Rusty English

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nina250
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Rusty English

Postby nina250 » Sat Jul 24, 2021 11:03 am

Hi!

Over the past few years, since I haven't been studying English, it's gotten quite rusty. I'm able to communicate fluently and be understood, as you can see, but the problem is I'm not quite skilled at grammar. I'm somewhat able to apply grammatical rules, but I absolutely can't remember how the rule goes, nor could I ever explain it to someone else.

So, my question is, what's the best way to brush up on grammar a bit? I hate In Use series, so would Destination C1-C2 do the job? Since I'd like to take the CAE exam (at first I aimed at CPE, but when I realised how rusty I actually am, I backed off) should I go straight to the Objective Advanced? Would that be sufficient?

One more question. Am I making a mistake by choosing CAE over CPE?

Thank you in advance for any help given!
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luke
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Re: Rusty English

Postby luke » Sat Jul 24, 2021 12:01 pm

You're already C1, which is why it's not easy to find errors in your posts. I can hear an English accent in your writing. :)

I'm curious why you think grammar would be more helpful than say, reading and writing.

Your English appears to be at such a high level that perhaps writing and informally publishing (posting to a forum like this one) might be helpful for practice, especially if you invite feedback. There are more specialized forums for getting written feedback from natives and you probably already know more about that than I do.

I saw in someone's signature here that they invited corrections. If you were to do longer posts, there's more opportunity for a pattern of weakness to appear. That would be the point, in my humble opinion to determine whether it's grammar (I don't understand the rule) or habit (I know the rule but don't have enough practice using it correctly).

The other thing I think of are those informal video language exchange sites. There, if one had the right partner, they might give you useful feedback. By "right partner", I mean someone who listens for either the biggest or "easiest to fix" challenges they notice in your communication skills. A tutor could do that too, but good tutors are probably hard to find and expensive for someone as advanced as you are.
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rdearman
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Re: Rusty English

Postby rdearman » Sat Jul 24, 2021 12:32 pm

Having only learned English via parents and environment I can't help you with the exam. However, when I have questions about English grammar I refer to either:

The new Fowler's modern English usage: ISBN: 0-19-860263-4

Or

New Hart's Rules: ISBN: 978-0-19-861041-0
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nina250
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Re: Rusty English

Postby nina250 » Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:10 pm

luke wrote:You're already C1, which is why it's not easy to find errors in your posts. I can hear an English accent in your writing. :)

I'm curious why you think grammar would be more helpful than say, reading and writing.

Your English appears to be at such a high level that perhaps writing and informally publishing (posting to a forum like this one) might be helpful for practice, especially if you invite feedback. There are more specialized forums for getting written feedback from natives and you probably already know more about that than I do.

I saw in someone's signature here that they invited corrections. If you were to do longer posts, there's more opportunity for a pattern of weakness to appear. That would be the point, in my humble opinion to determine whether it's grammar (I don't understand the rule) or habit (I know the rule but don't have enough practice using it correctly).

The other thing I think of are those informal video language exchange sites. There, if one had the right partner, they might give you useful feedback. By "right partner", I mean someone who listens for either the biggest or "easiest to fix" challenges they notice in your communication skills. A tutor could do that too, but good tutors are probably hard to find and expensive for someone as advanced as you are.


Thank you! Your kind words really meant a lot to me. I don't think grammar is more helpful. I get a lot of reading and writing from the internet while reading articles and forums and participating in discussions. I guess I'm worried because I haven't intentionally practised grammar in a really long time. English turned into a thing I'm doing intuitively. Perhaps that's not too bad after all.
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elka
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Re: Rusty English

Postby elka » Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:52 pm

I’d say go for the CPE. In youtube videos I watched people say that the CPE is very advanced and takes many many years but the truth is, it is only a test. Obviously, you will need to improve several aspects of your English, but the mindset shift from “CPE is so hard” to “CPE is merely a test with set structure that I can prepare for” is what needs to happen first.
Destination C1 is a good book and can fill the gaps in your grammar. However, I believe that the best thing you can do to pass such an examination is to read or listen (ideally both) to something you find very challenging every day. I personally got stuck for a bit at one point because I was constantly listening to the same podcasts and I was watching youtube videos about the same topics but then I challenged myself with classical fiction and I read studies on brain performance on a regular basis and I was able to overcome that plateau.
I would also recommend to try as many practice tests in one sitting in the right order as you possibly can. This trumps any preparational material. I would also suggest buying ebooks on amazon with different exercises that are in the Use of English part :)
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nina250
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Re: Rusty English

Postby nina250 » Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:56 pm

elka wrote:I’d say go for the CPE. In youtube videos I watched people say that the CPE is very advanced and takes many many years but the truth is, it is only a test. Obviously, you will need to improve several aspects of your English, but the mindset shift from “CPE is so hard” to “CPE is merely a test with set structure that I can prepare for” is what needs to happen first.
Destination C1 is a good book and can fill the gaps in your grammar. However, I believe that the best thing you can do to pass such an examination is to read or listen (ideally both) to something you find very challenging every day. I personally got stuck for a bit at one point because I was constantly listening to the same podcasts and I was watching youtube videos about the same topics but then I challenged myself with classical fiction and I read studies on brain performance on a regular basis and I was able to overcome that plateau.
I would also recommend to try as many practice tests in one sitting in the right order as you possibly can. This trumps any preparational material. I would also suggest buying ebooks on amazon with different exercises that are in the Use of English part :)


Thanks! I'll go through the Destination book first, then I'll do a few practice exams and based on that I'll pick the most suitable exam.
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einzelne
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Re: Rusty English

Postby einzelne » Sat Jul 24, 2021 7:33 pm

I know nothing about the exams you mentioned but generally language exams don't test your knowledge of grammar rules but your skills, namely, speaking, writing, listening, and reading. If you can do all this comfortably but somehow 'forgot' grammar rules, you shouldn't be worried at all. Actually, it's a good sign. It means that you internalized language patterns to the point that you no longer need to 'know' explicit grammar rules.

For non-native English speakers, I think, Swan's Practical English Usage is a good grammar book but you don't need to read it like a text book. Take a mock exam to spot gaps in your English grammar and then read the relevant grammar explanations. You can go through the table of content and read relevant chapters as well. I hope it helps.

Good luck with your exam!
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nina250
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Re: Rusty English

Postby nina250 » Sun Jul 25, 2021 10:11 am

einzelne wrote:I know nothing about the exams you mentioned but generally language exams don't test your knowledge of grammar rules but your skills, namely, speaking, writing, listening, and reading. If you can do all this comfortably but somehow 'forgot' grammar rules, you shouldn't be worried at all. Actually, it's a good sign. It means that you internalized language patterns to the point that you no longer need to 'know' explicit grammar rules.

For non-native English speakers, I think, Swan's Practical English Usage is a good grammar book but you don't need to read it like a text book. Take a mock exam to spot gaps in your English grammar and then read the relevant grammar explanations. You can go through the table of content and read relevant chapters as well. I hope it helps.

Good luck with your exam!


Thank you! Of course it helps. When I think about it better, I guess it is a good thing I got so used to English, I'm not even thinking about rules and structures anymore.
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