN, François / ZIMMER, Jacqui.

I used resources explained in German and they were pretty accurate. I can't recall their names or authors, unfortunately.

Dictionaries:

http://www.lod.lu/index.html
http://www.dico.lu/
Luxdico Deutsch: Luxemburgisch ↔ Deutsches Wörterbuch, Luxemburg (Éditions Schortgen) 2008 by WELSCHBILLIG Myriam, SCHANEN François, Jérôme Lulling. (In German).
Klengen Dictionnaire Franséisch-Lëtzebuergesch
http://dict.luxdico.com/deu/
http://www.freelang.com/enligne/luxembourgeois.php

Additional resources for “reading”:

1. Luxembourg and Lëtzebuergesch: Language and Communication at the Crossroads of Europe 1st Edition
This is a book written in English and more designed for linguists. It has some interesting thoughts on historical linguistics or dialectology. It might too dry for those who are not into the field, but I will leave here for others who might be interested in.
2. Lëtzebuergesch Sproocherubriken. Esch-sur-Alzette, éditions Schortgen, 2013 by SCHANEN, François. (in Luxembourgish).
3. http://orbilu.uni.lu/bitstream/10993/1143/1/Illustrations_Luxembourgish%20-%2017%20-%20revised%20version%20after%202nd%20revision%20-%20mit%20Bilder.pdf
4. http://www.cpll.lu/ortho/intro_ortho.html
5. Jérôme Lulling is a linguist from Luxembourg who is (was) working on the preservation of Luxembourgish. Therefore, most of his works were very interesting to me. You might check the external links on here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J%C3%A9r%C3%B4me_Lulling
6. Gerald Newton is another linguist (professor of Germanic linguistics and Luxembourgish) who has published an amount of articles about Luxembourgish.

Others
1. http://www.insl.lu/Francais/page5/p5frame.htm
On this website you can see what the test to become a citizen of Luxembourg is like. If the law hasn’t changed, one need at least A2 level to take the test, among other non-linguistic requirements.
2. http://www.luxembourg.public.lu/en/le-grand-duche-se-presente/langues/letzebuergesch/index.html

When I was in Luxembourg, I could converse in both French and German, but the former was much more used than the former one by local people. I used German to talk to my friends as it was (and still is) my “strongest” language, even though they were sometimes speaking to me in French. I feel more comfortable speaking in German.

I was introduced to my friend’s grandmother who spoke to me in Luxembourg, but I was answering her in German and it was okay. I could guess almost everything, perhaps because I already know some features (spoken by Luxembourgian native speakers) that are too obvious to understand by the context. It is an interesting language as well as the Swiss German or the dialects spoken in Germany such as the Bavarian one...

If one day I go back home, I will add here some information on grammar and resources I used.

To the original comment, there are much more Norwegian resources than Lëtzebuergesch. I started with Norwegian, but I'm considering switching to Swedish for personal purposes.

[PeterMollenburg]

I haven't seen this topic here, perhaps due to the fact I was wandering around the world.

I’ve actively studied Luxembourgish in Luxembourg and before going there. I’ve used some of the most common textbooks available and also more linguistics-related books as well. I will leave here some of the references I remember by memory now, aside from the ones from the first video below.

Just take a look on how Luxembourg sounds.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wN76InEVmQ

From minute 3:58 onwards, you might see some of the references available in the language. I’ve all of them, but they are in another country. I can’t take a look on them. If one day I go back home, I will edit this and add some additional information.

Another resource for those who are curious, other than the Youtube videos:
http://www.vdl.lu/Culture+et+Loisirs/Cours+organis%C3%A9s+par+la+Ville/L%C3%ABtzebuergesch+l%C3%A9iere+mat+MP3+_+Fichiers+audio.html


On Luxembourgish resources:

Lëtzebuergesch fir all Dag. Book 1 Exercises

Lëtzebuergesch fir all Dag. Book 2 Exercises

Lëtzebuergesch Léiere Mat

http://www.quattropole.org/en/e_learning
If you are into online stuff, you might give it a try. It was working some time ago and the registration is for free. For further information, send them an e-mail.

On grammar

In French

Grammaire de la langue luxembourgeoise. Luxembourg, Ministère de l'Éducation nationale et de la Formation professionnelle 2005 by BRAUN, Josy.
1,2,3 Lëtzebuergesch Grammaire by SCHANEN, François / ZIMMER, Jacqui.
Lëtzebuergesch Grammaire luxembourgeoise. En un volume. Esch-sur-Alzette, éditions Schortgen, 2012 by SCHANEN, François / ZIMMER, Jacqui.

I used resources explained in German and they were pretty accurate. I can't recall their names or authors, unfortunately.

Dictionaries:

http://www.lod.lu/index.html
http://www.dico.lu/
Luxdico Deutsch: Luxemburgisch ↔ Deutsches Wörterbuch, Luxemburg (Éditions Schortgen) 2008 by WELSCHBILLIG Myriam, SCHANEN François, Jérôme Lulling. (In German).
Klengen Dictionnaire Franséisch-Lëtzebuergesch
http://dict.luxdico.com/deu/
http://www.freelang.com/enligne/luxembourgeois.php

Additional resources for “reading”:

1. Luxembourg and Lëtzebuergesch: Language and Communication at the Crossroads of Europe 1st Edition
This is a book written in English and more designed for linguists. It has some interesting thoughts on historical linguistics or dialectology. It might too dry for those who are not into the field, but I will leave here for others who might be interested in.
2. Lëtzebuergesch Sproocherubriken. Esch-sur-Alzette, éditions Schortgen, 2013 by SCHANEN, François. (in Luxembourgish).
3. http://orbilu.uni.lu/bitstream/10993/1143/1/Illustrations_Luxembourgish%20-%2017%20-%20revised%20version%20after%202nd%20revision%20-%20mit%20Bilder.pdf
4. http://www.cpll.lu/ortho/intro_ortho.html
5. Jérôme Lulling is a linguist from Luxembourg who is (was) working on the preservation of Luxembourgish. Therefore, most of his works were very interesting to me. You might check the external links on here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J%C3%A9r%C3%B4me_Lulling
6. Gerald Newton is another linguist (professor of Germanic linguistics and Luxembourgish) who has published an amount of articles about Luxembourgish.

Others
1. http://www.insl.lu/Francais/page5/p5frame.htm
On this website you can see what the test to become a citizen of Luxembourg is like. If the law hasn’t changed, one need at least A2 level to take the test, among other non-linguistic requirements.
2. http://www.luxembourg.public.lu/en/le-grand-duche-se-presente/langues/letzebuergesch/index.html

When I was in Luxembourg, I could converse in both French and German, but the former was much more used than the former one by local people. I used German to talk to my friends as it was (and still is) my “strongest” language, even though they were sometimes speaking to me in French. I feel more comfortable speaking in German.

I was introduced to my friend’s grandmother who spoke to me in Luxembourg, but I was answering her in German and it was okay. I could guess almost everything, perhaps because I already know some features (spoken by Luxembourgian native speakers) that are too obvious to understand by the context. It is an interesting language as well as the Swiss German or the dialects spoken in Germany such as the Bavarian one...

If one day I go back home, I will add here some information on grammar and resources I used.

To the original comment, there are much more Norwegian resources than Lëtzebuergesch. I started with Norwegian, but I'm considering switching to Swedish for personal purposes.

Thank you for your in depth reply kazumi. If you have the time to respond I'd like to ask some questions- How advanced did you become in Luxembourgish and did you stop at a certain level due to a lack of resources? What is your level of German and French like? I think you were saying that French is more commonly spoken there? (you said 'former' and 'former' again so it wasn't 100% clear which language was more prevalent in your experience). How long were you in Luxembourg for and did you like living there? Is it expensive?

And thank you for the resources! It's only fitting that they be posted here.